Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

Started by OttoVonBismarck, May 02, 2022, 08:02:53 PM

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Josquius

Quote from: Syt on May 03, 2022, 03:21:02 AM
Quote from: Josquius on May 03, 2022, 02:32:45 AMAmazing, in 2022 they've decided not enough women are dying and need to go back to the 50s

What rankles me, is that the same anti-abortionists cease their support as soon as the child is in the world. Can't afford support yourself and your kid? Shouldn't have gotten pregnant. Uninsured and have to pay the doctors etc. for the delivery? Shouldn't have gotten pregnant. Can't afford to take time off work after birth, and have no one to look after your kid? Shouldn't have gotten pregnant. Also, we'll make sure you have limited access to contraceptives. You slut.

OTT Calvinism is also likely heavily to blame here. Same kind of shit that leads to being pro global warming.
It's those kids god designed destiny to live short lives of misery and suffering! How dare those arrogant doctors interfere in gods plan!
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Sheilbh

Quote from: Jacob on May 03, 2022, 11:28:34 AMLooks like the vast right wing conspiracy is really delivering the goods.
Yes - and all of those "but Gorsuch" voters were right in their gamble and they got what they wanted. Mitch McConnell and Trump delivered what's been the priority goal for Republicans since Nixon and the Warren court.

I'd add that McConnell's statement here about the leak is far more robust than anything I saw from leading Democrats about, say, Coney Barrett proceeding with indecent haste or Ginni Thomas (the most I saw on that was that Thomas should recuse himself - truly the "hopes and prayers" of the politics of the Supreme Court):


QuoteAnd it's only tangentially a "culture war" issue, but think about Obamacare, how vociferously it was fought, yet a decade later there's no serious moves to repeal or replace it anymore.
Also - and I know I harp on this - legislation which is difficult to repeal and involves public votes by publicly accountable figures, not placing all your eggs in the rights-based, court-focused approach. Which was a particularly daft decision given that Democrats/the left seem to only have an intermittent interest in the Supreme Court while it's been the core focus of the right for the last 50 years.
Let's bomb Russia!

Zoupa

Relax guys. Susan Collins told us she confirmed Gorsuch, Kavanaugh and Barrett because they wouldn't overturn Roe v Wade.

She wouldn't lie to you.

CountDeMoney

Quote from: Jacob on May 03, 2022, 11:43:49 AM
Quote from: Barrister on May 03, 2022, 11:31:01 AMGay rights and gay marriage.

They're coming for this.

Yup.  It's still balled up in the whole anti-LGBTQ "war on sexual deviancy," coming soon to a school board near you.

Quote
QuoteSegregation.

QuoteThey'll nibble at the corners here too. Not in a straight up "it's public policy", but in support of "voluntary" / "exclusive membership" segregation.

Rolling back voting rights is already part of that.  Disenfranchisement IS segregation.


Quote
QuoteGambling.
Sunday shopping.

Yeah this is settled, I agree. But while this is a fundamentalist Christian position, it's never been part of the culture war. That was settled before the Evangelical Right was even founded, and that's what kicked off the culture war as a political concern.

The only thing that trumps Christian values is capitalist values.

Quote
QuoteAnd it's only tangentially a "culture war" issue, but think about Obamacare, how vociferously it was fought, yet a decade later there's no serious moves to repeal or replace it anymore.

Obamacare was fought vociferously because the GOP oppose the Democrats reflexively nd because they hate Obama specifically. It was also opposed because it's against GOP orthodoxy to do anything helpful for poor people, unless it can be limited to helping only poor white people (and even then it's a stretch). But it was never part of the culture war in any way, except if you extend the concept to cover every conflict between the GOP and the Democrats.


They only stopped voting against it when their last gasps were done.  Not for a lack of trying.  It took Johnny Hero one last bombing run, and how many trips to the Supreme Court did it go through?  They'll break it over time.

Barrister

Seen speculation on who leaker (or at least - which "side").

Speculation "the left" leaked it is thus: try to generate political outrage ahead of the decision itself to try and peel off one or two votes prior to it being official.

Speculation "the right" leaked it: by putting the maximalist draft position out there, any deviations from the draft will be painfully obvious.  So trying to force right-leaning Justice to support the draft as is, rather than "water it down".

Which is true I have no idea.  But definitely someone with an agenda - you don't leave these things lying on the bench at a bust stop.
Quote from: crazy canuckBB's treatment is consistent with one who defends positions taken by the conservative wing of the Conservatives.

The Larch

Quote from: Sheilbh on May 03, 2022, 11:57:48 AMI'd add that McConnell's statement here about the leak is far more robust than anything I saw from leading Democrats about, say, Coney Barrett proceeding with indecent haste or Ginni Thomas (the most I saw on that was that Thomas should recuse himself - truly the "hopes and prayers" of the politics of the Supreme Court):

McConnell of all people should be pretty silent in any defense of "judicial independence", given that he was the one who completely broke it.

Sheilbh

Quote from: Barrister on May 03, 2022, 12:05:36 PMSeen speculation on who leaker (or at least - which "side").
Also speculation it's Roberts to try and show the outrage now to encourage some of them towards his position as the more restrained/truly conservative opinion.
Let's bomb Russia!

