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Dead Pool 2024

Started by Josephus, December 26, 2023, 09:53:51 AM

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crazy canuck

#60
For fuck sakes, can you be decent enough to keep your partisan politics out of this thread.

Josephus

Quote from: Barrister on March 01, 2024, 03:00:47 PMMentioned in the Canadian Politics thread, but - Rt Hon. Brian Mulroney.

Complicated figure in politics.  He won the biggest majority of all time - and the only Conservative* to win back-to-back majorities since Sir John A MacDonald.  His bringing in Free Trade with the US was transformative for Canada.

He also staked his legacy on two other matters - amending the constitution and bringing in the GST.  Amending the constitution crashed and burned spectacularly, twice, and directly led to a very near miss on Quebec leaving Canada.  The GST, which does still exist, was hugely unpopular.  It's no conincidence that after winning two majority governments, the PCs were then left lift all of two seats after Mulroney was done.

Mulroney was also dogged by allegations of corruption.  The Airbus scandal (where then-government-owner Air Canada purchased Airbus aircraft, rather than Boeings) was never proven, but always seemed highly suspicious.

He's left by his kids.  Caroline Mulroney is an Ontario cabinet member, his son Ben was a TV personality for a number of years.

Personally - I remember as a school kid argueing passionately in favour of free trade.  5 years later, in the first election I could vote in, I exulted in their defeat and the rise of my Reform Party.

But as always in death - I hope he rests in peace, and I feel sorrow for his family.


(*as I hinted at - he was a Progressive Conservative, although that party later merged to form the now-just-Conservative Party.  Just as I would never consider myself to be a Tory, Mulroney was never a Conservative).

Good summary BB.
Civis Romanus Sum

"My friends, love is better than anger. Hope is better than fear. Optimism is better than despair. So let us be loving, hopeful and optimistic. And we'll change the world." Jack Layton 1950-2011

Barrister

Quote from: crazy canuck on March 01, 2024, 03:33:44 PMFor fuck sakes, can you be decent enough to keep your partisan politics out of this thread.

What. The. Fuck.

I thought I was incredibly respectful of Mulroney.  I myself don't hate the man - he had a complicated and interesting legacy.  I went back to look at my post - I don't see what was objectionable.  he was a man who had the biggest majority in Canadian history - then 9 years later saw his party reduced to 2 seats in Parliament.  His history prior to becoming Prime Minister (which I didn't even go into) is equally fascinating.  He was a labour lawyer and business man - not a "career politician".  He only became an MP after becoming PC Leader, and then became Prime Minister shortly thereafter.  He also led to melding the PC party with soft-Quebec-nationalists which was part of his huge majority.  His downfall led to the ride of the BQ (like, directly - a bunch of his MPs quite and formed the BQ) which has dominated Quebec federal politics ever since.

To the extent I mentioned partisan politics, it was referencing things from 30 years ago and more just a matter of historical record.  You, of all people, keep wanting me to "acknowledge my biases".

I really do get the feeling you just don't like me, CC.

RIP Brian Mulroney.
Posts here are my own private opinions.  I do not speak for my employer.

crazy canuck

"Mulroney was never a Conservative"  Fuck off

Barrister

Quote from: crazy canuck on March 01, 2024, 05:02:54 PM"Mulroney was never a Conservative"  Fuck off

He was a Progressive Conservative - not a Conservative.  (you'll note I capitalized the word, to indicate party affiliation)

I mean - that's kind of a matter of historical record, dude.

You'll note he was never really embraced by the modern Conservative Party.  I think Mulroney and Harper for example have met, but never prominently.  Mulroney was too toxic a figure even decades later - and remember Harper made his bones in the Reform Party that helped defeat the PCs back in 1993 (quite literally - Harper was elected as an MP in 1993).  Poilievre didn't have quite the same baggage but still also came from the same Reform wing of the party.  I don't recall that Mulroney, despite being a former Prime Minister, ever addressed a Conservative Party conference or convention.  Just as one example.

So maybe, you know, you can just fuck off instead.  :)
Posts here are my own private opinions.  I do not speak for my employer.

Tonitrus

Quote from: crazy canuck on March 01, 2024, 03:33:44 PMFor fuck sakes, can you be decent enough to keep your partisan politics out of this thread.

Decency?  In a thread based on speculating when people will die?  :hmm: 

viper37

#66
Quote from: Barrister on March 01, 2024, 03:00:47 PMMulroney was never a Conservativ
He was very much a Conservative.  He was in fact, leader of that party from 1983 until 1993 when he resigned.  Economically speaking, he did a lot of good, courageous things for Canada after the debacle that where the Trudeau years.

