[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Barrister]

@CC I don't think he did. I was more pointing out the exceptionalism of what Harper achieved. Harper was helped, in 2006, by Quebec's anger & disgust at Paul Martin & the sponsorship scandal. We voted for the BQ and there was the Orange wave before voting for the LPC & the CPC.

In 2025, the LPC has few path to victory without a good showing of support from Quebec. Trudeau leaving the LPC before the election might open the path to an even bigger CPC victory if the new LPC leader is an unknown frigid economist.

Harper had the difficult job of trying to win without a large amount of support in Quebec.  It's notable he only managed to win one majority as a result.  Don't get me wrong the Conservatives, then and now, would love to win more seats in Quebec, but with there being a solid bedrock of sovereignist voters for the Bloc, and anglo Montrealers more dedicated to the Liberals, they're stuck competing in the same 12-20 ridings around Quebec City and the south shore.

[crazy canuck]

@CC I don't think he did. I was more pointing out the exceptionalism of what Harper achieved. Harper was helped, in 2006, by Quebec's anger & disgust at Paul Martin & the sponsorship scandal. We voted for the BQ and there was the Orange wave before voting for the LPC & the CPC.

In 2025, the LPC has few path to victory without a good showing of support from Quebec. Trudeau leaving the LPC before the election might open the path to an even bigger CPC victory if the new LPC leader is an unknown frigid economist.

Ah, got it, many thanks for the explanation.

[Barrister]

So going way back to 1993, the Reform Party had started out as a western-only party, but for the 1993 election had spread across Canada - but did not run candidates in Quebec.

It turned out though a lot of people in the rest of the country thought that was kind of anti-Canadian, and it actually hurt Reform in the rest of the country.  The party changed that and ran candidates in Quebec in 1997 (it did not win any seats and got a negligible amount of the vote).

So that's kind of how to view Conservatives in Quebec - they're not going to win that mean seats, but they need to be somewhat competitive in order to present themselves as a national party (plus you do want cabinet representation from Quebec).

[Jacob]

That's a good point and a perspective I hadn't considered. Thanks for that Grey Fox.

[Grey Fox]

So going way back to 1993, the Reform Party had started out as a western-only party, but for the 1993 election had spread across Canada - but did not run candidates in Quebec.

It turned out though a lot of people in the rest of the country thought that was kind of anti-Canadian, and it actually hurt Reform in the rest of the country.  The party changed that and ran candidates in Quebec in 1997 (it did not win any seats and got a negligible amount of the vote).

So that's kind of how to view Conservatives in Quebec - they're not going to win that mean seats, but they need to be somewhat competitive in order to present themselves as a national party (plus you do want cabinet representation from Quebec).

I didn't know that the sentiment was felt outside of Quebec too. 

[Grey Fox]

In other Quebec news.

The Provincial government is reforming how it employs the health system workforce by creating a crown corporation to run it. The salary of the CEO of that Crown corp. is a reported 567k yearly with a first 2 year bonus bringing it to 652k per year. The most paid CEO of our entire system.

Today, it was announced that a women, Geneviève Biron, will be the CEO. That's quite something. Proverbial glass ceiling shattered.

[crazy canuck]

In other Quebec news.

The Provincial government is reforming how it employs the health system workforce by creating a crown corporation to run it. The salary of the CEO of that Crown corp. is a reported 567k yearly with a first 2 year bonus bringing it to 652k per year. The most paid CEO of our entire system.

Today, it was announced that a women, Geneviève Biron, will be the CEO. That's quite something. Proverbial glass ceiling shattered.

I will be watching with a keen interest to see how that works.  In BC we have gone the route of regional health authorities for the delivery of health services.  Before that responsibility was more decentralized to individual hospitals.  I think the move the greater centralization worked (although I am a bit biased as I was around for the development of that scheme and now I advise the various authorities) but I wonder whether taking the next step and have overall coordination on a provincial level will make better sense.

I can think of a lot of positives for doing it that way.

By the way, she is probably taking a pay cut to take on this important work. 

[Sheilbh]

I am a bit confused by your post. You said you understand the audience he was addressing but then are critical for speaking to that audience.  I don't get it.

No it's not critical about the audience or anything like that. Watching it I think it's very flat - very central banker doing a political speech. So my first thought was whether he'd misjudged the audience/venue and was delivering it to a very economics audience there to hear a former central banker.

But looking at where he was speaking and who, I assume, that organisation has in their audience, that's clearly not the problem. So I think the problem is the speaker and the speech - not insurmountable and maybe what you'd expect, but as I say that just makes me think more that a leadership role early in that transition would be a pretty unforgiving place to learn those lessons. Especially jumping into a national election in the next 18 months.

[crazy canuck]

I'm am still confused, who do you think the audience of that speech was?

[viper37]

frigid economist

It's when you say words like these that you make my heart melt.

That, and with today's announcement of the new healthcare "Top Gun", I'm gonna go to bed crying tears of joy tonight.

Thank you.

[viper37]

In other Quebec news.

The Provincial government is reforming how it employs the health system workforce by creating a crown corporation to run it. The salary of the CEO of that Crown corp. is a reported 567k yearly with a first 2 year bonus bringing it to 652k per year. The most paid CEO of our entire system.

Today, it was announced that a women, Geneviève Biron, will be the CEO. That's quite something. Proverbial glass ceiling shattered.

I will be watching with a keen interest to see how that works.  In BC we have gone the route of regional health authorities for the delivery of health services.  Before that responsibility was more decentralized to individual hospitals.  I think the move the greater centralization worked (although I am a bit biased as I was around for the development of that scheme and now I advise the various authorities) but I wonder whether taking the next step and have overall coordination on a provincial level will make better sense.

I can think of a lot of positives for doing it that way.

By the way, she is probably taking a pay cut to take on this important work. 

We have tried decentralization in health care with regional administration centers.

Actually, it was a half assed attempt at decentralization.  Regional agencies with the Provincial Department of Health Care and Social Services to distribute financial resources.  It never worked as expected.

And being a government, it had to go with reforms upon reforms, upon reforms and constant reorganization.

I like her profile.  She's a Montreal girl, but I guess she had to be, sadly.  HEC.  Would have preferred somewhere else.  Can't be helped I guess.  But she seems competent enough, smart enough to dodge the journalists' traps today.

[Grey Fox]

Why the HEC hate?

[viper37]

Why the HEC hate?

There are other business schools in Quebec.

Why does everyone has to come from there to be considered competent?

Laval, Sherbrooke, and the UQ networks (outside of UQAM) all have very good business schools with Master degrees.

HEC is not better than anywhere else.

[Grey Fox]

I understand. I have the same opinion of Polytechnique engineers.

[crazy canuck]

Ibbitsen's opinion piece in the globe today described how the budget harmed rather than helped the Liberals according to the latest polling numbers.

He ends his article saying:

A new leader doesn't guarantee a Liberal victory in the next election – far from it. But more might be saved than in an election with the current leader.

The Liberal Party was in the ditch when Justin Trudeau came to its rescue in 2013. He needs to ask himself in what state it will be if he stays.