Game of Thrones begins....

[Habbaku]

My god. The fallout over this.
So many smug idiots mocking those who are upset at the shittiness of the episode because obviously we haven't been paying attention and Dany going bad was so expected.
...
Yeah...
Not the issue.

Yeah but you see I've resigned myself to a general shitty execution in this series 1-2 episodes ago. For me, that's the default of the series now. And from that perspective, episode 5 was good.

Agreed. From a purely spectacle standpoint, this season has been glorious, beautiful, and well-produced. It's the writing that's atrocious.

[The Minsky Moment]

Point is, she is the least bad option for everyone, there's barely any genuine enthusiasm for her in Westeros, and this has made her feel isolated and unloved. Yes, the show spent a grand total of cca. 10 minutes explaining/showing this, but they were quite clear about it.

She was isolated and unloved in Pentos, then isolated and unloved again when her Khal husband died.  It's not an unknown experience for her.

[viper37]

Point is, she is the least bad option for everyone, there's barely any genuine enthusiasm for her in Westeros, and this has made her feel isolated and unloved. Yes, the show spent a grand total of cca. 10 minutes explaining/showing this, but they were quite clear about it.

hmm, now, they discussed before, in a previous season, IIRC.

[viper37]

Point is, she is the least bad option for everyone, there's barely any genuine enthusiasm for her in Westeros, and this has made her feel isolated and unloved. Yes, the show spent a grand total of cca. 10 minutes explaining/showing this, but they were quite clear about it.

She was isolated and unloved in Pentos, then isolated and unloved again when her Khal husband died.  It's not an unknown experience for her.

The first time, she was just a child, the second, she walked into fire and emerged with three dragons.  That's like Jeanne D'Arc walking out of the fire with three GI Joe helicopters shooting lasers at everyone and never requiring fuels.
It changes someone.

[Tamas]

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2019/may/16/stop-the-nitpicking-this-season-of-game-of-thrones-is-miraculous-the-bells

The major sticking point for many was Dany's apparent transmogrification into an unhinged tyrant, as if this was something that happened in the space of five sour-faced minutes. Dany has been burning people alive since Mirri Maz Duur in season one, and has scorched her way through the Tarleys, Varys, the slavers, the loot train and scores of others ever since. Her moral unravelling has been glacial, her innate, entitled Targaryen madness always percolating, its worst impulses tamed and feared by Tyrion, Jorah, Varys and, latterly, Jon. Following the loss of her best friend, her ersatz father, two of her "children", her squeeze, her rightful claim to her birthright, the adoration of her people and her entire reason to exist, it wasn't much of a stretch to accept that her brittle grip on reason would snap. Graduating from only burning those who "deserved" it to chargrilling anyone in her way, including allies who would likely soon become foes, was no giant leap. It seemed inevitable.

The performances have been terrific, the set-pieces staggering, and the writing – while not up to the standard of earlier seasons – has succeeded in creating shock-and-awe moments right to the last. Whoever is left digging through the rubble for the Iron Throne in the end, it probably won't be who you wanted, or for the reasons you hoped for. Wasn't that the point all along?

[crazy canuck]

The disappointment has nothing to do with the reasons we had hoped for.  This is about there being no reasons.

[The Minsky Moment]

her innate, entitled Targaryen madness always percolating

Nicely sums up the problem right there.

[Habbaku]

Yeah. There is literally zero evidence to suggest that Targaryens are all inherently mad in some way and are just a ticking time-bomb. Plenty of Targaryens were noble and just. Plenty were tyrants. Plenty were just mediocre.

[The Minsky Moment]

Not to mention Maester Aemon who made it past 100 without going fire crazy

[Razgovory]

I didn't see her actions inspired by mental instability but by rage and an inability to switch out of killing mode.  That's fairly common for people in battle.  Dany's personality has changed a great deal during the show.  She's grown more imperious, ruthless, and cold as the show went on.  I think her setting fire to King's Landing fits that.

[Camerus]

I feel we were getting there with her, but a couple of steps were missing in the process. Crucifying and burning Bad People as she has numerous times in the past is a sign of a personality comfortable with brutality and violence.

However, she's generally been until now pretty clear about her Manichaean worldview and whom she unleashes her terror on.

I'm not sure why the folk of King's Landing were deemed Bad People.

[KRonn]

Point is, she is the least bad option for everyone, there's barely any genuine enthusiasm for her in Westeros, and this has made her feel isolated and unloved. Yes, the show spent a grand total of cca. 10 minutes explaining/showing this, but they were quite clear about it.

Everyone?  The show itself spent a great deal of time explaining the context of why Tryion's plan to allow the city to surrender made sense.  He made the case that the people of Kings Landing were fearful of Cersei and once liberated would be loyal.   Dany could have just taken out Cersei and as Tyrion explained, the city would have been hers.  These after the fact justifications make no sense.  The show was going for shock value.  Their problem is, unlike the twists in the books, there was nothing to justify it.  Even the genetic argument makes no sense.  No Targaryen has suddenly snapped like that.

Agreed on the reasoning for the city surrendering. Dany did say something about needing to be feared as she became more morose about not being as accepted as Queen. She could have walked into Kings Landing and been accepted, but having destroyed it he'll be feared as was likely her goal but also hated and more in danger for being killed off. That's what the show had to bring her to so she could be taken down, if that's where the writers are going which I suspect. Of course, in this story though anything can happen. 

[Zoupa]

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2019/may/16/stop-the-nitpicking-this-season-of-game-of-thrones-is-miraculous-the-bells

The major sticking point for many was Dany's apparent transmogrification into an unhinged tyrant, as if this was something that happened in the space of five sour-faced minutes. Dany has been burning people alive since Mirri Maz Duur in season one, and has scorched her way through the Tarleys, Varys, the slavers, the loot train and scores of others ever since. Her moral unravelling has been glacial, her innate, entitled Targaryen madness always percolating, its worst impulses tamed and feared by Tyrion, Jorah, Varys and, latterly, Jon. Following the loss of her best friend, her ersatz father, two of her "children", her squeeze, her rightful claim to her birthright, the adoration of her people and her entire reason to exist, it wasn't much of a stretch to accept that her brittle grip on reason would snap. Graduating from only burning those who "deserved" it to chargrilling anyone in her way, including allies who would likely soon become foes, was no giant leap. It seemed inevitable.

The performances have been terrific, the set-pieces staggering, and the writing – while not up to the standard of earlier seasons – has succeeded in creating shock-and-awe moments right to the last. Whoever is left digging through the rubble for the Iron Throne in the end, it probably won't be who you wanted, or for the reasons you hoped for. Wasn't that the point all along?

Remember Olly? The kid who was a steward for Jon and ended up stabbing him and getting hanged for it?

He got more scenes to slowly show why he did what he did than Daenerys had to explain her actions.

And btw now that I think about it what was the point of the Lord of Light resurrecting Jon? He had no impact on killing the Night King. It makes sense for Beric, since he ends up sacrificing himself to help Arya, but what was Jon's role?

Ugh. I hope the books come out eventually.

[Razgovory]

Dany hasn't had a dialogue since she burnt the city.

[Tamas]