Westworld Discussion - SPOILERS!

[Berkut]

Need a thread to talk WW without the need for spoiler tags....

[Berkut]

Elaborate.

1. Maeve is convinced she is a bot when the tech shows her the program that generates her speech. Then she immediately starts to plot her escape.  No explanation is given for how she escapes the bounds of her programming and achieves independent, self-aware thought.

It turns out she wasn't indepenent at all though. Her "breakout" is actually part of the story, and her actions were in fact coded into her.

Now, there is some ambiguity over whether or not Ford is actually aware that she has "woken" or is about to (it seems to be a continuum), and he might be piggy backing his deterministic code onto that framework. He does this with Bernard as well, of course - where Bernard is clearly woken, but still has coded imperatives he has to fulfill.

2. No way a partnership between two engineers could finance the start up of Westworld.  Gigantic tracts of land, hundreds of 3D printed droids with massively complex programming. Squeelions of dollars to start up.

Not a logical disconnect, just something not explained. Who knows how Westworld was originally financed?

3. In all the scenes where the hosts go off the rez no mention is made of the guests.  Some of them should be freaked out, want their money back, whatever, but they don't really exist.

Again, not a logical disconnect, just something left untold. But yeah, it does seem like there should be a lot more disruption that what is shown.

On the other hand, it does seem clear that there are levels to the guest experience, and multiple layered story lines. Most guests, I suspect, just show up to fuck and shoot some people, and are well served by the simpler level storylines that don't go much beyond the immediate town and evirons, while most of the hosts going off rez is happening in the context of the more complex storyline.

They do in fact show a LOT of disruption that is very concerning to investors in fact, when Maeve for instance shoots up the base town...

4. The previously mentioned logistics of transporting the hosts down to the naked diagonostic rooms and back.  That should take time, interfere with guest interaction, etc.

Yeah, there has to be some kind of faility for this - but again, this is pretty easy to handle.

For example, if a guest shoots a host at 10am, you could simply have the other hosts handle the body "in character". A doc shows up, takes the body off to the local doc shop/morgue, where it is then transported "behind the scenes" to the facilities, and the storyline resets that night.

5. In particular Clitoris isn't even in the presumably accessible main town, but out in the wilds with her new squeeze, but she gets whisked back and forth constantly.

I am not even sure what this means.

6. The Confederados beat up the dickhead boss, but hosts shouldn't be able to inflict violence on guests.

No, the hosts cannot inflict permanent harm on the guests.

And I suspect the level of incidental "harm" is based on the depth of the storyline. Probably none in the vanilla stuff for Mom and Pop and Kids, a bit more discomfort out in the sticks where the "real" stuff is going on...

7. In episode 2 Teddy and the chick guest with the wussy husband run into the spectral viking zombie whatever guys associated with Wyatt.  What happens to the chick?

I don't recall this.

8. The ease with which Maeve manipulates the two techs is ridiculous.

Agreed. The techs are both idiots, and the Asian guys motivation doesn't even make much sense.

9. The little Indian kids who had tech dolls and the little Mexican girl who was aware and helped Teh Man in Black find the maze were not explained by the story about a limited number of hosts with the old coding.

Both part of Ford's Master Plan for the hosts themselves, and not intended for interaction with humans.

[garbon]

I was wondering if this was inspired by your inability to use them properly.

[Berkut]

[LaCroix]

5. In particular Clitoris isn't even in the presumably accessible main town, but out in the wilds with her new squeeze, but she gets whisked back and forth constantly.

you mean dolores hanging out with lil will and suddenly whisking away to the dark room and speaking with bernard? that's the multi-timelines at play. dolores, hanging with will, never left will. she had memories of her hundreds of conversations with arnold, which all happened before she met will.

[Admiral Yi]

you mean dolores hanging out with lil will and suddenly whisking away to the dark room and speaking with bernard? that's the multi-timelines at play. dolores, hanging with will, never left will. she had memories of her hundreds of conversations with arnold, which all happened before she met will.

There are scenes that appear to be flashbacks/hallucinations, and others that appear to be real time.

