Religious Right is scared of the Tea Partys?

[Razgovory]

I thought Kirk and Buckley loved Burke

That may well be.

And that they are considered the intellectual fathers of modern American conservatism?

I always thought it was Andrew Kehoe.

[Jacob]

How can you want to conserve a culture you loathe?

I would guess that they want to conserve their idea of old popular/vulgar culture.  The genius of the nation lies not in the intellectual and other achievements of past elites, but in the no-nonsense, down-salt-of-the-earth, self-sufficient pioneers.  It's not the conservatism of high culture, nor of shopkeepers and tradesmen, it's the conservatism of the homesteader who doesn't care if the world goes to hell as long as he can do what he wants on his own plot of land.

[Fate]

I thought Kirk and Buckley loved Burke

That may well be.

And that they are considered the intellectual fathers of modern American conservatism?

No. That would be Karl Rove, Lee Atwater, and the guy who founded Operation Rescue.

[Razgovory]

How can you want to conserve a culture you loathe?

I would guess that they want to conserve their idea of old popular culture.  The genius of the notion lies not in the intellectual and other achievements of past elites, but in the no-nonsense, down-salt-of-the-earth, self-sufficient pioneers.  It's not the conservatism of high culture, nor of shopkeepers and tradesmen, it's the conservatism of the homesteader who doesn't care if the world goes to hell as long as he can do what he wants on his own plot of land.

"when I hear the word culture, I reach for my gun"

[Martinus]

I find the cultural populism of American conservatism deeply weird.  I can understand a cultural conservative being someone like T.S. Eliot, an ultra-elitist snob dismissing parts of the canon and elevating other parts of it, moaning about some aspects of the nature of the modern world (Malcolm Muggeridge is another cultural conservative).  I don't understand what's conservative about a movement vulgar enough to include some American conservatives.  But then there's always been money in appealing to the masses, it's just not terribly conservative.

High culture is the preserve of the effeminate, liberal northeasterner.

How can you want to conserve a culture you loathe?

I don't think populist conservative movements want to "conserve" anything. They want to "return" to the "Golden Age", which never existed, and is simply a product of their ignorance of history.

[Razgovory]

Last summer during the town hall debacles one cry was repeated constantly.  "We want our country, back".  Back from who or from what was never clear.  Nor was it clear what they wanted it back to.  This is not the cry of a conservative but a right wing reactionary.

[dps]

I find the cultural populism of American conservatism deeply weird.  I can understand a cultural conservative being someone like T.S. Eliot, an ultra-elitist snob dismissing parts of the canon and elevating other parts of it, moaning about some aspects of the nature of the modern world (Malcolm Muggeridge is another cultural conservative).  I don't understand what's conservative about a movement vulgar enough to include some American conservatives.  But then there's always been money in appealing to the masses, it's just not terribly conservative.

High culture is the preserve of the effeminate, liberal northeasterner.

How can you want to conserve a culture you loathe?

I don't think populist conservative movements want to "conserve" anything. They want to "return" to the "Golden Age", which never existed, and is simply a product of their ignorance of history.

Generally speaking, populist movements aren't "conservative" in any meaningful way, at least in US history.  They have often been socially conservative (or reactionary) and economically liberal (or radical), but that's not always true. 

[Razgovory]

Just out of curiosity, who exactly is a conservative, Dps?

[dps]

Just out of curiosity, who exactly is a conservative, Dps?

Are you wanting my definition of a conservative, or are you wanting examples of people that I consider conservatives?

[DGuller]

Raz got it right.  American conservatives are actually reactionaries.

[Razgovory]

Just out of curiosity, who exactly is a conservative, Dps?

Are you wanting my definition of a conservative, or are you wanting examples of people that I consider conservatives?

Both!

[Martinus]

Raz got it right.  American conservatives are actually reactionaries.

I think most so-called conservatives are. Classic conservatism is an "elitist" movement like classic "liberalism", in that neither is capable of inspiring the masses. They are both upper middle class ideologies. Universal suffrage has pretty much spelled their death outside of theoretical debates.

[Admiral Yi]

Raz got it right.  American conservatives are actually reactionaries.

Agreed.