Roman Polanski arrested in Zürich

[CountDeMoney]

The issue as I understand it with Polanski was NOT that the judge was going to reject the plea, but that he was considering ignoring the joint sentencing recommendation of both sides and imposing more jail time under the plea.

Yeah that is my understanding as well. And that he was communicating this to the prosecutors and even members of the press, asking them what should be the sentence.

Alas, more conjecture.

[Martinus]

For the sake of clarity - because there is a lot of confusion about it - there are, broadly speaking, three different arguments being advanced in Polanski's defense in relation to the judge's corruption - I will list them in the order from the one most acceptable to the one most outlandish.

1. Polanski's flight was justified because he feared he would not get a fair trial. Perhaps he was not acting reasonably but his panicky reaction to a prospect of a "court lynching" could be justified by mental instability resulting from his Holocaust experience. So he should not be sentenced for the crime of fleeing the court. 

2. The judge's corruption was not an exception, but just a symptom of a broader problem. The entire American justice system is corrupt like this, and it shows that Polanski would not - and cannot even today - get a fair trial with respect of the sentence he would receive.

3. The charges against Polanski's were fake. He is innocent.

[The Minsky Moment]

Even on rape charges, a reluctant witness is not at all unusual.  A colleague of mine was just dealing with a full-on violent rape by a stranger in the bushes, but the witness was still very reluctant and scared and the Crown did have to resort to a witness warrant at one point in the proceedings (she was fully co-operative at the end of the day however).

There is a difference between a witness who is frightened and reluctant but will tell the truth if compelled to show up and testify and one who is not so much scared of the perp as actively pissed off of the state for invading her privacy.

Which of these two categories is more applicable here remains to be seen.

[Martinus]

The issue as I understand it with Polanski was NOT that the judge was going to reject the plea, but that he was considering ignoring the joint sentencing recommendation of both sides and imposing more jail time under the plea.

Yeah that is my understanding as well. And that he was communicating this to the prosecutors and even members of the press, asking them what should be the sentence.

Alas, more conjecture.

Uhm, I don't think anyone who knows the case is questioning the fact that the judge's behaviour was grounds for his removal on bias grounds. 

[CountDeMoney]

The issue as I understand it with Polanski was NOT that the judge was going to reject the plea, but that he was considering ignoring the joint sentencing recommendation of both sides and imposing more jail time under the plea.

Yeah that is my understanding as well. And that he was communicating this to the prosecutors and even members of the press, asking them what should be the sentence.

Alas, more conjecture.

Uhm, I don't think anyone who knows the case is questioning the fact that the judge's behaviour was grounds for his removal on bias grounds. 

"Judge's behavior" = "judicial prerogative".

Damned activist judges.  We should dig up Judge Sirico while we're at it, and move to mistrial Watergate.

[CountDeMoney]

Just for giggles, how's all this playing out over on EUOT?  An Atlantic rift not seen since 2003?

[Martinus]

Damned activist judges.  We should dig up Judge Sirico while we're at it, and move to mistrial Watergate.

You lost me there. I think you are now being as unreasonable as the people who are arguing against his extradition. It is clear Polanski raped a 13 y.o. It is also clear that there was a serious misconduct from the judge during the trial, which somewhat excuses Polanski's flight (but not his original crime).

[The Minsky Moment]

1. Polanski's flight was justified because he feared he would not get a fair trial. This is imo not completely unjustified. . . . this argument would be used to defend him against charges of fleeing the court, not charges of the child rape.

It is unjustified.  He was entering a plea and thus faced no trial.  He had skilled counsel who were more than capable of taking and prosecuting an appeal.

2. The judge's corruption was not an exception, but just a symptom of a broader problem. The entire American justice system is corrupt like this, and it shows that Polanski would not - and cannot even today - get a fair trial with respect of the sentence he would receive.

From reading the plea agreement, it seems far more plausible that whatever corruption exists in the system worked to his benefit.  He got what appears on the surface to have been a pretty sweetheart deal from a starstruck Cal DA's office.  At worst he faced the prospect of a few more weeks or months if the judge decided to be a tough guy.  And maybe deportation as well, but flight hardly fixes that problem.

When one compares this to typical sentences received in similar kinds of cases, it is hard to see how he was being treated unfairly.

[The Minsky Moment]

Uhm, I don't think anyone who knows the case is questioning the fact that the judge's behaviour was grounds for his removal on bias grounds. 

Well the judge is dead and not here to defend himself; his accusers are busy getting themselves into movie documentaries.  I wouldn't rush to accept everything that is being said about the judge at face value.

[Martinus]

1. Polanski's flight was justified because he feared he would not get a fair trial. This is imo not completely unjustified. . . . this argument would be used to defend him against charges of fleeing the court, not charges of the child rape.

It is unjustified.  He was entering a plea and thus faced no trial.  He had skilled counsel who were more than capable of taking and prosecuting an appeal.

2. The judge's corruption was not an exception, but just a symptom of a broader problem. The entire American justice system is corrupt like this, and it shows that Polanski would not - and cannot even today - get a fair trial with respect of the sentence he would receive.

From reading the plea agreement, it seems far more plausible that whatever corruption exists in the system worked to his benefit.  He got what appears on the surface to have been a pretty sweetheart deal from a starstruck Cal DA's office.  At worst he faced the prospect of a few more weeks or months if the judge decided to be a tough guy.  And maybe deportation as well, but flight hardly fixes that problem.

When one compares this to typical sentences received in similar kinds of cases, it is hard to see how he was being treated unfairly.

Oh ok. I thought he would get like years in prison if the judge decided to go for the maximum penalty.

[Barrister]

There is a difference between a witness who is frightened and reluctant but will tell the truth if compelled to show up and testify and one who is not so much scared of the perp as actively pissed off of the state for invading her privacy.

Not really - these issues, plus about a dozen more you haven't mentioned (witness who will lie, witness who is afraid of getting on the stand, witness that doesn't like being told what to do, witness with her own emotional issues, and so on and so forth) all run together.  You don't get them all, but they are far from mutually exclusive.

[Barrister]

Uhm, I don't think anyone who knows the case is questioning the fact that the judge's behaviour was grounds for his removal on bias grounds. 

Actually I don't know a single soul (other than yourself) who *is* saying such a thing.

Care to link me up?

[Admiral Yi]

The judge can either accept or reject the plea

What does it mean if the judge rejects the plea?

[Martinus]

Uhm, I don't think anyone who knows the case is questioning the fact that the judge's behaviour was grounds for his removal on bias grounds. 

Actually I don't know a single soul (other than yourself) who *is* saying such a thing.

Care to link me up?

Do your own research. It has been mentioned in some of the links already posted in this thread (Faelin's for example) and I think is on Polanski's wiki page.

[CountDeMoney]

Do your own research.

I did.  The victim's had more anal sex than you.