Elon Musk: Always A Douche

[Zoupa]

BB I think the point is not that the banner is a lie, it's that it's applied the same way as RT. It's disingenuous and I'm pretty sure you know that.

Why wouldn't Musk's profile read Saudi/China funded nepo baby? It's not a lie either.

[Barrister]

BB I think the point is not that the banner is a lie, it's that it's applied the same way as RT. It's disingenuous and I'm pretty sure you know that.

Why wouldn't Musk's profile read Saudi/China funded nepo baby? It's not a lie either.

The pro-Musk spin would be that RT isn't labelled as "government funded media", but rather as "Russia state affiliated media". I don't think that makes it quite clear how much of a difference there is between CBC and RT, but Twitter itself does acknowledge there's a difference.

My complaint has always been this - there's some value to identifying media bias.  Which can certainly include state-funded, or state-directed media companies.

The problem though is it isn't Twitter making some good-faith attempt to ID such biases and distinctions, it's just Musk doing it all for the lulz.

[Jacob]

BB, I think you're right when you're saying that attacking the CBC is not a winner for PP. I think aligning with Musk to do it isn't going to be constructive either.

[Zoupa]

Not to highjack the thread, but I'm not sure the brand PP is going for can get him to the 35-37% usually needed in our (stupid) FPTP system. I can see a combination of Trudeau fatigue, no other real options (outside of Qc) and the assorted deplorables being able to carry him over though. I want to believe Canada is different, but probably not.

[crazy canuck]

Not to highjack the thread, but I'm not sure the brand PP is going for can get him to the 35-37% usually needed in our (stupid) FPTP system. I can see a combination of Trudeau fatigue, no other real options (outside of Qc) and the assorted deplorables being able to carry him over though. I want to believe Canada is different, but probably not.

Yeah, the thing is it should be really easy for the Conservatives to win this time around.   But PP is sure making it harder than it needs to be.

[Barrister]

BB, I think you're right when you're saying that attacking the CBC is not a winner for PP. I think aligning with Musk to do it isn't going to be constructive either.

Clarification of my opinion:

-attacking the CBC?  No worse than politically neutral.

-"defund" the CBC?  Political loser.

Remember CBC's ratings are actually fairly insignificant.

[crazy canuck]

Gives a good sense of how out of touch the Conservative bubble is.  But we can't just blame PP for this, it has been a long proud tradition of first the Progressive Conversatives, then the Manning spin offs, and now the CPC to attack the CBC. 

For folks like BB, the behaviour has become normalized.

[Barrister]

Gives a good sense of how out of touch the Conservative bubble is.  But we can't just blame PP for this, it has been a long proud tradition of first the Progressive Conversatives, then the Manning spin offs, and now the CPC to attack the CBC. 

For folks like BB, the behaviour has become normalized.

Intellectually curious people might wonder why criticism of the CBC on the right goes back at least 40 years, if not further.

Or you can just write us off as being in a bubble and move on.

Your call CC.

[crazy canuck]

Gives a good sense of how out of touch the Conservative bubble is.  But we can't just blame PP for this, it has been a long proud tradition of first the Progressive Conversatives, then the Manning spin offs, and now the CPC to attack the CBC. 

For folks like BB, the behaviour has become normalized.

Intellectually curious people might wonder why criticism of the CBC on the right goes back at least 40 years, if not further.

Or you can just write us off as being in a bubble and move on.

Your call CC.

There is no mystery about why that is.  The right has always been conspiratorially minded when it comes to the CBC.  They just can't fathom, that critical reporting of all politicians is sort of what the CBC does.  Its just that the right thinks that means the CBC is taking directions from the left leaning political masters.  But for some reason the PPs of the world, and apparently you, ignore all the critical reporting the CBC does of the NDP and Liberals, not to mention how the CBC's reporting of the Greens debacle was withering.

The reason I say you are in a bubble, is you seem to have no conception of how the CBC is viewed by the very Canadians your party needs to attract in order to win outside the Conservative strongholds.

I have mentioned to you before how frustrating it is to see how damaging it is to Canadian politics to have no real competition for the Liberals.  And the Conservatives continue to disappoint.

[Barrister]

Gives a good sense of how out of touch the Conservative bubble is.  But we can't just blame PP for this, it has been a long proud tradition of first the Progressive Conversatives, then the Manning spin offs, and now the CPC to attack the CBC. 

For folks like BB, the behaviour has become normalized.

Intellectually curious people might wonder why criticism of the CBC on the right goes back at least 40 years, if not further.

Or you can just write us off as being in a bubble and move on.

Your call CC.

