Hey X-gen bosses - How do you deal with Y-ers?

[Martinus]

So, a lot of people on Languish are "generation X" people, and a lot of you hold mid or high management positions in your companies, corporations, firms and whatnot.

How the fuck do you deal with Y-ers? Or is the difference not as pronounced as in Poland (where X-geners were very hard working and Y-geners are fucking lazy freeloaders).

[Monoriu]

In my experience, every generation thinks that they are hardworking, and that the generation after them are lazy, rebellious, etc.  When I was a kid, my teachers, bosses, parents all said that it was very difficult to deal with generation Xs. 

[Monoriu]

Speaking as an underling, I would appreciate good instructions from my bosses.  It is actually pretty tough to give good instructions, and a lot of people just can't do that.  Because very often the bosses are themselves given conflicting instructions, or have no idea what is going on.  So they just summon their underlings and throw a tantrum.  When the underlings fail, the bosses attempt to pass on responsibility.  Giving good instructions requires that the bosses at least understand the objectives of the task themselves before they can pass this onto the underlings.

Secondly, the bosses should avoid pretending to know how to solve the problem if they have no idea.  Assume that the bosses know that the objective is to reach Town A.  There is a tendency/temptation for bosses to give detailed instructions on HOW to do so.  It takes tremendous courage and self-confidence for bosses to admit that actually they have no idea how to reach Town A, and that the underlings should figure out how to do so themselves.  What often happens is that the bosses insist in taking Highway B, when in fact Highway B is blocked or mined.  When the underlings report that the entire division has been blown up on Highway B, the bosses accuse them of freeloading.  Good instructions should set out the objective clearly, but allow discretion and freedom for underlings to adopt the best solution during implementation.  Very often the bosses think this is implied - it isn't, nobody is going to take Highway C if you explicitly state that Highway B must be taken. 

[Slargos]

While I understand Mono's generalisation on the issue, the problem with Gen Y is very real here in Norway. They are the first generation that has grown up in real general affluence after the oil-adventure started in the 70s.

In my experience (and to be fair, I've mostly dealt with people who are just 4-5 years younger than me, and I barely straddle the very end of GenX myself) they have as a rule not accepted the kind of work hours I find perfectly logical (IE 60-70 hours per week) and start complaining when given even a moderate work load.

To be fair to GenY, this is a general problem in Norwegian society, and not exclusively to GenY. The standard work week here in Norway is 37,5 hours, and a recent suggestion to increase it to 40 hours was met with outrage especially from the socialist unions with one representative going on the record as claiming "it would be a return to the 19th century, and do we REALLY want to remove all rights from the oppressed workers?"

No matter how you slice it, Norwegians NEED to work more and since immigrants other than Europeans have a vastly lower employment rate than the Norwads, their need for labour is only going to be met by an increase in work hours.

[Tamas]

Underlings will test the limits they have, you did the same with your boss. You just need to draw the line.

[The Larch]

In my experience, every generation thinks that they are hardworking, and that the generation after them are lazy, rebellious, etc.  When I was a kid, my teachers, bosses, parents all said that it was very difficult to deal with generation Xs.

What he said. I'm of the opinion that when you start complaining about "young kids these days" is when you officially stop being young yourself. 

In my experience (and to be fair, I've mostly dealt with people who are just 4-5 years younger than me, and I barely straddle the very end of GenX myself) they have as a rule not accepted the kind of work hours I find perfectly logical (IE 60-70 hours per week) and start complaining when given even a moderate work load.

If they all have the same problem when working for you, maybe the one who really has a problem is you and not them. What you might find acceptable might be unacceptable for others. I'd personally never ever accept as normal a 60-70 hour work week. It's ok in peak times, but it's not acceptable as an standard.

[Slargos]

In my experience, every generation thinks that they are hardworking, and that the generation after them are lazy, rebellious, etc.  When I was a kid, my teachers, bosses, parents all said that it was very difficult to deal with generation Xs.

What he said. I'm of the opinion that when you start complaining about "young kids these days" is when you officially stop being young yourself. 

Funny. Even in highschool there was a very poignant difference in academic results (at least anecdotally) between the 1980 and the 1982 generation, which even the teachers remarked on as strange. I guess I stopped being young at 17. 

If they all have the same problem when working for you, maybe the one  who really has a problem is you and not them. What you might find  acceptable might be unacceptable for others. I'd personally never ever  accept as normal a 60-70 hour work week. It's ok in peak times, but it's  not acceptable as an standard.

They didn't all have the same problem, and it's not a normal work week by any stretch, but it's the kind of job where most people need to put in those kind of hours for the first couple of months if not the first year in order to succeed since the learning curve is steep.

I don't expect a 70 hour week, and I certainly don't put in a 70 hour week right now, but I expect it to be done when necessary and for GenY in Norway, the trend is that this is not acceptable.