Syt

If we want to prevent catastrophic economic and societal change we will have to radically change our climate system.

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Syt

If we want to prevent catastrophic economic and societal change we will have to radically change our climate system.

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

Valmy

Quote from: Barrister on May 03, 2022, 12:05:36 PMSeen speculation on who leaker (or at least - which "side").

Speculation "the left" leaked it is thus: try to generate political outrage ahead of the decision itself to try and peel off one or two votes prior to it being official.

Speculation "the right" leaked it: by putting the maximalist draft position out there, any deviations from the draft will be painfully obvious.  So trying to force right-leaning Justice to support the draft as is, rather than "water it down".

Which is true I have no idea.  But definitely someone with an agenda - you don't leave these things lying on the bench at a bust stop.

Oh the big right wing culture warrior talking point is how this leak is a leftwing insurrection and we are going to see violence and civil war and FEAR! HATE! FEAR! HATE!

The usual.

Though if this is going to lead to violence and civil war I don't see what difference it makes if this is leaked now or announced later.

But man even when they win they don't stop being outraged. It's so tiresome man.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Jacob

Quote from: The Larch on May 03, 2022, 12:06:53 PMMcConnell of all people should be pretty silent in any defense of "judicial independence", given that he was the one who completely broke it.

Attack your own weakness.

Syt

Quote from: Jacob on May 03, 2022, 12:17:55 PM
Quote from: The Larch on May 03, 2022, 12:06:53 PMMcConnell of all people should be pretty silent in any defense of "judicial independence", given that he was the one who completely broke it.

Attack your own weakness.

As we say in Germany: "What I think and what I do I suspect of others too!" :P
If we want to prevent catastrophic economic and societal change we will have to radically change our climate system.

Proud owner of 42 Zoupa Points.

crazy canuck

Quote from: Valmy on May 03, 2022, 12:16:22 PM
Quote from: Barrister on May 03, 2022, 12:05:36 PMSeen speculation on who leaker (or at least - which "side").

Speculation "the left" leaked it is thus: try to generate political outrage ahead of the decision itself to try and peel off one or two votes prior to it being official.

Speculation "the right" leaked it: by putting the maximalist draft position out there, any deviations from the draft will be painfully obvious.  So trying to force right-leaning Justice to support the draft as is, rather than "water it down".

Which is true I have no idea.  But definitely someone with an agenda - you don't leave these things lying on the bench at a bust stop.

Oh the big right wing culture warrior talking point is how this leak is a leftwing insurrection and we are going to see violence and civil war and FEAR! HATE! FEAR! HATE!

The usual.

Though if this is going to lead to violence and civil war I don't see what difference it makes if this is leaked now or announced later.

But man even when they win they don't stop being outraged. It's so tiresome man.

If this was leaked by a person supportive of the draft in order to cobble together support, and the Supreme Court majority does not overturn R v. W - then I think the chances of seeing violence go up exponentially.
I want you to panic

https://www.theguardian.com/science/video/2019/jan/25/i-want-you-to-panic-16-year-old-greta-thunberg-issues-climate-warning-at-davos-video

"Woke" is now almost exclusively used by those who seek to deride it, those who chafe at the activism from which it sprang. Opponents to the idea are seeking to render it toxic. They use it to stand in for change itself, for evolution, for an accurate assessment of history and society that makes them uncomfortable and deflates their hagiographic view of American history.

Valmy

Quote from: Sheilbh on May 03, 2022, 12:09:02 PM
Quote from: Barrister on May 03, 2022, 12:05:36 PMSeen speculation on who leaker (or at least - which "side").
Also speculation it's Roberts to try and show the outrage now to encourage some of them towards his position as the more restrained/truly conservative opinion.

If so Mike Huckabee owes the left an apology!
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."

Valmy

Quote from: crazy canuck on May 03, 2022, 12:21:21 PM
Quote from: Valmy on May 03, 2022, 12:16:22 PM
Quote from: Barrister on May 03, 2022, 12:05:36 PMSeen speculation on who leaker (or at least - which "side").

Speculation "the left" leaked it is thus: try to generate political outrage ahead of the decision itself to try and peel off one or two votes prior to it being official.

Speculation "the right" leaked it: by putting the maximalist draft position out there, any deviations from the draft will be painfully obvious.  So trying to force right-leaning Justice to support the draft as is, rather than "water it down".

Which is true I have no idea.  But definitely someone with an agenda - you don't leave these things lying on the bench at a bust stop.

Oh the big right wing culture warrior talking point is how this leak is a leftwing insurrection and we are going to see violence and civil war and FEAR! HATE! FEAR! HATE!

The usual.

Though if this is going to lead to violence and civil war I don't see what difference it makes if this is leaked now or announced later.

But man even when they win they don't stop being outraged. It's so tiresome man.

If this was leaked by a person supportive of the draft in order to cobble together support, and the Supreme Court majority does not overturn R v. W - then I think the chances of seeing violence go up exponentially.

It's abortion. There are going to be protests with high emotion either way. Violence has always come along with this issue.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."