There is no mystery about why that is.  The right has always been conspiratorially minded when it comes to the CBC.  They just can't fathom, that critical reporting of all politicians is sort of what the CBC does.  Its just that the right thinks that means the CBC is taking directions from the left leaning political masters.  But for some reason the PPs of the world, and apparently you, ignore all the critical reporting the CBC does of the NDP and Liberals, not to mention how the CBC's reporting of the Greens debacle was withering.

The reason I say you are in a bubble, is you seem to have no conception of how the CBC is viewed by the very Canadians your party needs to attract in order to win outside the Conservative strongholds.

I have mentioned to you before how frustrating it is to see how damaging it is to Canadian politics to have no real competition for the Liberals.  And the Conservatives continue to disappoint.

And that's the call you made.

[Sheilbh]

Intellectually curious people might wonder why criticism of the CBC on the right goes back at least 40 years, if not further.

Or you can just write us off as being in a bubble and move on.

Your call CC.

By analogy with the BBC - there has been right-wing moaning about the BBC since, at the very least, the 60s. The worrying trend I think is the now quite loud left-wing and "centrist dad" criticism of the BBC. And ultimately while the BBC is criticised by the right it is also most used by the right as their main source of information (on TV) while the left is more likely to use social media - which reflects the age gap here, but I think that is probably a generation challenge for all "national" broadcasters.

In part I wonder if that "national" broadcaster model is sustainable. It's a product of the age of mass media and "the masses". That's not our world anymore. There is something to the criticism of the BBC that its funding is tied to TV and linear broadcasting when a significant group in the UK only watch TV online, at their choice, through devices. And there's always the tension between the Reithian ideals of what the BBC is for to "inform, educate and entertain" (in that order) v being paid for and for everyone.

It's tough. I've mentioned it before I think, but I always think about that "imagined communities" idea of how nations were formed in the 19th century by print capitalism creating a common imagined space and links between previously quite disparate communities. I think the national broadcastsers were the next step on that chain in the age of mass media (and a comparatively benign one). But I'm not sure how it holds up with the new imagined communities being created online.

[Josquius]

It all feeds into a diamond age kind of setup with the phyle you belong to being far more important than physical borders. :p

Also let's not pretend the BBC hasn't lurched right in recent years.

[viper37]

They just can't fathom, that critical reporting of all politicians is sort of what the CBC does.  Its just that the right thinks that means the CBC is taking directions from the left leaning political masters.  But for some reason the PPs of the world, and apparently you, ignore all the critical reporting the CBC does of the NDP and Liberals, not to mention how the CBC's reporting of the Greens debacle was withering.

There is much less criticizing of the Liberal party or the NDP than of the Conservatives or the Bloc at the Federal level.

They even got blamed for their lack of impartiality at the last electoral debate but they refused to apologize for it.

[Jacob]

Intellectually curious people might wonder why criticism of the CBC on the right goes back at least 40 years, if not further.

The explanation seems twofold:

1) Ideological opposition to the idea of publicly funded media, independent of the content of that media.

2) A preference for privately media with an explicit commitment to right-of-centre political positions and a desire to eliminate competition. With other privately owned media, this goal can typically be achieved by acquisitions over time, but the CBC is immune to being bought out by right-wing billionaires, and therefore it must be eliminated.

These two core principles then get leavened with some culture war stuff and the typical right-of-centre persecution complex.

[crazy canuck]

Intellectually curious people might wonder why criticism of the CBC on the right goes back at least 40 years, if not further.

Or you can just write us off as being in a bubble and move on.

Your call CC.

By analogy with the BBC - there has been right-wing moaning about the BBC since, at the very least, the 60s. The worrying trend I think is the now quite loud left-wing and "centrist dad" criticism of the BBC. And ultimately while the BBC is criticised by the right it is also most used by the right as their main source of information (on TV) while the left is more likely to use social media - which reflects the age gap here, but I think that is probably a generation challenge for all "national" broadcasters.

In part I wonder if that "national" broadcaster model is sustainable. It's a product of the age of mass media and "the masses". That's not our world anymore. There is something to the criticism of the BBC that its funding is tied to TV and linear broadcasting when a significant group in the UK only watch TV online, at their choice, through devices. And there's always the tension between the Reithian ideals of what the BBC is for to "inform, educate and entertain" (in that order) v being paid for and for everyone.

It's tough. I've mentioned it before I think, but I always think about that "imagined communities" idea of how nations were formed in the 19th century by print capitalism creating a common imagined space and links between previously quite disparate communities. I think the national broadcastsers were the next step on that chain in the age of mass media (and a comparatively benign one). But I'm not sure how it holds up with the new imagined communities being created online.

In a nation as sparsely populated as Canada the CBC still has an important place.  In a lot of communities across the country it is the main source of radio and TV news.  And yes people still listen to radio here.  And yes, right wing radio does not dominate here - the CBC does.  Which is why I suspect the Conservative hate it soooo much.

@BB two words for you, cognitive dissonance.