Hungarian Politics

[Jacob]

One of the most important stages has a new head, a renowned right-wing antisemite. He wants to "clean up the diseased liberal hegemony" in the stage business and "declare war on the lowbrow entertainment industry." Further he wants to rename the stage from "New Stage" to "Hinterland Stage", to symbolize "the repressed Hungarianism under the socialist-liberal yoke."

Does this mean more nudity or less?

Sounds like less.

[Tamas]

EURHUF is at record high, CDS at 700 points. Great to be Hungarian today!



NOT.

[Martinus]

EURHUF is at record high, CDS at 700 points. Great to be Hungarian today!



NOT.

Fuck you, your shitty ways are contaminating PLN rates as well.

[Martinus]

Financial Times effectively calls the Hungarian constitution changes a coup:

Democracy under threat in Budapest

Months before his death in December, Václav Havel, former Czech president and leader of his country's anti-communist revolution, signed a petition decrying the destruction of democracy in Hungary. His warning, which echoed those of others, including this newspaper, went unheeded. A country at Europe's geographical heart has suffered what amounts to a constitutional coup.

Hungary's new constitution, which took effect on January 1, combined with a flurry of "basic" laws rushed through at the end of 2011, has all but removed checks and balances to the power of Hungary's government and ruling party. Meanwhile, the electoral rules have been changed in a way that could keep the party responsible, prime minister Viktor Orbán's Fidesz, in power for years to come.

The legislative changes give the government sweeping influence over the media, the judiciary, the central bank and audit and budget watchdogs. In several cases, it will wield power via committees stuffed with Fidesz appointees, their heads installed for nine years and replaceable only by a two-thirds parliamentary vote. In the legal sphere, a close friend of Mr Orban has power to appoint judges. The constitutional court's powers have been curtailed.

Electoral boundaries, meanwhile, have been redrawn in a way that favours Fidesz. One think-tank calculates that under these rules, the party would have won the last two elections, which it lost. Fidesz has gone too far in seeking to impose state regulation of religion, reducing the number of officially registered sects to 14. These do not include any world religions other than Christianity and Judaism.

Much of what the government has done is incompatible with Hungary's membership of the European Union. Brussels, and Hungary's fellow EU states, should join the US in robust condemnation. It should be made clear to Mr Orban that his actions are undermining Hungary's application for much-needed financial support from the EU and the International Monetary Fund.

It also exposes a flaw in the EU's legal framework. While new entrants must prove compliance with democratic norms, there is no comeback if they subsequently fall short. As the EU expands to countries where democracy has shallower roots, this lack should be addressed. Hungary has become the first EU state to challenge the assumption that democracy is irreversible. Amid Europe's economic woes, it may not be the last.

http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/a5fe09ee-3604-11e1-ae04-00144feabdc0.html#axzz1iUiwClge

[Zanza]

So, are they going to start a war to revise Triannon anytime soon?

[Tamas]

So, are they going to start a war to revise Triannon anytime soon?

They have already given voting rights to all with Hungarian citizenship regardless of where they live, and easy access to said citizenship to everyone with Hungarian nationality, if you consider that a start.

[Syt]

FT raises a good point.

Quite a few user comments point to the sanctions enacted in 2000 on Austria by the EU when Jörg Haider became minority partner of a coalition with the conservatives (up to EU sending officials to observe whether democracy was ending in the country) and they - rightfully - ask why so little is done or said about what's happening in Hungary.

[Tamas]

FT raises a good point.

Quite a few user comments point to the sanctions enacted in 2000 on Austria by the EU when Jörg Haider became minority partner of a coalition with the conservatives (up to EU sending officials to observe whether democracy was ending in the country) and they - rightfully - ask why so little is done or said about what's happening in Hungary.

Probably because our budget is so fucked up we might collapse even if we receive EU/IMF help, let alone if we get some kind of punishment instead.

[Sheilbh]

There's a difference between a minority party of a coalition and a party that got over 50percent of the popular vote.  The former's less important but easier to sanction. How can the unelected EU leadership be able to sanction the democratic choice of the majority of Hungarians?

[Martinus]

There's a difference between a minority party of a coalition and a party that got over 50percent of the popular vote.  The former's less important but easier to sanction. How can the unelected EU leadership be able to sanction the democratic choice of the majority of Hungarians?

I don't think this is a fair comparison. Austria's ostracism was (perhaps unwisely) caused by a questionable party simply being brought into the government - it did not manage to enact any policies. Here we are talking about sanctioning a country for adopting certain policies which are ostensibly in violation of the Hungary's treaty obligations (including the European Convention of Human Rights) which imo is much more justificable than punishing the people for merely electing a "wrong" party.

[Tamas]

That's one of my several concerns - we need help badly but the EU cannot let Orban bring back the velved dictatorship we had during Kadar until '89. The economic portion of the European unity is crumbling, they simply cannot let the political portion be compromised by a member state turning into a semi-dictatorship one party state. Credibility equals survival now for the EU.

[Sheilbh]

I don't think this is a fair comparison. Austria's ostracism was (perhaps unwisely) caused by a questionable party simply being brought into the government - it did not manage to enact any policies. Here we are talking about sanctioning a country for adopting certain policies which are ostensibly in violation of the Hungary's treaty obligations (including the European Convention of Human Rights) which imo is much more justificable than punishing the people for merely electing a "wrong" party.

I think the Austrian ostracism was wrong, I'm not sure that it would be right in Hungary's case either.

The core difference for me is that Austria was sanctioned because the government brought in a questionable party.  If Hungary were to be sanctioned it would be because over 50% of the electorate voted in a questionable party, which is now enacted its policies.  The people elected the 'wrong' party and now they're delivering what they promised.  That's not the sort of territory I think the EU should head into and is also anti-democratic of itself. 

If this happens then there's a clear precedent.  How anti-democratic must policies be before the EU intervenes?  Is it the EU's role to regulated the checks and balances of internal constitutions (this would after all be an enormous leap) and determine if, say, the independent judiciary is being undermined?

I'm also not sure what the Treaty basis is, what do you think it would be?

As to the ECHR I think that's fair - and I do think the prosecutor being able to choose their judge is against right to a fair trial - but that's for individuals to take to the Court, which is a long process.  Until that happens the ECHR can't do anything and is, anyway, separate from the eU.

[Tamas]

Ok, Sheilbh, I saw the "we delivered what we promised" excuse appear in foreign media, made by the government. That's bullshit.

They didn't promise SHIT. That's how they won. They told everything would be better, that there is enough money the socialists are just stealing it. Oh, and that they will protect private pensions, lol.

[Syt]

Well, I worded myself poorly - I'm against sanctions as punishment of an electorate's democratic choice . . . people have the right to be stupid.

However, I find it regrettable that there's hardly any coverage in mainstream media (at least from what I see in Austria/Germany) or comments from important politicians abroad.

[Sheilbh]

However, I find it regrettable that there's hardly any coverage in mainstream media (at least from what I see in Austria/Germany) or comments from important politicians abroad.

It's getting covered in the UK but not enough, in my view.  But it is disappointing that the main condemnation from politicians has come from the US.  Barosso's made some delicately threatening remarks in an exchange of letters (basically if this goes on the EU won't help you with your debt and the IMF).

Edit:  And fair enough Tamas.  Did they not even vaguely hint at redesigning the state or a new constitution?