But sure, maybe I come from a background that differs from the norm. The last 10 years, my standard week has seldom been less than 50 hours, and during peaks it has typically crossed 80 hours. My old man still complains that I'm lazy, but he routinely likes to pull 100 hour weeks. Though frankly, I think he's paying for it now.

[The Larch]

In my experience, every generation thinks that they are hardworking, and that the generation after them are lazy, rebellious, etc.  When I was a kid, my teachers, bosses, parents all said that it was very difficult to deal with generation Xs.

What he said. I'm of the opinion that when you start complaining about "young kids these days" is when you officially stop being young yourself. 

Funny. Even in highschool there was a very poignant difference in academic results (at least anecdotally) between the 1980 and the 1982 generation, which even the teachers remarked on as strange. I guess I stopped being young at 17. 

I guess that some people are just old at heart and there's nothing to be done about it.

[Martinus]

The Y-gen phenomenon is recognized by sociologists so this is more than just "kids these days". There is a very strong preference towards "work and life balance" and "flexibility" in people who enter the labour market these days when it was in our generation. I posted this thread after reading an article commenting on a study on this - so this is not just my imagination.

[Martinus]

If they all have the same problem when working for you, maybe the one who really has a problem is you and not them. What you might find acceptable might be unacceptable for others. I'd personally never ever accept as normal a 60-70 hour work week. It's ok in peak times, but it's not acceptable as an standard.

Do your compatriots think like you? I guess we now know why Spain is on the brink of bankruptcy.

[Slargos]

The Y-gen phenomenon is recognized by sociologists so this is more than just "kids these days". There is a very strong preference towards "work and life balance" and "flexibility" in people who enter the labour market these days when it was in our generation. I posted this thread after reading an article commenting on a study on this - so this is not just my imagination.

I think TV is partly to blame for this.

And before you jump down my throat at this cliché statement, I suggest checking out "How TV ruined your life" which is a british exposé on the subject. Brilliant show. Quite an eye-opener. 

[Martinus]

But sure, maybe I come from a background that differs from the norm. The last 10 years, my standard week has seldom been less than 50 hours, and during peaks it has typically crossed 80 hours. My old man still complains that I'm lazy, but he routinely likes to pull 100 hour weeks. Though frankly, I think he's paying for it now.

Same for me. My standard working day is 9 a.m. - 7/8 p.m. In busy times, it's until 10-11 p.m., with perhaps 20 hours per month of weekend work on average being required too.

The thing is, people these days not only are not happy to put in these hours, they expect to be paid the way people who put in these hours are, which is not acceptable.

[The Larch]

But sure, maybe I come from a background that differs from the norm. The last 10 years, my standard week has seldom been less than 50 hours, and during peaks it has typically crossed 80 hours. My old man still complains that I'm lazy, but he routinely likes to pull 100 hour weeks. Though frankly, I think he's paying for it now.

Same for me. My standard working day is 9 a.m. - 7/8 p.m. In busy times, it's until 10-11 p.m., with perhaps 20 hours per month of weekend work on average being required too.

The thing is, people these days not only are not happy to put in these hours, they expect to be paid the way people who put in these hours are, which is not acceptable.

Enjoy your heart attack at 45, then. Do you sleep at the office as well?

[Martinus]

But sure, maybe I come from a background that differs from the norm. The last 10 years, my standard week has seldom been less than 50 hours, and during peaks it has typically crossed 80 hours. My old man still complains that I'm lazy, but he routinely likes to pull 100 hour weeks. Though frankly, I think he's paying for it now.

Same for me. My standard working day is 9 a.m. - 7/8 p.m. In busy times, it's until 10-11 p.m., with perhaps 20 hours per month of weekend work on average being required too.

The thing is, people these days not only are not happy to put in these hours, they expect to be paid the way people who put in these hours are, which is not acceptable.

Enjoy your heart attack at 45, then. Do you sleep at the office as well?

Not really. In fact, these are pretty lax hours - I know people who stay at work until 3 a.m. regularly.

[The Larch]

But sure, maybe I come from a background that differs from the norm. The last 10 years, my standard week has seldom been less than 50 hours, and during peaks it has typically crossed 80 hours. My old man still complains that I'm lazy, but he routinely likes to pull 100 hour weeks. Though frankly, I think he's paying for it now.

Same for me. My standard working day is 9 a.m. - 7/8 p.m. In busy times, it's until 10-11 p.m., with perhaps 20 hours per month of weekend work on average being required too.

The thing is, people these days not only are not happy to put in these hours, they expect to be paid the way people who put in these hours are, which is not acceptable.

Enjoy your heart attack at 45, then. Do you sleep at the office as well?

Not really. In fact, these are pretty lax hours - I know people who stay at work until 3 a.m. regularly.

I guess they must be really happy with their lives.