Income taxation and morality

[grumbler]

The second part of your post essentially argues morality from the utilitarian standpoint.

Only if you believe that utility is a purely moral consideration.

[Gups]

Jesus Christ, what is it with you and straw men today?

I suspect this is his moronic Hungarian bumpkin trigger. A lot of people from this part of the world have this completely naive, retarded view on taxation. I mean, his girlfriend apparently worships the right wing pro-Putin Polish "libertarian".

Ad homs are no better a debating tactic than straw men (either with reference to morality or effectiveness).

[Martinus]

The second part of your post essentially argues morality from the utilitarian standpoint.

Only if you believe that utility is a purely moral consideration.

I would say it's the best of moral considerations.

[Tamas]

He still has to keep the government from taking one of the beets his ancestors worked so hard to harvest

You really don't remember how we had at least two other threads in the past where Martinus was arguing for a near-100% inheritance tax on everything?

[Tamas]

Jesus Christ, what is it with you and straw men today?

I suspect this is his moronic Hungarian bumpkin trigger. A lot of people from this part of the world have this completely naive, retarded view on taxation. I mean, his girlfriend apparently worships the right wing pro-Putin Polish "libertarian".

Ad homs are no better a debating tactic than straw men (either with reference to morality or effectiveness).

I was curious. The last 3 times I directly replied to him in the past, IDK, 6 months or so, he always immediately brought up some personal "fact" about me he learned through Fireblade or Jaron. Did so again. Guy has a fascination with me I guess.

[The Minsky Moment]

Ok maybe my understanding of the concept of morality is broader and includes an utilitarian calculus (maybe it's a language thing for me).

That is a perfectly acceptable definition, but in this context it makes the proposition a truism.  Of course any system of taxation has to take into considerations of utility; the only other alternative would be to put every possible potential tax into a bag and draw them out at random until the revenue target was met.

[grumbler]

Not only that is not true no matter how often you repeat it, you fucking worshipped, at least as of about a month ago, the court comedian of Trump, so maybe you are not the perfect person to make this argument.

And on this it is you who are completely off of every natural human instinct on this one. If you were not some faux-nihilistic toe-sucking corporate lawyer, who is so out of touch with the real world that managed to worship the one political demographic which absolutely 100% despises every aspect of your existence, then you would know that  [snip]

Wow!  This is a textbook case of the ad hom argument!  You don't find pure demagoguery like this very often in the wild.

[grumbler]

The second part of your post essentially argues morality from the utilitarian standpoint.

Only if you believe that utility is a purely moral consideration.

I would say it's the best of moral considerations.

Well, it does make morality black-and-white, if that's what you believe.

I'm more of a Categorical Imperative guy myself, but I know there are utilitarian moral reasoners.

[Martinus]

Jesus Christ, what is it with you and straw men today?

I suspect this is his moronic Hungarian bumpkin trigger. A lot of people from this part of the world have this completely naive, retarded view on taxation. I mean, his girlfriend apparently worships the right wing pro-Putin Polish "libertarian".

Ad homs are no better a debating tactic than straw men (either with reference to morality or effectiveness).

Yeah but it's just so frustrating dealing with this type from this part of Europe. They make Tea Party look positively statist.

[HVC]

He still has to keep the government from taking one of the beets his ancestors worked so hard to harvest

You really don't remember how we had at least two other threads in the past where Martinus was arguing for a near-100% inheritance tax on everything?

Marti like attention. Ride out his histrionics and enjoy the other people in the thread. Inheritance tax makes sense if you look at it from the perspective as income tax on the new person receiving the money. They didn't work for it, why should the get it tax free?

[HVC]

Jesus Christ, what is it with you and straw men today?

I suspect this is his moronic Hungarian bumpkin trigger. A lot of people from this part of the world have this completely naive, retarded view on taxation. I mean, his girlfriend apparently worships the right wing pro-Putin Polish "libertarian".

Ad homs are no better a debating tactic than straw men (either with reference to morality or effectiveness).

I was curious. The last 3 times I directly replied to him in the past, IDK, 6 months or so, he always immediately brought up some personal "fact" about me he learned through Fireblade or Jaron. Did so again. Guy has a fascination with me I guess.

He's just jealous you found a polish person you don't have to pay to have sex with, something he has yet to do.

[Tamas]

Jesus Christ, what is it with you and straw men today?

I suspect this is his moronic Hungarian bumpkin trigger. A lot of people from this part of the world have this completely naive, retarded view on taxation. I mean, his girlfriend apparently worships the right wing pro-Putin Polish "libertarian".

Ad homs are no better a debating tactic than straw men (either with reference to morality or effectiveness).

Yeah but it's just so frustrating dealing with this type from this part of Europe. They make Tea Party look positively statist.

Ah, sorry. I wasn't aware this is I Am Not With the Far Right Week for you. A bit hard to keep up.

[The Minsky Moment]

Anyways to the OP:

Anytime that one treats a source of income differently for income tax purposes, one opens up a window for distortions, complexity and gaming the system.  So ideally the presumption should be all sources of income are treated the same for taxation purposes, absent some very strong justification otherwise.

[Tamas]

He still has to keep the government from taking one of the beets his ancestors worked so hard to harvest

You really don't remember how we had at least two other threads in the past where Martinus was arguing for a near-100% inheritance tax on everything?

Marti like attention. Ride out his histrionics and enjoy the other people in the thread. Inheritance tax makes sense if you look at it from the perspective as income tax on the new person receiving the money. They didn't work for it, why should the get it tax free?

Ok, but with that argument, why don't you pay tax after the value of gifts received? You didn't work for them.

[grumbler]

... a lot of parents work and keep bettering their lot in the hopes of offering an easier life for their descendants. Forcefully removing that option is one of the least moral ways to coerce income for the state.

This is a shitty argument.  Taxation is always "forcefully removing" the option of spending money as one wishes.  lack of taxation (and hence of law enforcement) also results
in someone "forcefully removing" the option of spending money as one wishes, only, in that case, it is a private actor robbing the parents.

The "taxation = theft" argument is so tired and morally bankrupt that I am surprised that you would even try to trot it out.