Elon Musk: Always A Douche

[Neil]

Tamas, wasn't Kia having problems with spontaneous combustion compared to most manufacturers?  That made the news last year, and you seem pretty well-researched in this matter.

[crazy canuck]

No, there was a recall for a potential fault safety plug in the previous generation of Neros. There was not a problem with spontaneous combustion of cars. There has been no problems with the current generation.

[Iormlund]

Not specific to Tesla but I can't really stomach the "empty dashboard with an ipad and a steering wheel" designs. Feels like a copout by the manufacturer.

Was one of the smaller reasons why we went with the Kia. And, for example, in the e=Niro, you adjust the self-charging brake/resistance with a couple of levers behind the wheel. I watched a reviewer try to do the same in a similarly sized MG - while driving a country road, he had to navigate several menus on the touchscreen to finally get to the option to change this very same thing. I am all for advance of technology but UX-wise this seems terrible.

Screens are much, much cheaper.

Back in the day industrial machines had panels full of physical buttons and lamps (like the control room of Chernobyl). Touch screens made them obsolete 25 or so years ago. If anything I'm surprised it took so long to arrive at the car industry.

[Tamas]

Tamas, wasn't Kia having problems with spontaneous combustion compared to most manufacturers?  That made the news last year, and you seem pretty well-researched in this matter.

Like CC wrote I can't remember reading anything about that. There are two recurring problems with the generation of the e-niro we bought:because there were hybrid versions of it as well, electronics operate off an old school 12v battery and that can die, if you overuse it between giving the EV batteries a chance to recharge it, hard to judge whether it's a real problem or people on Reddit have no concept of 12v batteries dying after a while.

The second is a sort of wheel of fortune noise developing in some engine component, which is an expensive repair, but I have made sure to by a car with provable service history so the 7 year Kia warranty will be applying for another 3.5 years.

[Admiral Yi]

Don't be obtuse. Euromaidan wasn't about shooting people. Neither are the protests in Georgia or Slovakia,  both against authorianism.
Just like the revolutionaries didn't start shooting straight away either.

You take to the streets en masse, use that mass to block the doge-sturmabteilung from entering or leaving their targets.
But again: it's easier said than done

You told me to ask myself what American revolutionaries would do.  I did that.  How is that obtuse?

[Jacob]

Back in the day industrial machines had panels full of physical buttons and lamps (like the control room of Chernobyl). Touch screens made them obsolete 25 or so years ago. If anything I'm surprised it took so long to arrive at the car industry.

The problem with screens in cars is that they require you to take your eyes off the road for longer periods of time than more tactile interfaces do. That's less of a concern for most industrial machines, I expect.

[Tonitrus]

Today buying a TeSSla is a clear political statement.

[Tonitrus]

Not specific to Tesla but I can't really stomach the "empty dashboard with an ipad and a steering wheel" designs. Feels like a copout by the manufacturer.

Strongly agree.  I very much prefer the Rivian-style screen layout.

[Zanza]

The quality reports on Tesla have a fairly wide spread from high buyer satisfaction and low maintenance cost to poor reviews in initial inspections for chassis components and horror anecdotes on costs to fix them. Hard to say what it is. But panel gaps are not an issue anymore.

Only having a touchscreen interface will no longer allow you to get the highest vehicle safety ratings in Europe apparently in the future as they deem some haptic buttons for some features that you should be able to operate without taking your eyes off the road necessary. Will soon be irrelevant with more voice communication and more autonomous cars though.

Battery life of used electric vehicles is generally better than expected across all brands. But older EVs including Tesla run on 400V, which will not allow you to get high peak charging rates at superchargers.

The update to the Model Y will have caused some of the sales figures crash and Tesla is likely to recover there. But in general their product pipeline does not look great, despite Musk's grand visions. S & X are basically dead, 3 & Y have old platforms by now, although Tesla is doing bigger changes than their competitors in mid lifecycle updates. Cybertruck and Semi are niche. Robotaxi will take years still. Not obvious how they want to grow their car business significantly. They still sell well in China, but the competition there is hyper strong and making better, cheaper products than Tesla now.

It will be interesting if Tesla has to change it's FSD hardware in older models as Musk himself admitted that it does not fulfill what was sold.

[Crazy_Ivan80]

Sales of tesla are down 60% in France and Germany apparently, and about half in Belgium.  Was on the news today.

[dist]

I don't think the political reasons would have had time to cut into sales that deeply. It's only been a week or two. It will definitely have an impact, but I wonder and fear how much.

I'm seeing enough of my left-leaning friends still using and reposting from X even though they can't stand Musk and have been disgusted by his actions since his sieg heils and his attempts at getting the far right elected in Europe. Based on their behaviour, I think there are enough people who wouldn't care even if they oppose him. But maybe the amount of money involved is big enough for people to actually wonder if they want to give it to Musk.

A bit like BB that only worries that buying a Tesla would be seen as a political statement. I'm really surprised one cannot see how not seeing this as a political statement is a political statement in itself: "I'm okay with Elon."

[Barrister]

A bit like BB that only worries that buying a Tesla would be seen as a political statement. I'm really surprised one cannot see how not seeing this as a political statement is a political statement in itself: "I'm okay with Elon."

Well the argument would be that buying used doesn't give any money to Elon.

But anyways, not a 2025 problem - I'm hoping to keep my trusty 2011 RAV4 running for awhile yet.  It's starting to look it's age but the mechanicals are still in great shape.

I may be co-erced into giving it to one of my kids though some day.

[The Minsky Moment]

I've leased 2 Tesla Model 3s.  One of the most striking aspects of getting a Tesla was the lack of direct marketing.  They made no effort to sell; we had to come to them.  When the first lease was coming up, Tesla made no attempt to convince us to get a new one; we got routine notices of the lease expiry and that was it.

Now with the second lease is wrapping up this summer, things are very different, Tesla is already aggressively pushing us to get a new one.  It is a significant change in their behavior.

It could be that Tesla will benefit from a sudden surge in red-state enthusiasts for Musk ready and willing to swap their pick-up-truck for a pricy EV, but if that growth doesn't materialize, Tesla could find itself learning why profoundly alienating your core customer base and badly tarnishing one's brand isn't optimal business strategy.  It's certainly true that there are more viable EV options now than six years ago.

[Tamas]

A bit like BB that only worries that buying a Tesla would be seen as a political statement. I'm really surprised one cannot see how not seeing this as a political statement is a political statement in itself: "I'm okay with Elon."

Well the argument would be that buying used doesn't give any money to Elon.

But anyways, not a 2025 problem - I'm hoping to keep my trusty 2011 RAV4 running for awhile yet.  It's starting to look it's age but the mechanicals are still in great shape.

I may be co-erced into giving it to one of my kids though some day.

Yeah but you can't really drive around with a "I bought this used" sign on your Tesla.

[Valmy]

It could be that Tesla will benefit from a sudden surge in red-state enthusiasts for Musk ready and willing to swap their pick-up-truck for a pricy EV, but if that growth doesn't materialize, Tesla could find itself learning why profoundly alienating your core customer base and badly tarnishing one's brand isn't optimal business strategy.  It's certainly true that there are more viable EV options now than six years ago.

Yeah if Musk makes all Republican voters trade in their Ford F-150s for EVs then Tesla should be fine.

But Musk doesn't seem to give a shit at all about Tesla or its future. At least not in the last couple years. Another reason why I was baffled they gave him a big bonus.

But that is coming from my myopic view that a car company cares about making and selling cars. But publicly traded companies are really just financial companies. So if the goal is to attract shareholders, and who gives a shit if you actually make or sell anything, than Musk has done well.