Our pussification continues or why some of the greatest men were assholes

[grumbler]

You generally want to fire people in private, though.  Only utter dicks needlessly humiliate people in public, and public humiliation is right there at the top of the methods one would use to create a determined and motivated enemy for life.

I agree that it is generally better to fire people in private.  Sometimes, though, it is not.  This could well have been one of those times.

I don't say it definitely was, which is why I worded my statement as "that's the way businesses work sometimes."  You could argue his tactic failed, because MobileMe was a failure, but I don't see the argument that his tactic was domed to failure and so just an unnecessary "jerk move."

If you want to make an argument about MobileMe, it would probably be better-centered as an argument against Jobs's "greatness" (because it was a flop) not against his "greatness" (because he fired the guy in charge in public).  Absolute accountability is supposed to be Apple's strength as a business.

[Grey Fox]

I like this new, pissed off at everyone, Martinus.

[crazy canuck]

I read recently an article which claimed that Steve Jobs's "greatness" is questionable because he was a "bully". That's fucking retarded.

You should wait for the movie.

[The Brain]

I read recently an article which claimed that Steve Jobs's "greatness" is questionable because he was a "bully". That's fucking retarded.

I agree that reading any article about Jobs is retarded.

[grumbler]

I agree that reading any article about Jobs is retarded.

Isn't he still dead?

[Barrister]

Jobs is an interesting dude.  I think I have to pick up that biography.

I mean - he was successful like almost nobody else in business.  Some CEOs have had a good run - he had at least three.

But then again - he was a jerk.  He was a real asshole of a boss.  No doubts about that.

But that being said - he never really hid that much either.

And - it's not like he had any other vices.  He wasn't a womanizer.  He didn't gamble.  He didn't abuse people for the fun of it.  He was just an OCD perfectionist.

I admire the guy even though I don't think I like the guy.  But he sure was fascinating.

[grumbler]

But he sure was fascinating.

Agree on that.  I think his strongest ability was that he knew what not to do; what wasn't worth the time, effort, and diffusion of focus.  It takes a strong will to resist the temptation to hedge bets, and he had that in spades.  That will also probably accounts for a lot of his "jerk" moves (not all of which I think were that "jerkish."

But he also was petty.  That's a lot harder to forgive.

[Barrister]

But he sure was fascinating.

Agree on that.  I think his strongest ability was that he knew what not to do; what wasn't worth the time, effort, and diffusion of focus.  It takes a strong will to resist the temptation to hedge bets, and he had that in spades.  That will also probably accounts for a lot of his "jerk" moves (not all of which I think were that "jerkish."

But he also was petty.  That's a lot harder to forgive.

What is hard to forgive is how he treated his first daughter Lisa.  That was more than petty.

[ulmont]

But he sure was fascinating.

Agree on that.  I think his strongest ability was that he knew what not to do; what wasn't worth the time, effort, and diffusion of focus.  It takes a strong will to resist the temptation to hedge bets, and he had that in spades.  That will also probably accounts for a lot of his "jerk" moves (not all of which I think were that "jerkish."

But he also was petty.  That's a lot harder to forgive.

What is hard to forgive is how he treated his first daughter Lisa.  That was more than petty.

Ripping off Wozniak was pretty bad too.

[Barrister]

But he sure was fascinating.

Agree on that.  I think his strongest ability was that he knew what not to do; what wasn't worth the time, effort, and diffusion of focus.  It takes a strong will to resist the temptation to hedge bets, and he had that in spades.  That will also probably accounts for a lot of his "jerk" moves (not all of which I think were that "jerkish."

But he also was petty.  That's a lot harder to forgive.

What is hard to forgive is how he treated his first daughter Lisa.  That was more than petty.

Ripping off Wozniak was pretty bad too.

Meh.  Woz had a brain injury from an auto accident.  While that was a tragedy, it's completely understandable why he was shut out of Apple.

[ulmont]

But he sure was fascinating.

Agree on that.  I think his strongest ability was that he knew what not to do; what wasn't worth the time, effort, and diffusion of focus.  It takes a strong will to resist the temptation to hedge bets, and he had that in spades.  That will also probably accounts for a lot of his "jerk" moves (not all of which I think were that "jerkish."

But he also was petty.  That's a lot harder to forgive.

What is hard to forgive is how he treated his first daughter Lisa.  That was more than petty.

Ripping off Wozniak was pretty bad too.

Meh.  Woz had a brain injury from an auto accident.  While that was a tragedy, it's completely understandable why he was shut out of Apple.

Not the one I mean.  Much earlier:

Jobs returned to Atari [1974-ish] and was assigned to create a circuit board for the game Breakout. According to Atari co-founder Nolan Bushnell, Atari offered $100 for each chip that was eliminated in the machine. Jobs had little interest in or knowledge of circuit board design and made a deal with Wozniak to split the bonus evenly between them if Wozniak could minimize the number of chips. Much to the amazement of Atari, Wozniak reduced the number of chips by 50, a design so tight that it was impossible to reproduce on an assembly line. According to Wozniak, Jobs told Wozniak that Atari gave them only $700 (instead of the offered $5,000) and that Wozniak's share was thus $350.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Jobs#cite_ref-breakout_28-0
http://web.archive.org/web/20110612071502/http://www.woz.org/letters/general/91.html

[Martinus]

 

What an asshole.

But again, my claim is that no matter what you think about Steve Jobs in terms of his greatness, his personality should not enter the picture at all. Noone cares if Leonardo da Vinci was a histrionic sugar daddy to urchins or that Isaak Newton was a petty asshole who feuded most of his life with Leibnitz.

[Eddie Teach]

Lamenting about the pussification of society might have more credibility if the source wasn't people's bitching about an Apple executive. Cause you know, Macs -> hipster -> wuss. This causation chain will be proven irrevocably when BB starts arguing for legalization of medical marijuana. 

[Tamas]

What an asshole.

But again, my claim is that no matter what you think about Steve Jobs in terms of his greatness, his personality should not enter the picture at all. Noone cares if Leonardo da Vinci was a histrionic sugar daddy to urchins or that Isaak Newton was a petty asshole who feuded most of his life with Leibnitz.

See, this is the problem right there. Da Vinci? Newton? Being compared to Jobs?

Jobs was an exceptionally successful BUSINESSMAN.  He knew how to package gadgets and monopolized the market of luxury tech devices on the virtue of arriving there first. I respect his succes, but if we raise him to godhood, what about Rockefeller, the old Murdoch, Gates, Hilton, Ford etc?

[Martinus]

What an asshole.

But again, my claim is that no matter what you think about Steve Jobs in terms of his greatness, his personality should not enter the picture at all. Noone cares if Leonardo da Vinci was a histrionic sugar daddy to urchins or that Isaak Newton was a petty asshole who feuded most of his life with Leibnitz.

See, this is the problem right there. Da Vinci? Newton? Being compared to Jobs?

Jobs was an exceptionally successful BUSINESSMAN.  He knew how to package gadgets and monopolized the market of luxury tech devices on the virtue of arriving there first. I respect his succes, but if we raise him to godhood, what about Rockefeller, the old Murdoch, Gates, Hilton, Ford etc?

Can you read? I expressly put there a caveat "no matter what you think of Steve Jobs", so some idiot does not come up with a counter like that.