[Canada] Canadian Politics Redux

[Jacob]

We are going to need more than common sense and joining hands.

More seriously, though... I agree we have a construction crisis.

I'm not aware of the discussion - if any - of strategies to address it. How do we - and how do our governments - massively increase the amount of homes built?

Being sort of leftist, I'm inclined to favour massive public housing projects along the Singapore model, incentivizing co-ops and co-housing projects via the CMHC, and things like that. It's not massively thought through or anything, and I'm very happy to entertain more free market type approaches as well. The main thing for me is that it provides the housing in as reasonable a way as possible.

Also, getting massive construction going would probably boost the economy I'd think.

The question is how to do it effectively.

Any thoughts? Have any of our political or thought leaders sketched out ideas on the topic?

[HVC]

One issue that sort of hard of hard to overcome is land. We have a lot of it, but not where people want to live. Ontario is going through this whole thing where our major cities are surrounded by a green belt. Part of that land was delisted (not sure of the proper term) in a rather shady process under the guise of more housing. Investigations after the fact and resigning politicians and all that.

How to get around people moving to already crowded cities? Making immigrants live in certain cities or areas for a set amount of time hoping they'd set roots? Don't know either. Add it to jacobs brainstorming list.

[Barrister]

This is just one small part of the overall solution, but we need to bring back rooming houses!  They've largely been regulated out of existance.

We still have these unofficially (and often illegally) where you take a single-family home and rent out individual rooms, but rather purpose-built rooming houses as one means of providing very low income people an affordable place to live.

Relatedly, we need to encourage a lot more purpose-built rentals, instead of just condos.

[Barrister]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/liberals-gst-rental-apartments-1.6966608

Liberals promise to remove GST on new rental properties.

Apparently this was in their 2015 policy plan, but then they dropped it in 2017 saying there were better ways to increase affordability.

So the Liberals are definitely feeling the heat on this issue...

[Jacob]

Yeah I think if the Liberals could put out a believable (and common sense) plan on housing, with noticable improvements between now and the election then they'd be much better place.

Not sure "GST on rental properties" is going to be sufficient. But maybe it's part of it.

[Barrister]

Ye

Yeah I think if the Liberals could put out a believable (and common sense) plan on housing, with noticable improvements between now and the election then they'd be much better place.

Not sure "GST on rental properties" is going to be sufficient. But maybe it's part of it.

Yeah, there's no way it's sufficient by itself.  But it may be a step in the right direction.

It is going to require co-ordinating with municipalities as zoning restrictions are a big part of it as well.

[Jacob]

Thoughts on HVC's and Barrister's posts:

• I think building on green belt land is fine, if the process for doing it doesn't result in (or appear to result in) obvious corruption and profiteering.
• I don't think curtailing the fundamental right of freedom of movement is going to help. I could see building better infrastructure (rapid transit) and building in outlying communities could help. Alternately trying to find ways to make smaller regional towns more dynamic and attractive and put growth there
• Rooming houses - Single Room Occupancy (SRO) - have a bad reputation in Vancouver as they form the heart of the downtown Eastside apocalypse via slum lords. I agree that single room rentals has real potential, but it needs something to prevent it from becoming the nucelus of slum-lord empires
• I agree on purpose built rentals as well. Two thoughts 1) The trick is going to be to find ways to keep rents from going out of control, 2) There are lots of stories of renters getting kicked for various reasons not their fault; making renting feel more solid and less precarious.
• ... and a question. How do we incentivize building rental at scale? Will the GST cut be sufficient... probably not

[Barrister]

• Rooming houses - Single Room Occupancy (SRO) - have a bad reputation in Vancouver as they form the heart of the downtown Eastside apocalypse via slum lords. I agree that single room rentals has real potential, but it needs something to prevent it from becoming the nucelus of slum-lord empires
• I agree on purpose built rentals as well. Two thoughts 1) The trick is going to be to find ways to keep rents from going out of control, 2) There are lots of stories of renters getting kicked for various reasons not their fault; making renting feel more solid and less precarious.
• ... and a question. How do we incentivize building rental at scale? Will the GST cut be sufficient... probably not

On rooming houses / SROs - they have a negative reputation, as witnessed by you calling the owners "slumlords".  But depending on your definition of slumlord, it's just a landlord in a poor neighbourhood.  But we need those!

Remember in my job I deal with homeless population all the time.  I would much prefer someone living in a SRO, even a not-very-nice one, than living on the street.  Obviously you still want to make sure people live in safe and healthy living facilities, so you still need all the proper health and safety inspectors

We're not going to get our homeless population all living in nice middle class apartments - far better to get SROs where they can live warm and dry and with running water.

Purpose built rentals.  I'm probably out of my depth here, but probably further tax rebates in favour of such building, as well as expanding zoning on where they can be built.

[Jacob]

On rooming houses / SROs - they have a negative reputation, as witnessed by you calling the owners "slumlords".  But depending on your definition of slumlord, it's just a landlord in a poor neighbourhood.  But we need those!

Downtown Eastside is legit slum lords.