[Berkut]

5. In particular Clitoris isn't even in the presumably accessible main town, but out in the wilds with her new squeeze, but she gets whisked back and forth constantly.

you mean dolores hanging out with lil will and suddenly whisking away to the dark room and speaking with bernard? that's the multi-timelines at play. dolores, hanging with will, never left will. she had memories of her hundreds of conversations with arnold, which all happened before she met will.

Well, I think her interactions with Will happened in the past, a long time in the past since there were presumably many years between the time that Will "lost" Dolores and became the Man in Black.

So I think Dolores conversations with Bernard happened after her interactions with Will, at least many of them.

[Berkut]

What was the idea behind Will sending Douchebag wanna be brother in law off on the horse naked?

[crazy canuck]

you mean dolores hanging out with lil will and suddenly whisking away to the dark room and speaking with bernard? that's the multi-timelines at play. dolores, hanging with will, never left will. she had memories of her hundreds of conversations with arnold, which all happened before she met will.

There are scenes that appear to be flashbacks/hallucinations, and others that appear to be real time.

I think you are getting confused by the time shifts.  To be fair to you they sometimes happen within the same scene and so until you see the final episode it is a bit confusing.

[Habbaku]

What was the idea behind Will sending Douchebag wanna be brother in law off on the horse naked?

He explained it in that very scene.  Presumably, William's father-in-law-to-be (IE, Douchebag's father and head of the company) was waiting for them back in town.  Seeing his son all trussed up and naked on a horse was supposed to tilt the father towards thinking that Douchebag wasn't in control of himself enough to be in charge of the company.  That would position William to ascend in the future.

[Habbaku]

Chrys Reviews did Westworld, by the way.  It's genius as usual:

http://chrysreviews.com/index.php/westworld/

[crazy canuck]

Berkut, on the financing question - I thought the show did a pretty good job of explaining this.  There were investors from the start.  William caused is family to be a majority investor after his first visit but the family he married into was already a shareholder.  Ford also makes a few comments about always having to deal with the investors.  I think this is just another time shift issue for Yi because in the early episodes it appears that William and his future brother in law are talking about increasing the family investment in the present rather than soon after the park opened.

[crazy canuck]

5. In particular Clitoris isn't even in the presumably accessible main town, but out in the wilds with her new squeeze, but she gets whisked back and forth constantly.

you mean dolores hanging out with lil will and suddenly whisking away to the dark room and speaking with bernard? that's the multi-timelines at play. dolores, hanging with will, never left will. she had memories of her hundreds of conversations with arnold, which all happened before she met will.

Well, I think her interactions with Will happened in the past, a long time in the past since there were presumably many years between the time that Will "lost" Dolores and became the Man in Black.

So I think Dolores conversations with Bernard happened after her interactions with Will, at least many of them.

I think many of those interactions were with Arnold himself.  Match her dress with the dress she is wearing in the scenes we know were with Arnold.

[KRonn]

I'm trying to figure if Bernard has the knowledge of Arnold or how that all came about, or if Arnold and Bernard are the same and was actually programmed by Ford. I think the latter is unlikely. But if I perceived things right, Arnold was creating something different in the hosts allowing them to achieve consciousness and Bernard seems to have the same goals.

[LaCroix]

5. In particular Clitoris isn't even in the presumably accessible main town, but out in the wilds with her new squeeze, but she gets whisked back and forth constantly.

you mean dolores hanging out with lil will and suddenly whisking away to the dark room and speaking with bernard? that's the multi-timelines at play. dolores, hanging with will, never left will. she had memories of her hundreds of conversations with arnold, which all happened before she met will.

Well, I think her interactions with Will happened in the past, a long time in the past since there were presumably many years between the time that Will "lost" Dolores and became the Man in Black.

So I think Dolores conversations with Bernard happened after her interactions with Will, at least many of them.

no. every conversation Dolores had with the black guy was more than thirty years ago (except in the finale), and the black guy then was arnold. check the clothes on the guy dolores has her private talks with--those are arnold's clothes, not bernard's. arnold died before the park opened. will and logan were in the park after it was opened OR in some type of beta phase, but it was definitely after arnold's death. also, will didn't know about arnold until dolores told him.