Alabama abortion ban: Republican state senate passes most restrictive law in US

[Syt]

https://local.theonion.com/woman-walking-alone-at-night-picks-up-pace-after-spotti-1834815925?utm_content=Main&utm_medium=SocialMarketing&utm_campaign=SF&utm_source=Twitter&__twitter_impression=true

Woman Walking Alone At Night Picks Up Pace After Spotting Truck Full Of Alabama Lawmakers Slowly Following Her

MONTGOMERY, AL—Quickening her pace as the vehicle flashed its brights, Alabama woman Alison Kyles, 29, reportedly hurried towards home Thursday after spotting a pickup truck full of Alabama lawmakers slowly following her. "At first, I thought I was just being paranoid when I saw that old Chevy full of state legislators creeping along behind me a few blocks back, but then they turned down the same alleyway as me and I started to panic," said Kyles, who glanced over her shoulder in visible distress as she heard Senator Clyde Chambliss repeatedly revving the truck's engine. "They're clearly riled up after a day of legislating and are just out to cause some trouble. Oh, God, I think that's Del Marsh leaning out of the passenger window and trying to holler something at me. Christ, I'm just going to keep my head down and hope all of them pass me by." At press time, Kyles had broken into a full-on sprint after realizing in horror that she had accidentally turned onto the street directly in front of the Alabama State House.

[The Minsky Moment]

You do realize that the Fugitive Slave Act was a federal law, not a state law, don't you?

There was a federal Fugitive Slave Act, but the slave states also passed their own laws criminalizing providing aid and assistance to fugitive slaves and empowering slave catchers to operate under color of state law, while at the same time some free states passed personal liberty laws to protect what their laws deemed to be free persons.

The federal FSA came about because of conflict between state laws and it firmly took the slave state side.

[The Minsky Moment]

I mean if the church failed to get people to be abstinent under the threat of eternal damnation I am not sure what mere secular governments can do.

Well the Church mostly succeeded in getting its priests to stop impregnatating women.
Turns out there was a small hitch, though.

[derspiess]

Ooh, an f-bomb.  So edgy.  So Throbby.

[merithyn]

Ooh, an f-bomb.  So edgy.  So Throbby.

You know, the thing is... you can't defend these laws. None of you conservatives can. You know they're wrong. You know they do not bring about the changes you claim to want (fewer abortions). You say crap like this and dps "takes offense", but at the end of the day, you have no real defense.

Your party has jumped the shark, and you know it. There is absolutely no way to defend what they're doing to women. And don't pull the whole "it's about the baby!!" thing, because these new laws with absolutely nothing else to help prevent pregnancies show without a shadow of a doubt that it's not about the babies. It's about controlling women.

But still... you can't just say, "Man... this is messed up."

[The Minsky Moment]

Dps, I'm actually serious on this. Are there any Republican-led programs or legislative actions in the US that have the intent to reduce pregnancies other than the thoroughly disproved method of abstinence?

Their environmental policy could increase miscarriages.
Every little bit helps, right?

[merithyn]

Dps, I'm actually serious on this. Are there any Republican-led programs or legislative actions in the US that have the intent to reduce pregnancies other than the thoroughly disproved method of abstinence?

Their environmental policy could increase miscarriages.
Every little bit helps, right?

Not when part of Georgia's law includes an investigation into every miscarriage to ensure that the mothers didn't do anything to try to induce it. Because you know, that's what a mother who's just lost a baby wants to deal with.

[crazy canuck]

Dps, I'm actually serious on this. Are there any Republican-led programs or legislative actions in the US that have the intent to reduce pregnancies other than the thoroughly disproved method of abstinence?

Their environmental policy could increase miscarriages.
Every little bit helps, right?

Not when part of Georgia's law includes an investigation into every miscarriage to ensure that the mothers didn't do anything to try to induce it. Because you know, that's what a mother who's just lost a baby wants to deal with.

Ms. Atwood is both horrified and nodding her head in self acknowledgment that she warned us this could happen.

[Razgovory]

Missouri is passing a similar law right now.  The governor is thrilled about the prospect of signing it. 

I personally find abortion to be disgusting, but I am loath to outright ban things due to personal distaste.  What is more disgusting is that a man can rape a women and get far, far less prison time than a doctor who provides a voluntary service.  In fact, a man can kidnap and rape and murder a woman and still get less time.  That is truly repulsive.

In my mind the way to reduce abortion is subsidize birth control and make it more accessible to woman.

[dps]

As a conservative, I'm calling bullshit on this.  Though I in no way claim to be a compassionate conservative.

I'm game. Show me where the Republicans have taken a leading, active role in any of the things I brought up.

Dps, I'm actually serious on this. Are there any Republican-led programs or legislative actions in the US that have the intent to reduce pregnancies other than the thoroughly disproved method of abstinence?

Republicans, or conservatives, or pro-lifers?  I'll grant that there is a lot of overlap, but they aren't exactly the same groups of people, either.  I personally was a conservative Democrat from 1980-2008, now I'm a conservative Republican.  I'm not a pro-lifer, nor am I exactly pro-choice, either. 

I've never really posted my views on abortion before, because I'm not really sure how I feel about it.  To me, it all comes down to when a developing fetus becomes a human life.  If an unborn fetus is a human being, then IMO, abortion can never be justified, and the "my body my choice" rhetoric is crap, because then it's not just the woman's body.  OTOH, if it's not a human being, then it is the woman's body and her choice.  The thing is, I don't know when the fetus becomes a human being.  I don't really think it's at the point of conception (so I don't really have a problem with day-after pills) but I do think the fetus does become a human being sometime before the completion of a full-term pregnancy.  As a practical matter, I think the Supreme Court actually articulated a reasonable standard when it put forward the 3-trimester standard (though I also think that their decision in Row v Wade was a very poor decision).

I used to think that technology would provide an answer here, that science would eventually be able to tell when a fetus becomes human.  I've come to realize, though, that that is extremely unlikely to happen--that it's probably actually a matter of semantics, and a human is whatever we want to define as human.  That's incredibly unsatisfactory, though;  after all, much of the Western world used to define blacks as not fully human.

As for a direct answer to you question, I don't know exactly who did or didn't provide leadership in all the policy initiatives on the matters you mentioned, but on one of them at least, the matter of holding fathers equally accountable, as I recall there was broad, bipartisan support for trying to make deadbeat dads pay child support.  I certainly don't think it was just liberal, pro-choice Democrats who thought it was a good idea.

[Syt]

I wish the GOP cared as much about life after birth, but nope. It's "fend for yourself, sucker" right afterwards.

[Solmyr]

If an unborn fetus is a human being, then IMO, abortion can never be justified, and the "my body my choice" rhetoric is crap, because then it's not just the woman's body.

Then that fetus is welcome to GTFO and survive on its own, because the woman is not obligated to offer her body to provide for its support.

[Josquius]

If an unborn fetus is a human being, then IMO, abortion can never be justified, and the "my body my choice" rhetoric is crap, because then it's not just the woman's body.

Then that fetus is welcome to GTFO and survive on its own, because the woman is not obligated to offer her body to provide for its support.

Penetration without permission clearly.

If a fetus is to be classed as a human then we have to pass a law about unlawfully living in another person's body. Punishment- death.

[Eddie Teach]

I don't think either of you could still take those harsh positions if you actually recognized the humanity of the fetus.

[Solmyr]

I'm pretty sure the woman (or other person with a uterus) is way more human than the fetus. Also, I'm always going to defer to the individual wishes of a person regarding what is and is not inside their own body.