How Soon before Trump has a 'reichstag fire'?

[Valmy]

What evidence? Do you really think someone with openly racist and antisemitic ideas would be able to run anywhere in the USA and not get completely destroyed?

Well that depends on specifically the constituency in question.

But I was not saying openly racist and anti-semitic politicians were being elected.

[viper37]

Interesting observation here for those of us a reasonably long memory. Back in 2002, 2003 comments like this against the entire US, then brought on by Dubya's actions and statements started a humongous war of the internet between Yanqui pigdogs and Euroweenies. Today, no one seems to care about the entire nation being called medieval...

Well, one, that wasn't serious.  Two, I have no idea how the United States and the Confederacy would have evolved seperatly, say, how long before the South abandons slavery, if they could do a land grab to the west as easily as the whole US.

[garbon]

Right...so even if they don't do it themselves, what I can see happening is Trump/Bannon getting briefed by Homeland that there's a good chance of a terror attack at a shopping mall in Kansas, and Trump/Bannon deciding to ignore the intelligence

Well we need to make sure then that Carrie is on the job.

[Razgovory]

The knowledge that there exists a large and politically important support for racist and anti-semitic ideas in this country is certainly something I was not aware of in 2003.

Because it wasn't there. It still isn't.

Heard a lot of racist talk int he last 8 years.

[Josephus]

Right...so even if they don't do it themselves, what I can see happening is Trump/Bannon getting briefed by Homeland that there's a good chance of a terror attack at a shopping mall in Kansas, and Trump/Bannon deciding to ignore the intelligence

Well we need to make sure then that Carrie is on the job.

yeah, but she whines so much, she's annoying.

[citizen k]

Obama had several "reichstag fire, aka mass shootings" moments but failed to capitalize.

[garbon]

Right...so even if they don't do it themselves, what I can see happening is Trump/Bannon getting briefed by Homeland that there's a good chance of a terror attack at a shopping mall in Kansas, and Trump/Bannon deciding to ignore the intelligence

Well we need to make sure then that Carrie is on the job.

yeah, but she whines so much, she's annoying.

We still on Homeland or Sex and The City?

[dps]

Well, for me at least, differing facts make for differing conclusions.

Acting like Dubya '03 in '03 justifies a response as if he had been acting like Trump '17 is good reason to call someone a tool in '03. And I think history pretty much proved that out.

Now? Pretty hard to argue that the US is in a pretty terrible place...

For most of us on the outside, facts have very little to do with it I think. You realized in 2003 how many people outside the US were just waiting for an excuse to go after you, do you really think that has changed? I meet people on a daily basis who spew out opinions of Yanquiland (not to mention Israel) and it doesn't matter to them who's President. I had a student who accused Obama for hating muslims, that is the level of outside world nuanced opinions about American politics. Facts are completely irrelevant.

Of course, having Trump as president does not make it easier.

Which is why I don't really care what non-Americans think about our country.  What's the point;  facts don't matter, so why should I worry about what they think.  Sure, if someone posts something here (or on Paradox OT in the old days), I'll join in on calling them on it, but I don't really care.  In fact, the fact that Europeans generally didn't like President Bush the Younger and did seem to like President Obama more tended to make me think better of GWB and less of BHO. 

[viper37]

I wouldn't be surprised if there were attacks against medias.  Local medias, first, to test the waters, how the people supporters react.  Then larger, national medias.

Since Bannon is apparently mounting his own private security force parallel to secret service and his own intelligence gathering operations, I can imagine something like that happenning.

[DGuller]

Well, for me at least, differing facts make for differing conclusions.

Acting like Dubya '03 in '03 justifies a response as if he had been acting like Trump '17 is good reason to call someone a tool in '03. And I think history pretty much proved that out.

Now? Pretty hard to argue that the US is in a pretty terrible place...

For most of us on the outside, facts have very little to do with it I think. You realized in 2003 how many people outside the US were just waiting for an excuse to go after you, do you really think that has changed? I meet people on a daily basis who spew out opinions of Yanquiland (not to mention Israel) and it doesn't matter to them who's President. I had a student who accused Obama for hating muslims, that is the level of outside world nuanced opinions about American politics. Facts are completely irrelevant.

Of course, having Trump as president does not make it easier.

Which is why I don't really care what non-Americans think about our country.  What's the point;  facts don't matter, so why should I worry about what they think.  Sure, if someone posts something here (or on Paradox OT in the old days), I'll join in on calling them on it, but I don't really care.  In fact, the fact that Europeans generally didn't like President Bush the Younger and did seem to like President Obama more tended to make me think better of GWB and less of BHO.