What he never was however, was a conservative.  And that was also a very good, a very courageous thing to do.  But I was way too young to notice that at the time.

He was corrupt though.  For reasons that are his alone and I won't speculate.
I don't do meditation.  I drink alcohol to relax, like normal people.

If Microsoft Excel decided to stop working overnight, the world would practically end.

viper37

#67
Quote from: Barrister on March 01, 2024, 05:14:35 PMI don't recall that Mulroney, despite being a former Prime Minister, ever addressed a Conservative Party conference or convention.  Just as one example.
He was a militant to the Progressive-Conservative Party since his time in Laval University up to his departure in 1993.

His last years where mired in scandals, and 7 months later, Kim Campbell would suffer an atrocious defeat where the party would be soundly defeated and left with only 2 MPs and no leader in the House of Commons.  Shortly there after, one the MPs resigned, leaving Jean Charest alone who was nominated as head of the Progressive-Conservative party.

Then, there came all the revelations about Airbus.  And we learn that Mulroney accepted a... cash payment of 300 000$ from them for his lobbying, that he simply forgot to mention to Revenu Canada (now CRA).  But he had no choice, he had to support his family...

Considering all this, he was toxic.  There was no way he could be a guest speaker at any party convention of a party fighting for relevance.

Now, also of note, when the party merged with the Canadian Alliance to create the modern Conservative Party, it wasn't all joy for everyone.  There was some controversy and some opposition from the old Tory guard, some people close to Mulroney too.

Stephen Harper did not like Mulroney and I don't think he liked him.  I can't see the relevance of having Mulroney at a party convention. 

Might as well invite Jagmeet Singh to talk about modern fiscal policies the next party convention, he'd be less controversial.


Edit:
When to verify Wikipedia.  Stephen Harper ordered an inquiry board on Brian Mulroney in 2008 about the cash payments he received while he was still a MP for Charlevoix.
I don't do meditation.  I drink alcohol to relax, like normal people.

If Microsoft Excel decided to stop working overnight, the world would practically end.

Josquius

2024 is being cruel on Japanese geeks.
Last month we lost Yoshitaka Murayama, creator of suikoden.
And then just yesterday it was Akira Toriyama of Dragon Ball and Chrono Trigger fame.
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Duque de Bragan├ža

:(

2023 had Leiji Matsumoto (Albator for the francophones Captain Harlock for anglos).

RIP Akira Toriyama

PS I probably watched or read more Dr. Slump than Dragon Ball Z. Same goes for video games such as Dragon Quest and Chrono Trigger vs DBZ.

crazy canuck

Quote from: Tonitrus on March 01, 2024, 10:12:33 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on March 01, 2024, 03:33:44 PMFor fuck sakes, can you be decent enough to keep your partisan politics out of this thread.

Decency?  In a thread based on speculating when people will die?  :hmm: 

Ha, fair point

viper37

Konstantin Koltsov.  Former Belarussian NHL player, married to a Belarussian tennis player, Aryna Sabalenka, the daugther of Sergey Sabalenka, another hockey player who died in 2019, aged 42.

Death by suicide, apparently.  Jumped from a balcony in a Miami hotel.  Police found nothing suspicious.  He was 43.

I'm always a little bit paranoid when it involves Russians or Belarussians committing suicide by jumping from balconies or windows...

I don't do meditation.  I drink alcohol to relax, like normal people.

If Microsoft Excel decided to stop working overnight, the world would practically end.

Caliga

Quote from: viper37 on March 19, 2024, 12:01:24 PMI'm always a little bit paranoid when it involves Russians or Belarussians committing suicide by jumping from balconies or windows...
:hmm: Did he recently make any public comments about Putin's glorious, completely legitimate election victory?
0 Ed Anger Disapproval Points

viper37

No idea.  But there's been other hockey players who died in weird accidents, IIRC.
I don't do meditation.  I drink alcohol to relax, like normal people.

If Microsoft Excel decided to stop working overnight, the world would practically end.

viper37

Chris Simon, former NHL player.  Strong man, but talented hockey player too, not just a goon.

Died by suicide at 52.  Former Quebec city Nordiques and Avalanche player.  :(

He will be missed.
QuoteFormer NHL player Chris Simon dies by suicide at 52 and CTE is suspected in his death, family says
Link
I don't do meditation.  I drink alcohol to relax, like normal people.

If Microsoft Excel decided to stop working overnight, the world would practically end.