UK Parliamentary General Election 8th June 2017

[Tamas]

Yes, the manifesto supports it but I believe guardian said final version has language on how nuclear is a last resort measure as opposed to how it is typically an everyday deterrent.

That's not the same as scrapping the deterrent entirely now is it?

But my point isnt Trident per se, but the latest evidence at Glastonbury that Corbyn doesn't really care about party policy and party promises and such: he has a vision and he will try to push it through if he is given a chance.

The UK needs a Macron-like new force of the progressive middle to form, otherwise we will be stuck between inept gambler Tories and an English Chavez

[Josquius]

Corbyn didn't say he would scrap trident no.

Corbyn has no choice but to listen to party policy. Even with a majority he couldn't pass anything without the party's support. That's the way the system works.

[Tamas]

Corbyn didn't say he would scrap trident no.

Corbyn has no choice but to listen to party policy. Even with a majority he couldn't pass anything without the party's support. That's the way the system works.

Yeah let's just elect a dangerous radical, he will be reign in by party politics and common sense, for sure. Nothing bad ever came of such a decision.

[garbon]

Corbyn didn't say he would scrap trident no.

Corbyn has no choice but to listen to party policy. Even with a majority he couldn't pass anything without the party's support. That's the way the system works.

True, he just did this:

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/may/26/jeremy-corbyn-trident-labour-manifesto-commitment

Corbyn refuses to back Trident but says he will respect Labour position

[garbon]

Yes, the manifesto supports it but I believe guardian said final version has language on how nuclear is a last resort measure as opposed to how it is typically an everyday deterrent.

That's not the same as scrapping the deterrent entirely now is it?

But my point isnt Trident per se, but the latest evidence at Glastonbury that Corbyn doesn't really care about party policy and party promises and such: he has a vision and he will try to push it through if he is given a chance.

The UK needs a Macron-like new force of the progressive middle to form, otherwise we will be stuck between inept gambler Tories and an English Chavez

That was the compromise that was reached. The language about using as a last resort wasn't in that leaked version of manifesto, only showed up in final version - I would guess to make keep Trident more palatable for Corbyn.

[Tamas]

The Trident issue I consider serious not because how the Tories portrayed it during the election, but because it is a perfect summary of Corbyn and what is wrong with him: he is totally detached from realities of the world. You stay out of war by discouraging others from dragging you into one, not by making yourself a target that is incapable of retaliation. A vote against Trident is a vote against peace.

[Josquius]

Is it really worth so many billions just to scare Russia a little bit more than they already are by France and the US?
Britain can't even use Trident without the Americans anyway.

Trident is a non issue for me. I don't particularly care either way. But it's irrelevant as Labour policy is the same as the Tories there.

And to call Corbyn a dangerous radical is daft. He's a bit of an outdated dinosaur in some respects but dangerous?

[Admiral Yi]

He does demonstrate more admiration for terrorists and Marxist leaders than I would find appropriate.

[Richard Hakluyt]

Corbyn is also a brexiteer of course, which is why he has just sacked 3 shadow ministers for backing a vote for the UK to stay in the single market after Brexit :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40451301

I'm not sure how the remainer youth who idolise him manage to square that 

[Tamas]

Corbyn is also a brexiteer of course, which is why he has just sacked 3 shadow ministers for backing a vote for the UK to stay in the single market after Brexit :

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-40451301

I'm not sure how the remainer youth who idolise him manage to square that 

"free" higher education > worries about leaving the source of the UK's prosperity ?

[garbon]

Also, probably that people should now just support Corbyn - no use in symbolic conscience voting if it is against party unity.

By the by, is Labour saying with free education that they'd wipe out prior loans? Don't really understand the appeal to people in their mid-late 20s if not.

[Tamas]

Also, probably that people should now just support Corbyn - no use in symbolic conscience voting if it is against party unity.

By the by, is Labour saying with free education that they'd wipe out prior loans? Don't really understand the appeal to people in their mid-late 20s if not.

IIRC yes there was talk of that. Along with nationalising the shit out of everything, spending a helluva lot more on everything (except defence).

To their credit, they did cover the money for some of that, by the plans of taxing the shit out of corporations, the time-honoured and proven way to growth and prosperity!

[Josquius]

To their credit, they did cover the money for some of that, by the plans of taxing the shit out of corporations, the time-honoured and proven way to growth and prosperity!

Undoing recent tax cuts that haven't done anything good to raise the tax rate on the profits of big corporations by 4%, leaving them still amongst the lowest taxed in the world, is taxing the shit out of them?

Also, probably that people should now just support Corbyn - no use in symbolic conscience voting if it is against party unity.

By the by, is Labour saying with free education that they'd wipe out prior loans? Don't really understand the appeal to people in their mid-late 20s if not.

It was muttered about doing something about this for recent grads but generally no.
But then that's what the left is all about. You don't vote for purely what is best for you personally. You vote for what is best for society.
And if you had to put up with high tuition fees then you'll want to ensure future generations don't have to go through the same.

[Tamas]

But then that's what the left is all about. You don't vote for purely what is best for you personally. You vote for what is best for society.

[garbon]

To their credit, they did cover the money for some of that, by the plans of taxing the shit out of corporations, the time-honoured and proven way to growth and prosperity!

Undoing recent tax cuts that haven't done anything good to raise the tax rate on the profits of big corporations by 4%, leaving them still amongst the lowest taxed in the world, is taxing the shit out of them?

Also, probably that people should now just support Corbyn - no use in symbolic conscience voting if it is against party unity.

By the by, is Labour saying with free education that they'd wipe out prior loans? Don't really understand the appeal to people in their mid-late 20s if not.

It was muttered about doing something about this for recent grads but generally no.
But then that's what the left is all about. You don't vote for purely what is best for you personally. You vote for what is best for society.
And if you had to put up with high tuition fees then you'll want to ensure future generations don't have to go through the same.

How is that best for society? Is there a shortage of people going to university in the UK?