The shit in Spain falls mainly in the fan

[viper37]

We are not at Fort Sumter, though. Yet.

if Spain calls for volunteers to invade Catalonia and restore order, there will be a Fort Sumter, I think.

[viper37]

Am I the only one picturing Drakken saying this all breathless with excitement?

Yes, you are.  He looks worried to me.  So am I, frankly, even if I don't really know anyone from there (meaning I only know our Spanish poster from there).

[celedhring]

2,250,000 votes (43% of census), 90% Yes. 

The Catalan Republic gets started with a banana republic poll.

[viper37]

(unfortunately for us, Martine will be coming back).

Maybe they'll close the border and she'll be stuck there for a while.

Needless to say, they are going bonkers about this "political repression of the popular will", so it occupies our political discussions here as well. It is front news here in Montreal, with Singh's election second. Plus, while I am Federalist I am still very worried that things can go even more haywire for people in Catalonia as well. It's not just a division between Rajoy and the Generalitat, but also Catalan secessionists against Catalan non-secessionists.

Same here.  Except I don't wake up singing Oh Canada in my maple leaf boxers.

Things could go from bad to worst very quickly and the central government isn't doing anything to calm it down.

[viper37]

2,250,000 votes (43% of census), 90% Yes. 

The Catalan Republic gets started with a banana republic poll.

if, as Iormlund says, most NO supporters refused to vote, then it is hardly surprising.  Also, the police repression must have fueled the seperatist fires there.

Still, a referendum held in these conditions isn't worth much on the international scene.

[Iormlund]

That's not how things work over here. They would just keep on voting until the result was "right".

I've heard federalists say that all my lives.

After the last referendum was won by the NO side with a very slim margin, there were lots of boasting from the seperatists they would do it again.  The talk is there, but it never happens.  People have gone elsewhere for now, as soon as the Federal government started treating them with respect.

Of course, it could come back.  But for now, the Seperatist party at the Federal level has but a few MPs and the provincial seperatist party, the only one who could hold a referendum is 3rd in the voting polls and has sworn not to do a referendum in the first mandate.

No political party likes to lose.  If Spain had allowed a referendum despite the Constitution, found a way to allow a vote on the independance issue, agree to the rules beforehand, it's unlikely there would have been a seperatist victory from what you tell me, and it seems doubtufl they could make a comeback referendum before half a generation, unless some unforseen change, like a Spexit.

I think you are projecting the situation there too much.

The scenario you outline might have been realistic a few decades ago, but no more.

The Catalonian Christian-democrats (CiU) dominated the region since Franco died. They routinely played the nationalist card when they wanted more powers. This went on for around 30 years, until the nationalism they had cultivated as a weapon overtook them. By now the separatist sentiment is really strong, and centered in the very young and the extreme left. The moderates are now hanging on to dear life, carried by a tsunami of their own making.

[HVC]

Same here.  Except I don't wake up singing Oh Canada in my maple leaf boxers.

You should try it, it's good for the soul. Especially the English version

[Iormlund]

I'm still hoping for a general strike. I maintain that it's the best way to test how committed the separatists are.

Of course it would also help me quite a bit, but that's beside the point. 

One of the largest unions has joined the call for a strike tomorrow. The other will decide today. 

[Iormlund]

Almost final results are in.





Official census is 5.5 million voters, so about 36% voted yes according to the organizers.

[alfred russel]

If things do go to shit, I at least look forward to the release of "Spanish Civil War II: Total War".

[viper37]

By now the separatist sentiment is really strong, and centered in the very young and the extreme left.

that's worst than I thought.

[citizen k]

The Abraham Lincoln brigade stands ready.

[The Brain]

The Germans and Italians are on standby.

[Duque de Bragança]

The Germans and Italians are on standby.

Why? No need to airlift Moroccans, they are already there. 

Still, what would Salazar do? 

[Duque de Bragança]

That might've been true if it was still the previous guys (Mas & Co.). But the guys now running the government? They are true believers. Nope, they are going all the way.

Just realized the godfather Pujol is really forgotten now to be mentioned by &Co.   

Btw, thank you for the local coverage, this applies somewhat to Iormlund, though he is from Cæsaraugusta I believe. It' missing a centre-of-right catalan nationalist/regionalist though.