The shit in Spain falls mainly in the fan

[Jacob]

Doesn't sound like celedhring is a die hard Catalonian nationalist....

[Crazy_Ivan80]

So what?

Catalonian politicians can declare independence. That doesn't make it so.

Businesses aren't suddenly going to line up to send them money (VAT, SS contributions and income tax from workers, business tax, excise taxes). Not in a week, not in a year.

When you have 40-50% of the population voting for parties willing to run roughshod through constitutional and democratic principles in order to achieve MUH FREEDOM, you can bet that unilateral independence is going to have an effect. Sure, long term or even mid term, unilateral independence is not viable, but you can bet that lots of damage can be done in the interim. And I don't mean just metaphorical damage.

Maybe Spain shouldn't have behaved like it did, running roughshod over made agreements and behaving in a fashion that is better suited for Russia rather than a western state?

[Iormlund]

Huh?

[Valmy]

Maybe Spain shouldn't have behaved like it did, running roughshod over made agreements and behaving in a fashion that is better suited for Russia rather than a western state?

Maybe you should be more specific so he can address what exactly it is you are referring to?

[HVC]

Maybe Spain shouldn't have behaved like it did, running roughshod over made agreements and behaving in a fashion that is better suited for Russia rather than a western state?

Maybe you should be more specific so he can address what exactly it is you are referring to?

Isabella was a bitch maybe?

[Valmy]

Maybe Spain shouldn't have behaved like it did, running roughshod over made agreements and behaving in a fashion that is better suited for Russia rather than a western state?

Maybe you should be more specific so he can address what exactly it is you are referring to?

Isabella was a bitch maybe?

I thought maybe he was talking about Francisco Franco but it was not like Spain was a democracy when he was in charge so that would be silly.

[The Brain]

Probably a Treaty of Tortillas thing.

[Tonitrus]

Probably a Treaty of Tortillas thing.

Isn't that on Taco Bell's secret menu?

[The Brain]

Probably a Treaty of Tortillas thing.

Isn't that on Taco Bell's secret menu?

I don't know, they never tell me anything.

[Jacob]

I too am pretty interested in hearing the pro-separatist point of view. I vaguely remember bits about federal Spanish shittiness as well, but no details.

In this particular case I don't have even mild opinions in either direction.

[The Minsky Moment]

For one thing, it's not clear to me how much Catalonian nationalism is Scottish-style cultural nationalism or Lega Nordish resentment of subsidizing southerners.

[Iormlund]

A bit of both, really.

[The Larch]

And in some extreme cases it converges into the "we're floating balls of light being prevented from being basically Scandinavian by the knuckle dragging thugs in Madrid" delightful combo.

[Eddie Teach]

Huh?

Flemish solidarity.

[celedhring]

Most large Catalan cities - and critically, Barcelona - have denied the Catalan government the use of polling stations for the referendum. Support for separatism is lower in cities (except in the north), and larger in rural areas, so that was expected. The thing is already stillborn before a single police officer makes a single arrest.

At the end of the day, the separatists haven't even bothered to try to convince the rest of the Catalans before going to battle against Spain. If they mustered, say, 66%+ sustained support, the union would be untenable in the long term, no matter the illegality of independence under the current Spanish constitutional order. But nope, it's all subterfuge and jumping over a cliff for... what? Fueling more victim complex for another generation?