Brexit and the waning days of the United Kingdom

[Richard Hakluyt]

Johnson has done something I unequivocally approve of :

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-49655719


That man is such a bastard 

[celedhring]

That's nice. The US gave me 90 days...

[Solmyr]

Seems like Labour isn't letting go the idea of nationalising rail, mail, water, and energy.

Those shouldn't have been privatized in the first place. Those are like the basic functions of the state!

I can tell you that out here, only 2 of the four is run by the "state".  First class mail is handled by Canada Post, which clearly qualifies as a Crown Corporation.

Water is provided by EPCOR, a company wholly owned by the City of Edmonton.  I wouldn't necessarily call the City the "state".  But here's the thing - they also provide water in various communities throughout Alberta and BC that have nothing to do with Edmonton itself.  EPCOR is really just a for-profit enterprise that just so happens to be owned by a municipality.

Well, I meant any kind of local government in general. Those things (and others like health care) are something that should be generally available when needed, and not run for profit/available only to those who can pay for it.

[garbon]

Seems like Labour isn't letting go the idea of nationalising rail, mail, water, and energy.

Those shouldn't have been privatized in the first place. Those are like the basic functions of the state!

I can tell you that out here, only 2 of the four is run by the "state".  First class mail is handled by Canada Post, which clearly qualifies as a Crown Corporation.

Water is provided by EPCOR, a company wholly owned by the City of Edmonton.  I wouldn't necessarily call the City the "state".  But here's the thing - they also provide water in various communities throughout Alberta and BC that have nothing to do with Edmonton itself.  EPCOR is really just a for-profit enterprise that just so happens to be owned by a municipality.

Well, I meant any kind of local government in general. Those things (and others like health care) are something that should be generally available when needed, and not run for profit/available only to those who can pay for it.

Okay but you realized your position is removed from typical society?

[celedhring]

I'd definitely consider city councils, etc... to be part of the "state"

Over here rail and mail are public enterprises, water is a public service which municipalities contract out to private companies or run themselves, and energy is a heavily regulated (and disfunctional) market of private enterprises.

[Josquius]

Okay but you realized your position is removed from typical society?

https://fullfact.org/economy/do-public-want-railways-renationalised/
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2017/05/19/nationalisation-vs-privatisation-public-view

[garbon]

Okay but you realized your position is removed from typical society?

https://fullfact.org/economy/do-public-want-railways-renationalised/
https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2017/05/19/nationalisation-vs-privatisation-public-view

Sorry, I was thinking specifically on water and electric as things that should be available as needed vs not only available to those who can pay for it.

However, I think that also applies to rail as I don't think most of these things are those which people expect to get for free (or heavily discounted enough as to not prove a burden to the poor). I do know that Luxembourg is moving to free public transport but I think that's an anomalous case.

[Richard Hakluyt]

Scotland's highest civil court has ruled the current suspension of Parliament illegal :

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-49661855

Well, well, well......wonder what will happen next? So glad we took back control 

[Tamas]

I've checked up on the speaker convention and completely concede that there is no such convention, my memory is either playing me false or I have succumbed to propaganda 

On the utilities; they are quite heavily regulated and are only allowed to make "normal" profits. They have been poor investments as the profits have only averaged about 5% or so. More socially minded competitors have failed or made losses due to the tight margins in the business. The untilities are far more responsive to customer requirements than they were back in the 1970s. I tend to think of them as a fairly succesful bit of outsourcing.

One thing Labour could do, it would be far less contentious, is set up a state competitor and compete for business in the usual way. If Labour is correct and we are being ripped off then the new entity will sweep the floor; my suspicion is that it would make a loss/be indistinguishable from the other companies/be kept afloat by ideologues.

What I know is that I have not had the same utilities supplier for more than one year. At the end of my fixed price contract with the current one, I'd head to a comparison website, and find a cheaper deal for next year than the one offered.

Luckily, Corbyn will save me from all this hassle.

[Tamas]

Scotland's highest civil court has ruled the current suspension of Parliament illegal :

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-49661855

Well, well, well......wonder what will happen next? So glad we took back control 

To be fair, nobody of the current ruling class gives a toss about what Scotland thinks, or does.

[garbon]

I've checked up on the speaker convention and completely concede that there is no such convention, my memory is either playing me false or I have succumbed to propaganda 

On the utilities; they are quite heavily regulated and are only allowed to make "normal" profits. They have been poor investments as the profits have only averaged about 5% or so. More socially minded competitors have failed or made losses due to the tight margins in the business. The untilities are far more responsive to customer requirements than they were back in the 1970s. I tend to think of them as a fairly succesful bit of outsourcing.

One thing Labour could do, it would be far less contentious, is set up a state competitor and compete for business in the usual way. If Labour is correct and we are being ripped off then the new entity will sweep the floor; my suspicion is that it would make a loss/be indistinguishable from the other companies/be kept afloat by ideologues.

What I know is that I have not had the same utilities supplier for more than one year. At the end of my fixed price contract with the current one, I'd head to a comparison website, and find a cheaper deal for next year than the one offered.

Luckily, Corbyn will save me from all this hassle.

Yeah, it seems ultimately just a pain in the ass. Choice is great but not when the choice isn't very meaningful.

[Sheilbh]

Short judgment and obviously with Supreme Court tbc. Also waiting for Scottish lawyers to explain as we currently have lots of English lawyers saying how different Scts law is before opining.

So to join the crowd, it seems fairly strong.

[Tamas]

Yeah, it seems ultimately just a pain in the ass. Choice is great but not when the choice isn't very meaningful.

I was being sarcastic.

I never HAD to find a new contract. I could have stayed with the previous one. But I have had the option to put a whole 5 minutes of work into it, and save some money. Which is quite clearly a sign of anarcho-capitalism, to some.

[Duque de Bragança]

However, I think that also applies to rail as I don't think most of these things are those which people expect to get for free (or heavily discounted enough as to not prove a burden to the poor). I do know that Luxembourg is moving to free public transport but I think that's an anomalous case.

Rail infrastructure may very well be owned by the state, train services are another matter. It's not clear cut.

[Tamas]

BTW, you guys raised some good arguments for a second referendum, and this is also one: