Cancel Culture Conversation Not Cancelled

[Valmy]

Was Milo Yianopolous a victim of cancel culture?

I know he got banned from twitter and there was something about pedophilia but I am not clear if he was a practitioner or just a fan. How much farther that went I don't know.

I will point out he is a provocateur and a celebrity not just some ordinary person.

[Razgovory]

"Cancel culture" is just a ridiculous smear of the long accepted art of the boycott. MLK and the civil rights leaders of the 60s were all about canceling politicians, businesses and organizations that were on the other side and they were right to do so.

I think when people refer to cancel culture, they usually refer to individuals who are not public figures suffering the wrath of Twitter.  There is nothing admirable about it.  It's the worst kind of behavior humanity has to offer, and the fact that it's dressed up as a noble act in defense of justice just adds insult on top of injury.

I think it means Democrats were impeached Trump twice.  I think this because that's what Republicans said it was.

[Jacob]

I know he got banned from twitter and there was something about pedophilia but I am not clear if he was a practitioner or just a fan. How much farther that went I don't know.

I will point out he is a provocateur and a celebrity not just some ordinary person.

Ah, I didn't realize that made a difference. I'll admit to being a bit unclear on the boundaries between generic internet hate mobs, ordinary "and here are the consequences of my actions" situations, and genuine examples of cancel culture.

[HVC]

I know he got banned from twitter and there was something about pedophilia but I am not clear if he was a practitioner or just a fan. How much farther that went I don't know.

I will point out he is a provocateur and a celebrity not just some ordinary person.

Ah, I didn't realize that made a difference. I'll admit to being a bit unclear on the boundaries between generic internet hate mobs, ordinary "and here are the consequences of my actions" situations, and genuine examples of cancel culture.

i think the defining line where normal* people have an issue with cancel culture is where joe shmo gets canceled. where they dox a person to get them fired and basically try to ruin their life

*as opposed to someone in public life who says something dumb and faces the repercussions.

[Admiral Yi]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gfzVJvTgMi8

Here's an "ordinary Schmoe" that lost his job because he smacked an Uber driver.

I don't think it's as simple as ordinary Schmoe vs. public figure.

[Threviel]

Perhaps it's as easy as a convenient way for companies to identify idiots, like that Taco Bell guy, that slip through the normal company net.

[garbon]

I know he got banned from twitter and there was something about pedophilia but I am not clear if he was a practitioner or just a fan. How much farther that went I don't know.

I will point out he is a provocateur and a celebrity not just some ordinary person.

Ah, I didn't realize that made a difference. I'll admit to being a bit unclear on the boundaries between generic internet hate mobs, ordinary "and here are the consequences of my actions" situations, and genuine examples of cancel culture.

i think the defining line where normal* people have an issue with cancel culture is where joe shmo gets canceled. where they dox a person to get them fired and basically try to ruin their life

*as opposed to someone in public life who says something dumb and faces the repercussions.

I'm feeling deja vu but where does it sit if people are working to get day those white ladies who called cops on innocent black people?

[DGuller]

I think it means Democrats were impeached Trump twice.  I think this because that's what Republicans said it was.

Just because Fox News gets their hands on the phrase doesn't mean that what the phrase used to describe doesn't exist.  I think it would be counterproductive to let our language be controlled by propaganda psychopaths.  The euphemism treadmill can't spin fast enough to stay ahead of right wing perversions, so I think it would be more productive to just ignore the right wing. 

It's also productive to remember that if the left does something wrong, the right can still criticize it, they don't have to be perfectly wrong every time.  Just because the right wing criticizes something doesn't mean that what their criticism is about is complete bullshit.

[DGuller]

We have gradations of punishment in the criminal justice system, even for wrong things that people actually did do.  In our criminal code, not every crime is punishable by mob lynching, and there is also due process before the punishment is carried out.  I think the reasons behind this state of affairs are not just due to some esoteric legal concepts, but also because it's just a good policy in general that might be translatable to Twitter justice system as well.

[HVC]

I'm feeling deja vu but where does it sit if people are working to get day those white ladies who called cops on innocent black people?

what would happen to them before twitter? charged with false police reporting?

I personally don't have a horse in the race. I don't think cancel culture is wide spread enough to have a panic over it. I hear more about people bemoaning the effects of cancel culture way more then i hear about actual incidents of cancel culture.

What i was trying to do, and it appears not in the clearest way, is separate public personas complaining that they're losing jobs or advertisement over the consequences of their actions and trying to blame cancel culture. 

[DGuller]

I personally don't have a horse in the race. I don't think cancel culture is wide spread enough to have a panic over it. I hear more about people bemoaning the effects of cancel culture way more then i hear about actual incidents of cancel culture.

The cancel culture has two very bad parts to it.  The first part is obvious, some Joe Schmoe who may or may not be a nice person has their life ruined because a mob of justice warriors are in the mood to destroy someone.  The second part is far more insidious:  people start self-censoring themselves because they know that they'll be unemployable before they even have a chance to defend themselves or provide context.  I realize some people think the second part is a good thing, and that is what truly scares me.

[garbon]

Somethings people should censor themselves on... and in fact, it has always been the case that one has to temper certain views to be employable and participate in society.

[DGuller]

Somethings people should censor themselves on... and in fact, it has always been the case that one has to temper certain views to be employable and participate in society.

Equally true  in the US and North Korea.

[garbon]

Somethings people should censor themselves on... and in fact, it has always been the case that one has to temper certain views to be employable and participate in society.

Equally true  in the US and North Korea.

Well yes, there can be extremes. Not sure we need the slippery slope though given again we are really just looking at something people have done throughout history.

[HVC]

Garbon, do you think the nuclear option should be used for every incident? you imply that canceling is a valid option for false police reports. Is there escalation of punishment in your view? What's the next level up from trying to ruin someone's life?