Violence against women

[Barrister]

And on the choking thing there's been a spate of deaths that haven't resulted in convictions on the "rough sex"/"sex that got out of hand" that basically all involve choking. I think the law's been changed to explicitly deal with that.

So in Canada we've long had three different levels of assault.  s. 266 is simple assault - using physical force against another person.

s. 267 (which carries a higher punishment) was divided into s. 267(a) - assault with a weapon, and s. 267(b), assault causing bodily harm (defined as serious pain or hurt).

The highest level is s. 268 aggravated assault, which typically endangers the life of the victim.

But after the law being like that for decades two years ago we brought in s. 267(c) - choking.  So it's deemed to be a more serious charge even if there is no pain or injury.

[Maximus]

IMO not having a solution does not excuse us from taking responsibility for the problem. Asking what the solution is is a good question, but IMO that needs to be the start of a conversation, not the end of it.

I was saying the opposite. Yes we should all take personal responsibility for it but just like global warming it has only a tiny impact on the overall problem unfortunately.

Well two things:

I think this goes beyond personal responsibility and into taking responsibility for a problem that we likely didn't create, but we are needed to fix.

Just because individual action is ineffective doesn't mean individuals are powerless.

Both of these incidentally also apply to climate change, racial justice, and probably a whole lot of other problems.

[Barrister]

Yeah hitting your wife and kids was considered a normal thing to do just a few decades ago.

I would need to see some evidence violence against women is higher than it was back in, say, the 1980s before I start blaming the internet.

Oh, I'm pretty sure the absolute level of violence against women has gone down over the decades.

It's more a question of the types of violence used.

[Valmy]

IMO not having a solution does not excuse us from taking responsibility for the problem. Asking what the solution is is a good question, but IMO that needs to be the start of a conversation, not the end of it.

I was saying the opposite. Yes we should all take personal responsibility for it but just like global warming it has only a tiny impact on the overall problem unfortunately.

Well two things:

I think this goes beyond personal responsibility and into taking responsibility for a problem that we likely didn't create, but we are needed to fix.

Just because individual action is ineffective doesn't mean individuals are powerless.

Both of these incidentally also apply to climate change, racial justice, and probably a whole lot of other problems.

I 100% agree. Just stating the reality of the situation. I think the main difference between this and global warming is that many big solutions are out there to do, we just do not know how to gather the political capital to get them implemented. There are no big solutions, at least as obvious as the global warming thing, to this violence problem.

But in both cases we have a big individual responsibility to do our best, even if the problem requires a more systemic solution to really be effective.

[Maximus]

I think the main difference between this and global warming is that many big solutions are out there to do, we just do not know how to gather the political capital to get them implemented. There are no big solutions, at least as obvious as the global warming thing, to this violence problem.

That's fair.

To drill down on that a bit, I think the difference is that this is an entirely social problem, whereas climate change is partially a physical problem. We've solved the physical part of it, at least partly, so we have potential solutions.

With gendered violence there's no physical component so it's a lot harder to develop solutions. Or maybe social scientists have solutions and we just don't trust them like we do physical scientists.

[jimmy olsen]

Unconscionable 
https://t.co/j50l6a4ZxE

Riders watched as a woman was raped on a SEPTA train but no one called 911, police say.

"It may have been stopped sooner if a rider called 911," authorities said of the sexual assault.

Oct. 17, 2021, 12:36 AM KST
By Nicole Acevedo
A 35-year-old man in Pennsylvania is facing rape and assault charges after a woman was sexually assaulted on board a public transit train Wednesday night as riders witnessed the attack but did not intervene, authorities said on Friday.

The woman was assaulted at around 11 p.m. while riding the Southeastern Pennsylvania Transportation Authority (SEPTA) Market-Frankford line towards the town of Upper Darby.

"The assault was observed by a SEPTA employee, who called 911, enabling SEPTA officers to respond immediately and apprehend the suspect in the act," Andrew Busch, a SEPTA spokesperson, said in a statement.

SEPTA officers arrested the man, later identified as 35-year-old Fiston Ngoy, according to Upper Darby Police Superintendent Timothy Bernhardt.

Surveillance video captured the entirety of the assault, giving investigators enough evidence to charge Ngoy with rape and assault, Bernhardt told NBC Philadelphia.

The video also shows how riders, who also witnessed the attack, did nothing to help the woman being assaulted, according to Bernhardt.

"It's disturbing," he said. "I'm shocked, I have no words for it. I just can't imagine seeing what you were seeing through your own eyes and seeing what this woman was going through that no one would step in and help her."

Investigators are also reviewing the videos in an effort to determine who was there and interview possible witnesses, Bernhardt added.

Bernhardt told NBC Philadelphia that he spoke to the woman on Friday and said she was doing okay after being taken to a hospital to be treated for her injuries following the assault.

Upper Darby police continues leading the investigation into the rape with assistance from SEPTA Transit Police. Investigators are also urging anyone who witnessed the attack to contact the authorities.

SEPTA is also urging possible witnesses to contact the authorities.

"The rape that occurred on SEPTA's Market-Frankford Line Wednesday night (Oct. 13) was a horrendous criminal act," Busch said. "There were other people on the train who witnessed this horrific act, and it may have been stopped sooner if a rider called 911."

"SEPTA urges anyone who observes a crime being committed or any dangerous situation occurring to report it. Anyone witnessing an emergency should immediately call 911," he added.

Ngoy remains in jail unable to post bail, NBC Philadelphia reported.

[Berkut]

THe human ability to ignore what is happening right in front of them is kind of astounding.

I wonder if this goes into a lot of how mob mentality works - even when you are part of the mob, you don't really connect that what you are doing and seeing is part of the larger reality, which allows people to go along with things they would normally never do?

[DGuller]

When it comes to diffusion of responsibility, I can't bring myself to condemn other people until I know I walked a mile in their shoes.  If it happens often enough, it means that something is going on that makes that happen.  Until I'm in that situation and act differently, I won't act superior to those who have been put in that situation and didn't.

[Berkut]

I have been in a couple situations where after the first moment of shock, I reacted and wondered why nobody else was doing anything until I told them to help me. It kind of baffled me in both cases, why nobody was doing anything.

I have no idea if that would translate into THIS particular situation.

[The Brain]

I don't know who the other riders were. If there was say a group of three grown men who were buddies then not doing anything seems bizarre. If there were two 100lb women who didn't know each other then getting into or risking getting into a fight (if he hears you calling 911 will he come over for some facetime with you?) with an obviously very dangerous grown man in an enclosed space without immediate assistance or escape might seem a wee bit daunting. Were there children around? There are a number of factors that come into play when you're facing a potentially life or death situation.

My guess though is that there were plenty of people around who could reasonably have intervened, or the police guy wouldn't be shocked.

[Eddie Teach]

I suspect many couldn't process what was happening.