The Obama "To Make Important Statement" MEGATHREAD

[jimmy olsen]

The French don't like it when people fail to retreat or surrender when given the opportunity to do so.

Heh. Nice living up to the meme. 

But seriously ... I just can't see how the Air France "superiors" could have the nerve to punish a guy who put his ass on the line for others.

Insurance related reasons?

[Caliga]

I am not sure Pakistan is that friendly. In fact, I am pretty sure they are considerably less friendly than South Vietnam was...

I am quite sure that Pakistan is not at all friendly.  The very definition of a marriage of convenience, in fact.

[Malthus]

The French don't like it when people fail to retreat or surrender when given the opportunity to do so.

Heh. Nice living up to the meme. 

But seriously ... I just can't see how the Air France "superiors" could have the nerve to punish a guy who put his ass on the line for others.

Insurance related reasons?

Heh, that would make a sort of sense ...

A quick googling turns up no source for this "reprimand", though it gets repeated a lot - it may just be a bit of urban mythology. If so, it is a damaging bit for Air France ...

[Berkut]

The French don't like it when people fail to retreat or surrender when given the opportunity to do so.

Heh. Nice living up to the meme. 

But seriously ... I just can't see how the Air France "superiors" could have the nerve to punish a guy who put his ass on the line for others.

I can understand their logic - his actions placed more lives in danger (his own and his crews) making a potential rescue that much harder, and for not good purpose.

That being said, I still think he was right and courageous to do so. But I can see why Air France may have felt that they needed to make at least a token reprimand - after all, I bet they have established policy about what should be done in those circumstances, and I bet it is pretty much "If any hostage offers to let anyone go, you take them up on that offer, period."

[HisMajestyBOB]

I'd have thought it goes without saying, if you plan such a risky mission, then there will be all sorts of back up firepower and other options readied. 

To go in on a wing and a prayer, hoping it all goes largely to plan, would seem to be grossly negligent on the part of the planners and commanders.

A contingency plan to shoot your way out of an ostensibly friendly country is hardly as commonplace as you make it out.

I can't think of any precedent myself.

Pakistan is a friendly country in the same way South Vietnam was.

I am not sure Pakistan is that friendly. In fact, I am pretty sure they are considerably less friendly than South Vietnam was...

I'm pretty sure South Vietnam fought against the Viet Cong and NVA and didn't harbor any of them, so yeah, you're right.

While were making analogies, I'd say it's like the UK sheltering Hitler a mile from Whitehall during WWII.

[grumbler]

I'm pretty sure South Vietnam fought against the Viet Cong and NVA and didn't harbor any of them, so yeah, you're right. 

This is a joke, tight?  I mean, the Viet Cong were South Vietnamese, so wouldn't have been fighting against themselves.

[grumbler]

I am not sure Pakistan is that friendly. In fact, I am pretty sure they are considerably less friendly than South Vietnam was...

I am quite sure that Pakistan is not at all friendly.  The very definition of a marriage of convenience, in fact.

I am quite sure that countries cannot be friendly, because friendliness requires one to be able to feel an emotion, and a country is merely a legal fiction incapable of feelings.

Some Pakistanis are friendly to the US, some are not.  Some who are not friendly act as though they are, and some who are act as if they are not; this is because they almost all act in self-interest no matter what they feel.

Bottom line:  talking about what "Pakistan is" is pretty much a waste of time.

[Berkut]

friend·ly
   /ˈfrɛndli/ Show Spelled [frend-lee] Show IPA adjective, -li·er, -li·est, adverb, noun, plural -lies.
–adjective
1.
characteristic of or befitting a friend;  showing friendship: a friendly greeting.
2.
like a friend;  kind; helpful: a little friendly advice.
3.
favorably disposed; inclined to approve, help, or support: a friendly bank.

[derspiess]

I am not sure Pakistan is that friendly. In fact, I am pretty sure they are considerably less friendly than South Vietnam was...

I am quite sure that Pakistan is not at all friendly.  The very definition of a marriage of convenience, in fact.

I am quite sure that countries cannot be friendly, because friendliness requires one to be able to feel an emotion, and a country is merely a legal fiction incapable of feelings.

Some Pakistanis are friendly to the US, some are not.  Some who are not friendly act as though they are, and some who are act as if they are not; this is because they almost all act in self-interest no matter what they feel.

Bottom line:  talking about what "Pakistan is" is pretty much a waste of time.

So-- you're pretending not to know that they're talking about the South Vietnamese & Pakistani governments, right?

[Caliga]

 

[derspiess]

Btw, the Hofbrauhaus Maibock is awesome this year

[Malthus]

The French don't like it when people fail to retreat or surrender when given the opportunity to do so.

Heh. Nice living up to the meme. 

But seriously ... I just can't see how the Air France "superiors" could have the nerve to punish a guy who put his ass on the line for others.

I can understand their logic - his actions placed more lives in danger (his own and his crews) making a potential rescue that much harder, and for not good purpose.

That being said, I still think he was right and courageous to do so. But I can see why Air France may have felt that they needed to make at least a token reprimand - after all, I bet they have established policy about what should be done in those circumstances, and I bet it is pretty much "If any hostage offers to let anyone go, you take them up on that offer, period."

Yeah, but what is a hostage's offer worth under these circumstances? 

[Caliga]

Btw, the Hofbrauhaus Maibock is awesome this year

Haven't been up there this year.  We were supposed to go up there and to IKEA with a friend of Princesca's but never got around to it.

[grumbler]

So-- you're pretending not to know that they're talking about the South Vietnamese & Pakistani governments, right?

So - you are pretending that governments are not made up of many people, who have often conflicting agendas, especially in cases where governments are extremely weak as in Pakistan and South Vietnam, right?

[Razgovory]

That's not an answer to his question.