Sounds like you do care if you are basing your opinion of presidents on what Europeans think.

[saskganesh]

Major media is the declared enemy; local and niche media are most likely to be co-opted. A much more benign Canadian conservative .. Stephen Harper .. had a similar strategy in his media fights; his party deliberately courted local media in order to get around perceived bias by national and parliamentary reporters.

[CountDeMoney]

I mean we've had numerous terrorist attacks in the US (both islamic and otherwise).  Heck the most recent was just last month - the Ft Lauderdale airport shooting.  They don't seem to have much influence on anything.

Then why do We Keep Getting Scared by Smaller and Smaller Terrorist Threats?

[dps]

Well, for me at least, differing facts make for differing conclusions.

Acting like Dubya '03 in '03 justifies a response as if he had been acting like Trump '17 is good reason to call someone a tool in '03. And I think history pretty much proved that out.

Now? Pretty hard to argue that the US is in a pretty terrible place...

For most of us on the outside, facts have very little to do with it I think. You realized in 2003 how many people outside the US were just waiting for an excuse to go after you, do you really think that has changed? I meet people on a daily basis who spew out opinions of Yanquiland (not to mention Israel) and it doesn't matter to them who's President. I had a student who accused Obama for hating muslims, that is the level of outside world nuanced opinions about American politics. Facts are completely irrelevant.

Of course, having Trump as president does not make it easier.

Which is why I don't really care what non-Americans think about our country.  What's the point;  facts don't matter, so why should I worry about what they think.  Sure, if someone posts something here (or on Paradox OT in the old days), I'll join in on calling them on it, but I don't really care.  In fact, the fact that Europeans generally didn't like President Bush the Younger and did seem to like President Obama more tended to make me think better of GWB and less of BHO.

Sounds like you do care if you are basing your opinion of presidents on what Europeans think.

OK, let me clarify--I don't really give a shit whether or not Europeans like or dislike our President, but I have so little respect for their opinion that if they feel one way about the current office-holder, it can shade my opinion in the opposite direction.  But just shade it--the fact that Europeans in general have strongly negative opinions of President Trump isn't enough to make me like the man at all.

[Berkut]

Well, for me at least, differing facts make for differing conclusions.

Acting like Dubya '03 in '03 justifies a response as if he had been acting like Trump '17 is good reason to call someone a tool in '03. And I think history pretty much proved that out.

Now? Pretty hard to argue that the US is in a pretty terrible place...

For most of us on the outside, facts have very little to do with it I think. You realized in 2003 how many people outside the US were just waiting for an excuse to go after you, do you really think that has changed? I meet people on a daily basis who spew out opinions of Yanquiland (not to mention Israel) and it doesn't matter to them who's President. I had a student who accused Obama for hating muslims, that is the level of outside world nuanced opinions about American politics. Facts are completely irrelevant.

Of course, having Trump as president does not make it easier.

Which is why I don't really care what non-Americans think about our country.  What's the point;  facts don't matter, so why should I worry about what they think.  Sure, if someone posts something here (or on Paradox OT in the old days), I'll join in on calling them on it, but I don't really care.  In fact, the fact that Europeans generally didn't like President Bush the Younger and did seem to like President Obama more tended to make me think better of GWB and less of BHO.

Sounds like you do care if you are basing your opinion of presidents on what Europeans think.

OK, let me clarify--I don't really give a shit whether or not Europeans like or dislike our President, but I have so little respect for their opinion that if they feel one way about the current office-holder, it can shade my opinion in the opposite direction.  But just shade it--the fact that Europeans in general have strongly negative opinions of President Trump isn't enough to make me like the man at all.

The fact that he pisses off the Euroes who we don't mind being pissed off is a very slight silver lining in an otherwise very ominous cloud...

[frunk]

OK, let me clarify--I don't really give a shit whether or not Europeans like or dislike our President, but I have so little respect for their opinion that if they feel one way about the current office-holder, it can shade my opinion in the opposite direction.  But just shade it--the fact that Europeans in general have strongly negative opinions of President Trump isn't enough to make me like the man at all.

I think this attitude when taken to extremes is a good percentage of the problem.  There's an assumption that "if someone I don't like doesn't like something, it must be good."  That's only true if the person you don't like has exactly the opposite opinions to you on everything.  There's nobody like that, and using it as a signal on anything is worse than useless.

It's easy to go from that to saying "I don't like Hillary, Hillary doesn't like Putin, Putin must be good."  It's lazy and will only serve to ignore that actual common ground that we have with people we don't like.  We have more commonalities with Europe than any other comparable land mass in the world, yet them not liking Trump (who you also don't like) would actually move your opinion in the opposite direction?