St. Paul was the only human who lived in the first and second centuries AD

[Caliga]

...or so sayeth His Holiness the Pope

Pope: Basilica bones belong to apostle St. Paul

ROME, Italy (CNN) -- Scientific tests prove bones housed in the Basilica of St. Paul in Rome are those of the apostle St. Paul himself, according to Pope Benedict XVI.

"Tiny fragments of bone" in the sarcophagus were subjected to carbon dating, showing they "belong to someone who lived in the first or second century," the pope said in a homily carried on Italian television.

"This seems to confirm the unanimous and undisputed tradition that these are the mortal remains of the Apostle St. Paul," Benedict said in Sunday's announcement.

The tomb also holds "traces of a precious linen cloth, purple in color and laminated with pure gold, and a blue colored textile with linen filaments," the pope said.

The tests were carried out by inserting a probe into a small opening in the sarcophagus, "which had not been opened for many centuries," the pontiff said. The probe "also revealed the presence of grains of red incense and traces of protein and limestone."

Separately, archaeologists have uncovered an image of St. Paul which "could be considered the oldest icon of the apostle known to date," the Vatican's official newspaper reported Sunday.

The painting, in the St. Tecla Catacomb, is "among the oldest and best-defined figures from ancient Christianity," according to the Pontifical Commission for Sacred Archaeology, L'Osservatore Romano reported.

St. Paul is one of the most significant figures in Christianity. Originally a persecutor of early Christians, he became a follower of Jesus after seeing a vision on the road to Damascus, according to Christian tradition.

"Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting me?" the vision of Jesus asks Paul, using the apostle's birth name, in the Acts of the Apostles.

Saul then took the name Paul and became a missionary. His letters, or epistles, to early Christian communities around the Mediterranean form a significant portion of the New Testament.

Paul was beheaded by Roman authorities sometime between 65 and 67 A.D., according to the Catholic Church.

He was buried a few miles away, and when the Roman Empire stopped persecuting Christians some 250 years later, the Emperor Constantine had a basilica built over his grave.

It currently lies under a marble tombstone bearing the Latin inscription PAULO APOSTOLO MART (Apostle Paul, martyr), according to the Web site of the basilica. A papal altar stands over the tombstone, which is visible through a window-like opening, the Web site says.

Monday marks the end of a year of celebration in honor of the 2,000th anniversary of St. Paul's birth. It also happens to be the feast day of Saints Peter and Paul.

[Neil]

That isn't what he said at all.

[Caliga]

The bone fragments were carbon dated to that time period and (I presume) shown to be human, so it seems to me like the Pope says that means the bones must belong to St. Paul.  What am I missing? 

[Palisadoes]

I think the Pope should study a bit more science. You never know, maybe he might convert to Scientology?

[alfred russel]

The bone fragments were carbon dated to that time period and (I presume) shown to be human, so it seems to me like the Pope says that means the bones must belong to St. Paul.  What am I missing? 

Science hasn't been good to the church the last few centuries. It started with Galileo, then someone counted ribs and discovered that men don't have one less than women, then there was Darwin, and then there was the shroud of turin fiasco.

Let's let the pope have his moment--he is probably just giddy that science didn't disprove him for once.

[Neil]

The bone fragments were carbon dated to that time period and (I presume) shown to be human, so it seems to me like the Pope says that means the bones must belong to St. Paul.  What am I missing? 

You forgot the part about the church tradition.  They already thought that the bones were Paul's, the testing merely confirmed that they were of the right age and strengthened their case.

It's like carbon-dating my grandmother's bones, finding out that she died in the twentieth century, and then you saying 'You think your grandmother was the only person who lived in the twentieth century'.

[Caliga]

But do they have any proof in the first place that the bones belonged to St. Paul?  I mean, if your grandmother's bones were found in her house and you could produce a deed with her name on it, plus a bunch of eyewitness testimony, etc. that's one thing.

I just think it's funny that the Pope thinks he needs scientific proof of anything he asks people to believe.  If I were Pope I'd avoid discussing scientific evidence, and scientific method for that matter, altogether.

[Neil]

But do they have any proof in the first place that the bones belonged to St. Paul?  I mean, if your grandmother's bones were found in her house and you could produce a deed with her name on it, plus a bunch of eyewitness testimony, etc. that's one thing.

Their claims are as good as any information we have about that time period.

I just think it's funny that the Pope thinks he needs scientific proof of anything he asks people to believe.  If I were Pope I'd avoid discussing scientific evidence, and scientific method for that matter, altogether.

Why not?  Science is always used selectively by virtually everyone.

[garbon]

Poor show, Caliga.

[Jaron]

So much for Guru Caliga.

[MadImmortalMan]

So would Paul have been buried with all that finery? Isn't that like Indy drinking from the wrong cup?

[DontSayBanana]

You forgot the part about the church tradition.  They already thought that the bones were Paul's, the testing merely confirmed that they were of the right age and strengthened their case.

It's like carbon-dating my grandmother's bones, finding out that she died in the twentieth century, and then you saying 'You think your grandmother was the only person who lived in the twentieth century'.

I thought the margin for error on Carbon-14 tests was about 200 years anyway.

[Caliga]

So would Paul have been buried with all that finery? Isn't that like Indy drinking from the wrong cup?

The actual Holy Grail is pretty ornate, in fact.



Interestingly enough, the Church's declaration that this is the grail is based on identical thinking to the bones of St. Paul.

a) it's a grail
b) it's been dated to the 1st century AD
c) IT'S THE HOLY GRAIL!

It's stored at the Saint Mary of Valencia (Spain) Cathedral if you really want to see it.

[saskganesh]

yeah,  but unlike 99% of the relics, these bones have sort of provenance.

still, we should encourage the pope for a full DNA test, "for more scientific support"  and trap him.

[Caliga]

How will that help?  Is Paul's DNA on file somewhere?