Sovereign debt bubble thread

[Zanza]

There is no way the troika can do that though. The Greeks will have to do that by themselves.

[Jacob]

Yes, that's the whole point. The country in this case means the government and various lobbies and unions who are responsible for this malaise in the first place. That's why someone OUTSIDE the system has to tear it down. It can't be done within Greece itself.

You may well be right, but who is in any kind of position to actually do that?

[MadImmortalMan]

Yes, that's the whole point. The country in this case means the government and various lobbies and unions who are responsible for this malaise in the first place. That's why someone OUTSIDE the system has to tear it down. It can't be done within Greece itself.

You may well be right, but who is in any kind of position to actually do that?

The bond market.

[Jacob]

The bond market.

I'm not sure about that.

I mean, the bond markets can punish them for not fixing that shit, but it can't implement any kind of reforms.

[Admiral Yi]

The bond market.

They only care about the bottom line. 

[MadImmortalMan]

Interesting post on ZH today (surprisingly without "Game Over" in the title), that the euro today is acting like the gold standard in the 1930's. With the assertion that the nations who left the GS sooner had less severe depressions and recovered more quickly.


http://www.zerohedge.com/news/euro-today-gold-standard-1930s-eu-economies

[The Minsky Moment]

Interesting post on ZH today (surprisingly without "Game Over" in the title), that the euro today is acting like the gold standard in the 1930's. With the assertion that the nations who left the GS sooner had less severe depressions and recovered more quickly.


http://www.zerohedge.com/news/euro-today-gold-standard-1930s-eu-economies

See post 588

[MadImmortalMan]

You write for Zerohedge?

Aren't you lacking the requisite end-of-the-worldiness? 

[Sheilbh]

From the Guardian liveblog of the Anglo-French spat:

Breaking news from the rating agencies, but it's not the announcement we're all waiting for*.

Fitch has put eight eurozone countries on Rating Watch Negative -- Belgium, Spain, Slovenia, Italy, Ireland and Cyprus. The decision means each country could soon see its credit rating cut, by at least one notch.

Fitch said it took the decision having analysed last week's EU Summit, and concluded that:

    a 'comprehensive solution' to the eurozone crisis is technically and politically beyond reach.

Fitch said it was particularly concerned by "the absence of a credible financial backstop:, adding that:

    In Fitch's opinion this requires more active and explicit commitment from the European Central Bank to mitigate the risk of self-fulfilling liquidity crises for potentially illiquid but solvent Euro Area Member States.

None of the six countries have a AAA rating - the highest is Belgium with AA+ (one notch below). They were already on negative watch, but Rating Watch Negative moves each one closer to a downgrade - with a decision due by the end of next month.

* - there is a lot of chatter in the City and elsewhere that Standard & Poor's will do the deed tonight, and cut France's AAA rating.

This isn't looking good.  Let's hope Christmas calms everyone down...

Edit:  And Ireland's economy shrank again.  I think -2% or so last quarter.  They've gone from the hopeful posterchild of austere growth to one of the Eurozone's worst performers over the last 9 months of dithering.

[Ed Anger]

I am fully prepared to panic.

[Ideologue]

Edit:  And Ireland's economy shrank again.  I think -2% or so last quarter.  They've gone from the hopeful posterchild of austere growth to one of the Eurozone's worst performers over the last 9 months of dithering.

Gosh, I can't imagine why.

[Ed Anger]

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?prodid=11487214'

So tempting.....

[Ideologue]

?

We're sorry, this product is not available. [no picture, nada]

The brain is the biggest erogenous zone I guess.

[citizen k]

Edit:  And Ireland's economy shrank again.  I think -2% or so last quarter.  They've gone from the hopeful posterchild of austere growth to one of the Eurozone's worst performers over the last 9 months of dithering.

Gosh, I can't imagine why.

Keynesian pants are a dairy?

[Ideologue]

History will prove us right.  They can put it on our tombstones.

If we can afford tombstones.