Quo Vadis GOP?

[Admiral Yi]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zlb3NJW310w

Apparently MyPillow is running for head of the RNC.

[Valmy]

Yeah I keep hearing prophets of doom insisting that the Republicans are going to become sane again and then they will easily reconquer Arizona and Georgia and then we will be vanquished by a new era of red glory.

Well not looking like sanity is going to prevail any time soon.

[Barrister]

Yeah I keep hearing prophets of doom insisting that the Republicans are going to become sane again and then they will easily reconquer Arizona and Georgia and then we will be vanquished by a new era of red glory.

Well not looking like sanity is going to prevail any time soon.

I'm going to quibble with the word "insane".

There is a string of what appears to be legit mental illness running through the GOP.  It starts with Trump of course, but includes figures like MTG, Boebert, Matt Gaetz, Herschel Walker.

But then you have a bunch of politicians who are taking policy decisions I don't like, and are happy to saddle up to the crazy, but don't appear to be crazy themselves.  DeSantis, McCarthy and a lot of others in this category.

I think the GOP will push back more against the crazy when Trump is well and truly done (whenever that may be) - but the GOP or Reagan and the Bushes is not coming back.  The new GOP is going to take a lot of lessons from this era - it'll be more nativist, more concerned with "culture wars", less interested in fiscal policy - but more sane.

Take whatever hope and/or fear from that you will.

[Zanza]

[Valmy]

I will believe it when I see it.

The problem is the crazy sells. The people hate the billionaires and the big corporations and the government and how they are all in bed together, so the anti-establishment paranoid shit gets votes. The culture war stuff is a big winner inside the 30% or so of the country that is culturally conservative but that is an ever shrinking group. They can't win without the crazy. Probably can't win with it either, but there we go.

[Barrister]

I will believe it when I see it.

The problem is the crazy sells. The people hate the billionaires and the big corporations and the government and how they are all in bed together, so the anti-establishment paranoid shit gets votes. The culture war stuff is a big winner inside the 30% or so of the country that is culturally conservative but that is an ever shrinking group. They can't win without the crazy. Probably can't win with it either, but there we go.

"The crazy" doesn't sell.  But yes, the anti-establishment, anti-big corporations, culture war stuff does.  Oh and don't forget the performative cruelty - that also sells.

And to be clear - this isn't the kind of evolution I want in right-wing politics!  But it is what I think we will get.

[Valmy]

"The crazy" doesn't sell.  But yes, the anti-establishment, anti-big corporations, culture war stuff does.  Oh and don't forget the performative cruelty - that also sells.

I guess I have a hard time imagining a non-crazy version of this. I guess that is DeSantis isn't it? I think he is going down hard in the Primary, I guess time will tell. But even DeSantis has to at least pretend he thinks the elections are rigged right?

[Sheilbh]

I guess I have a hard time imagining a non-crazy version of this. I guess that is DeSantis isn't it? I think he is going down hard in the Primary, I guess time will tell. But even DeSantis has to at least pretend he thinks the elections are rigged right?

I think he just had a line about the difference between him and Trump is that he gets re-elected - which doesn't work if he's still saying the election was rigged.

And I think weak and loser are the right attack lines against Trump.

[Barrister]

"The crazy" doesn't sell.  But yes, the anti-establishment, anti-big corporations, culture war stuff does.  Oh and don't forget the performative cruelty - that also sells.

I guess I have a hard time imagining a non-crazy version of this. I guess that is DeSantis isn't it? I think he is going down hard in the Primary, I guess time will tell. But even DeSantis has to at least pretend he thinks the elections are rigged right?

I don't think we'll see a President DeSantis - or even a GOP nominee DeSantis.

But yes, I think he's showing the way.

You'll note than in the mid-terms, almost all losing GOP candidates accepted their results.  Kari Lake in Arizona (who is definitely in the crazy wing) is the only one claiming she won.  Election denying is part of the "crazy".

[Jacob]

It'd be an improvement if accepting the outcome of elections becomes standard for the GOP again.

[Barrister]

It'd be an improvement if accepting the outcome of elections becomes standard for the GOP again.

But it'll come with attempting to restrict access to voting...

[Valmy]

It'd be an improvement if accepting the outcome of elections becomes standard for the GOP again.

But it'll come with attempting to restrict access to voting...

The weird part about that is they are currently throwing a fit about mail-in voting. Making big moves to keep rural voters, elderly, and military service people from voting? Are they nuts?

[Syt]

https://www.wsj.com/articles/billionaire-charles-koch-backed-group-will-push-gop-to-move-past-donald-trump-11675570703

Billionaire Charles Koch-Backed Group Will Push GOP to Move Past Donald Trump

Americans for Prosperity wants presidential candidate 'who can win' in 2024

WASHINGTON—A group funded by billionaire Charles Koch will work to support a Republican presidential nominee other than Donald Trump, concluding in a strategy memo that "we need to turn the page on the past."

The organization, Americans for Prosperity, has stayed out of the last two presidential cycles but has concluded it needs to engage now as Mr. Trump mounts his third consecutive White House run. The memo released Sunday doesn't mention the former president by name but is unambiguous in its purpose.

"To write a new chapter for our country, we need to turn the page on the past," the document reads. "So the best thing for the country would be to have a president in 2025 who represents a new chapter. The American people have shown that they're ready to move on, and so AFP will help them do that."

A spokesman for Mr. Trump didn't immediately respond to a request for comment.

Mr. Trump is the only declared Republican candidate but former South Carolina Gov. Nikki Haley is expected to enter the race on Feb. 15 with more expected to follow, likely including former Vice President Mike Pence and Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis, among others. The former president remains the front-runner but some polls have shown Mr. DeSantis especially strong in a hypothetical primary.

AFP didn't say how much it would spend but boasts of a large grass-roots and data operation. "The states with some of our strongest and most effective state chapters are the same ones that will play a crucial role in nominating the next Republican presidential candidate," reads the memo, written by CEO Emily Seidel.

A related super political-action committee, AFP Action, "is prepared to support a candidate in the Republican presidential primary who can lead our country forward, and who can win," the memo stated.

AFP was founded in 2004 by businessmen Charles and David Koch and has been one of the best-funded political organizations since then, helping fuel the tea party movement that preceded Mr. Trump's rise. David Koch died in 2019.

Mr. Trump has been critical of the Kochs, branding them globalists and a "total joke," within a GOP he infused with more populist and isolationist policies.

The group also said it would wade into congressional primaries earlier than it has in the past, arguing the GOP is "nominating bad candidates who are advocating for things that go against core American principles" while Democrats yield more to liberals who now animate the party. Trump-backed candidates lost some key Senate and governor races in 2022 after winning competitive GOP primaries.

"This means the country is in a downward spiral, with both parties reinforcing the bad behavior of the other," the memo reads. "And to make matters worse, very few voters participate in primaries—and that's where these candidates are chosen. This makes it impossible to get good things done in Washington."

AFP Action spent roughly $80 million in the 2022 election cycle, according to the campaign finance tracking website OpenSecrets.

[Valmy]

Oh boy it's that asshole again.

[Syt]

Democrat Josh Harder:

https://twitter.com/JoshHarder/status/1622777880257216525