I need a new laptop. Help?

[Barrister]

Macbook air uses USB-c slots, not regular USB ones.  That's a dealbreaker for me.

I didn't suggest a MacBook Air.

[Tamas]

For the love of god do not buy a Mac.

You can easily convince me about iPads. Heck, I'll even listen to you about iPhones before buying something else. But Macs are insanely overpriced, for the privilege of virtually no content compared to Windows.

[Threviel]

Well, software wise they are so-so, but when they release new models Macs are not over-priced. Next time they release new computers you should try to build a comparable Dell or whatever, that'll give you a new perspective.

So, and I know that's not the case, if you want a high-end laptop to run Windows on, a Mac is not a bad choice. If you only want to do some basic stuff in Windows, then a Mac is way too much computer and thus over-priced.

[Tamas]

No they ARE overpriced, and the worse decision you can make is buy a Mac for the hardware. I challenge you to go to an online store where you can customise your hardware (they'll assemble it for you) and try to get something NOT drastically cheaper than the same Mac config.

[Threviel]

Well, I'm no specialist in that, but we'll do ot the other way around. The Macbook Air is quite new, please build a significantly cheaper version at a major online resaler, say Dell or whatever, your choice. It's not really fair to compare Apple to some garage store.

Use the 1199 version from here: https://www.apple.com/uk/shop/buy-mac/macbook-air

I'll even make it easier for you, the iMac range is old as shit, build a better one than the 1249 version from here: https://www.apple.com/uk/shop/buy-mac/imac/21.5-inch

I'm no gee-whizz IT guy, so I'm actually quite curios as to whether my thesis is correct. Chop chop, prove me wrong. I of course expect the same form factor.

[Threviel]

Just to clarify, to build a more powerful computer cheaper would be trivial, things like build quality, how well the parts work together, sound level and other things are quite difficult to quantify and costs a lot of money. So I'll be expecting a proper attempt with the same general quality in the end product, not some cheap ass sweatshop shit.

[Tamas]

Ok, getting laptop comparison is much more annoying than desktops so I am not going to spend more time on it, but even a super-quick search shows that the Macbook Air is about 300 dollars more expensive than the Surface 2, despite the Surface 2 being another big-brand light laptop, despite them having pretty much the same hardware specs EXCEPT for the Surface's 13 inch screen being a touchscreen.

There's simply no logical reason to buy a Mac. You are not getting anything you wouldn't be able to get elsewhere for a better price.


And on desktops, I am sorry but as long as the small custom-build store's guy knows what he is doing, then "build quality" won't be different. Sure it would be a kid in your native country assemlbing the rig not an even younger kid on an assembly line in Vietnam, but come on.

[Threviel]

One normally compares apples to apples, big computer resalers to big computer resalers. There is always going to be small shops with cheaper things.

https://www.laptopmag.com/articles/macbook-air-vs-surface-laptop-2

1 point to you, now do the iMac.

[Tamas]

Here you go.

21.5 inch iMac with a  7th generation Intel with 8GB Ram: 1050 pounds
https://www.apple.com/uk/shop/buy-mac/imac/21.5-inch-2.3ghz-1tb?afid=p238%7Csg1XGECT7-dc_mtid_187079nc38483_pcrid_64626336361_&cid=aos-uk-kwgo-pla-mac--slid-----product-MMQA2B/A-UK

A Dell, with a superior 8th generation CPU, same 8gigs of RAM and weird hybrid storage, and a 23inch monitor included in the price: 680 pounds:
https://www.dell.com/en-uk/shop/desktops-and-all-in-ones/inspiron-small-desktop/spd/inspiron-3470-desktop/cd347006


Here you'd be paying almost 400 pounds (more than 50%) more for the privilege of an inferior system.

[Threviel]

As I said, building a faster cheaper computer is trivial.

I gave you a BMW and you compare it so a trimmed up Lada, sure  the Lada may have more HP and be cheaper, but it ain't no BMW.

[Threviel]

Ohh, byt the way, the iMac I thought you should use has a 4k screen. But sure, you can cherry pick whatever iMac you want, but you would need to compare it to an all-in-one computer. Apples to apples and all that.

[Tamas]

As I said, building a faster cheaper computer is trivial.

I gave you a BMW and you compare it so a trimmed up Lada, sure  the Lada may have more HP and be cheaper, but it ain't no BMW.

No, there are actual and great differences in features and quality between a BMW and a Lada that at least partially justify the much bigger cost of a BMW (although to be fair, a Lada comes with working indicator lights usually).

"Build quality" is not a real thing for desktop computers, past the benchmark of them working and not being unnecessarily large or noisy.

If you feel like sacrificing performance and software support/content plus paying 50% more to have a more stylish exterior and brand logo, that's up to you. But in terms of utility the competition isn't even close and not to Apple's advantage.

[Threviel]

No, that is correct. But building cheap powerful computers isn't Apples thing, their thing is the whole user package. With an iMac you pay for the convenience of not having a lot of cables and crap all over the place, in addition to other perceived advantages, like MacOS, like security and so on.

You claim that there is no reason to buy a Mac ever. I have an iMac because I was willing to pay the premium for the convenience of not having a lot of dust traps under my desktop. Also because I have an iPhone and the integration works really well. And it is silent. And it looks good. And my wife likes it, that's worth a lot. So, if you want to convince me that there are other computers that can do the same cheaper, well, then you need to find computers with a similar form factor and style.

If I had wanted a pure work (depending of what I do of course) or gaming computer, well, then I wouldn't have bought an iMac.

And functionally a Lada and BMW is the same, it's just that the BMW is a better user experience.

[Tamas]

Fair enough. But I maintain the Apple is overpriced.

[Threviel]

I guess what I am trying, and failing, to say is: If you want a computer in the style of an iMac, an iMac might be the best choice. If you want a computer like an MacBook, a MacBook might be the best choice. And so on. As you showed, it doesn't have to be the best choice, but there's a good chance that it is.

If you don't want to or don't have a need for that kind of computer, well shit, then Macs are expensive and not at all worth it.