Remember in my job I deal with homeless population all the time.  I would much prefer someone living in a SRO, even a not-very-nice one, than living on the street.  Obviously you still want to make sure people live in safe and healthy living facilities, so you still need all the proper health and safety inspectors

Indeed. More significantly, they need action on the proper health and safety inspections. Which has been an issue in the DTES.

We're not going to get our homeless population all living in nice middle class apartments - far better to get SROs where they can live warm and dry and with running water.

Yeah I agree we don't need to aim for middle class condos and should look for more appropriate (and cost-efficient) solutions... and I agree that SROs (that are well run) is a great way to go. My point is merely that SROs in Vancouver have a really bad rep because there's been a pretty steady stream of shocking reports about them.

... could be as simple as rebranding the concept. But saying "build SROs" is going to come up against resistance here, I expect, as the term is closely associated with "terrible slum".

Purpose built rentals.  I'm probably out of my depth here, but probably further tax rebates in favour of such building, as well as expanding zoning on where they can be built.

The classic right of centre approach. It could work and if it does I'm all for it

[crazy canuck]

• Rooming houses - Single Room Occupancy (SRO) - have a bad reputation in Vancouver as they form the heart of the downtown Eastside apocalypse via slum lords. I agree that single room rentals has real potential, but it needs something to prevent it from becoming the nucelus of slum-lord empires
• I agree on purpose built rentals as well. Two thoughts 1) The trick is going to be to find ways to keep rents from going out of control, 2) There are lots of stories of renters getting kicked for various reasons not their fault; making renting feel more solid and less precarious.
• ... and a question. How do we incentivize building rental at scale? Will the GST cut be sufficient... probably not

On rooming houses / SROs - they have a negative reputation, as witnessed by you calling the owners "slumlords".  But depending on your definition of slumlord, it's just a landlord in a poor neighbourhood.  But we need those!

Remember in my job I deal with homeless population all the time.  I would much prefer someone living in a SRO, even a not-very-nice one, than living on the street.  Obviously you still want to make sure people live in safe and healthy living facilities, so you still need all the proper health and safety inspectors

We're not going to get our homeless population all living in nice middle class apartments - far better to get SROs where they can live warm and dry and with running water.

Purpose built rentals.  I'm probably out of my depth here, but probably further tax rebates in favour of such building, as well as expanding zoning on where they can be built.

The problematic slum lords in Vancouver are the ones who are not complying with the minimum health and safety codes.  But that has been less of a problem in the last decade or so and the City has been aggressive in enforcing their bylaws by seizing the noncompliant properties and handing them over to non profits for social housing.

One of the reasons the number of housing starts has dropped in absolute terms is because the number of people who build houses has also declined.  We just don't have a lot of tradespeople anymore.  That is not going to change anytime soon. People who used to go into the trades are going into tech.  Not an easy fix.  And especially if we just rely on the private sector to do all the building that is necessary in the short term.


[/list]

[Jacob]

Yeah the number of people in trades could be an issue (on top of the fact that they may be priced out of living in the places that has the highest need for more construction).

Potentially immigration could be adjusted to help there, but it'd take a while before it'd help (not in time for the next election, I expect).

[Jacob]

BC politics

Apparently the BC Conservative party is polling really well. Does anyone know what they're about?

[viper37]

BC politics

Apparently the BC Conservative party is polling really well. Does anyone know what they're about?

Mainstreet puts them at 27% for August 30th:
https://qc125.com/cb/sondages.htm

NDP leads with 35%

[Jacob]

Yeah those are the results I saw. They were basically a nothing party until now. I guess the BC Liberals rebranding to BC United Party (B-Cup  ) and generally being feckless gave room for a challenger on the right side of the spectrum.

What I'm curious is what they're about... are they culture warriors and conspiracy theorists finally coming into their own? Are they a faction of the BC Libs who think they have a better shot with a different brand? Are they a bunch of BB clones? Something else?

I suppose I could look it up, but if someone else knows I'd like to hear their perspective

[Barrister]

Yeah those are the results I saw. They were basically a nothing party until now. I guess the BC Liberals rebranding to BC United Party (B-Cup  ) and generally being feckless gave room for a challenger on the right side of the spectrum.

What I'm curious is what they're about... are they culture warriors and conspiracy theorists finally coming into their own? Are they a faction of the BC Libs who think they have a better shot with a different brand? Are they a bunch of BB clones? Something else?

I suppose I could look it up, but if someone else knows I'd like to hear their perspective

I am very curious whether being a bunch of BB clones would be a good thing or a bad thing, but perhaps some things are best left unasked...


So, mid-90s.  I went to a training session led by an American right-wing youth training organization (No, not Turning Points USA) in Calgary.  Perhaps the first time they'd ever come north.  We had a bunch of Reform members, a decent smattering of Young PCs - but a small delegation of BC SoCreds.  In order to maintain harmony and unity it was decided we would all be BC SoCreds for the weekend.




I am aware of the existence BC Conservatives, but really can't say any more.  The BC Liberal Party being the de facto right wing party in BC always seemed kind-of unstable, but all kinds of crazy things can happen in politics.