The meaning of "Christmas"

[merithyn]

That's what I find ridiculous. I'm not saying you need to go to Church for the Christmas season, put up a nativity scene, convert to Christianity or any of that. But maybe someone a bit more provincial than me has never really experienced a lot of different cultures doesn't understand how to go with the flow, having lived overseas quite a bit growing up I have taken part in lots of cultural activities and festivals that are not practiced here in America. The saying "when in Rome..." is just common sense. I'm not saying you need to decorate, need to put up a tree, need to even exchange gifts or do anything to even recognize Christmas. I'm just saying it's a little unreasonable to be annoyed at a cultural tradition. Would you prefer there were no cultural traditions at all?

You obviously didn't read what I wrote further up the thread. The whole reason behind this thread was the idea that because I DO celebrate in a somewhat similar fashion, a friend told me that I HAD to say that I celebrated Christmas, even though I don't consider it so because I'm not Christian, I don't believe in the nativity, and I despise the crass commercialization of the "Christmas gift-giving season".

[crazy canuck]

You're honestly horrible to discuss anything with.

Pot meet Kettle

There are tons of countries in Europe for example with high majority officially Christian populations. Most social scientists will differentiate between areas like that, and say, the U.S. bible belt by looking at "annual church visits" and etc. A place that is 80% "Christian" but where 90% of the people attend Church once a year isn't really that religious.

And your point is what exactly?  I dont think Cal is saying he lives in an area where 90% of the people go to church only once per year -  do you.

For that matter if Meri lived in such an area why the heck are they so uppity about demanding people celebrate Christmas. 

[merithyn]

What I'm suggesting is someone get over themselves if their complaint is "I find it annoying that in America it feels like I am being pressured to participate in the cultural traditions." Especially when it's just mild social pressure. Like I said, every culture has traditions, and when it's not anything harmful I see no reason why someone can't just make peace with that, even if they aren't a fan of that particular tradition.

The problem is that there are a myriad of winter traditions in the US, and forcing a particular one on any one is, to my mind, assinine.

[Barrister]

What I'm suggesting is someone get over themselves if their complaint is "I find it annoying that in America it feels like I am being pressured to participate in the cultural traditions." Especially when it's just mild social pressure. Like I said, every culture has traditions, and when it's not anything harmful I see no reason why someone can't just make peace with that, even if they aren't a fan of that particular tradition.

The problem is that there are a myriad of winter traditions in the US, and forcing a particular one on any one is, to my mind, assinine.

Except there aren't.  There's just Christmas, which is celebrated in a myriad of different ways.

[Ed Anger]

I hate everybody.

[Valmy]

 

Now that I know you are going to be attending midnight services on Christmas Eve I am sort of baffled how you do not celebrate Christmas.  I mean I celebrate Ramadan every year and that involves me showing up one night at the Turkish Cultural center and being non-alcoholically wined and dined.

[derspiess]

The problem is that there are a myriad of winter traditions in the US

[merithyn]

Except there aren't.  There's just Christmas, which is celebrated in a myriad of different ways.

Yule
Winter Solstice
Hanukkah
Kwanzaa
Sadeh
Diwali

(I went to a UU service, and these were the ones that they celebrated alongside Christmas, as at least one person in the congregation celebrated one of these.)

[OttoVonBismarck]

But yeah, the Buddhist couple I know are a good example of how I think you should adapt to a new culture. They still teach their kid their native language, they aren't converting to Christianity, they still mostly cook their culture's dishes and still practice all their cultural traditions. But they also don't get butt hurt over the mild social emphasis on Christmas.

[OttoVonBismarck]

They also don't bring up punch lines like Kwanzaa or Yule or some other tradition that has about as much cultural relevance in the US as Boxing Day or Guy Fawkes Day.

[merithyn]

Now that I know you are going to be attending midnight services on Christmas Eve I am sort of baffled how you do not celebrate Christmas.  I mean I celebrate Ramadan every year and that involves me showing up one night at the Turkish Cultural center and being non-alcoholically wined and dined.

I don't go every year. I was invited by a friend to go this year, so I am.

[merithyn]

But yeah, the Buddhist couple I know are a good example of how I think you should adapt to a new culture. They still teach their kid their native language, they aren't converting to Christianity, they still mostly cook their culture's dishes and still practice all their cultural traditions. But they also don't get butt hurt over the mild social emphasis on Christmas.

So you're going to completely ignore that I'm not "butt hurt over the mild social emphasis on Christmas", are you? Okay. So now I know to completely ignore your posts in this thread.

And it's kind of ridiculous to claim that it's a "mild" social emphasis, too. That's like saying that a hurricane is a mild rain.

[merithyn]

They also don't bring up punch lines like Kwanzaa or Yule or some other tradition that has about as much cultural relevance in the US as Boxing Day or Guy Fawkes Day.

Um, Kwanzaa was created by an American for African-Americans. To claim that it has no cultural relevance is kind of stupid. And Yule has been adopted by Neo-Pagans as their celebration.

[derspiess]

Otto's on fire! 

[Barrister]

Except there aren't.  There's just Christmas, which is celebrated in a myriad of different ways.

Yule
Winter Solstice
Hanukkah
Kwanzaa
Sadeh
Diwali

(I went to a UU service, and these were the ones that they celebrated alongside Christmas, as at least one person in the congregation celebrated one of these.)

Diwali was over in mid November.  The fact that you have to mention the Zoroastrian holiday of Sadeh shows how far you are reaching on this one.

I have no doubt if you hunt hard enough you can find someone who celebrates Yule, but not Christmas, or a pagan Winter Solstice, or even the made-up holiday of Kwanzaa.  But this are fringe beyond fringe.  There really is just Christmas, with Hanukkah coming an incredibly distant second.