Routine Shootings at US Schools and Universities Megathread.

[garbon]

No, its telling Dwight and co who on weekends play army games in the woods that they can be official volunteer SWAT troops if they pay attention to Officer Johanson and do nothing to bring the police into disrepute. If they're extra good boys maybe they'll even get a volunteer SWAT t-shirt.

Maybe, just maybe, they might be called upon some theoretical day in the future when there's a lunatic with a gun on the loose. But probably not.

If they want to do so, they can apply to be police officers.

[HisMajestyBOB]

More from that article:

In the hallway outside the classrooms, a throng of heavily armed law enforcement officers anxiously awaited instructions. But frustrations were growing, particularly among members of a Border Patrol tactical unit, according to the person who was briefed on the team's response.

"No one entity or individual seemed to have control of the scene," the person said. "It was chaos."

The sense of frustration among tactical team members was corroborated by two officials familiar with their debriefing.

After more than an hour, the ad hoc group of officers who had arrived ready to attack the gunman was growing impatient, and decided to move in.

One of the members — equipped with an earpiece and small microphone — quietly announced over the radio that the group was preparing to go into the classrooms. At that point a voice responded, telling them not to breach the doors.

They ignored the directive.

As the agents entered, the gunman appeared to be ready for them, the person said. He fired. They fired back, with at least one bullet striking him in the head. A bullet fragment also grazed the head of one of the Border Patrol agents.

As soon as the agents announced over the radio that the gunman had been killed, attention turned to treating the wounded. The agents helped set up a triage system, as more officers and emergency medical workers descended on the classrooms, trying to stabilize the children who had been shot but were still alive. At one point during the siege, one of the two children who called 911 had reported that at least eight or nine of the children in the two classrooms were still alive.

Khloie and her surviving classmates were rushed from the classroom. The bodies of 19 children were recovered, along with those of the two teachers. Seventeen people, including a third teacher, were wounded.

"I don't understand why somebody did not go in," said Khloie's mother, Jamie Torres. Children and teachers would have still been shot, she said, "but it would have been way less than 21."

That is simply awful. Enraging. Just....impossible to explain.

Then there's the mom who was initially detained by police, talked an officer into releasing her, entered the school and got her kids out.

And was threatened with probation for speaking out.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/uvalde-mom-who-saved-kids-from-school-shooting-says-police-threatened-her/ar-AAY5l4C

[The Minsky Moment]

Also, it is worth remembering that it is something the founding fathers would have been familiar with--slave patrols which were often connected to militias functioned as a kind of early police force in the early republic. These forces often had some military experience or training and frequently weren't paid.

Another very good argument against the proposal.

[Berkut]

Kind of an aside, but I have to wonder how the men who finally went in feel now.

On the one hand, they finally ended the situation, at great personal risk to themselves. They should be lauded as heroes, especially whoever decided to go in against orders.

On the other hand, I am sure they are bitterly angry with themselves for not ignoring those orders much, much sooner then they did.

[Oexmelin]

As is the case for many of these situations, it would be unsurprising to see a number of suicides, from police, kids, first responders, parents, in the years to come. Those get unreported as victims of these sorts of crime. To say nothing of those injured, paralyzed, depressed, turning to drugs or alcohol, etc.

[Berkut]

As is the case for many of these situations, it would be unsurprising to see a number of suicides, from police, kids, first responders, parents, in the years to come. Those get unreported as victims of these sorts of crime. To say nothing of those injured, paralyzed, depressed, turning to drugs or alcohol, etc.

The teachers husband who had a heart attack a day or two later....

[The Minsky Moment]

All worthy sacrifices to our precious idols.

[alfred russel]

Another very good argument against the proposal.

I was proposing it in the vein of jonathan swift but it seems better received than many of the ideas i'm more serious about so considering just running with it.

[Berkut]

Another very good argument against the proposal.

I was proposing it in the vein of jonathan swift but it seems better received than many of the ideas i'm more serious about so considering just running with it.

It is a uniquely horribly bad idea, which I thought was kind of obvious from the way it was proposed. 

I mean....deliciously terrible. Entire shows have used the "volunteer authority" as a comedic device.

[Sheilbh]

There's volunteer police here and in other countries but given guns I can't see how it could work in the US and making the most armed and dangerous bit of the police force volunteer strikes me as risky

Accidentally creating a paramilitary force in every town in a polarised country

[Barrister]

There's volunteer police here and in other countries but given guns I can't see how it could work in the US and making the most armed and dangerous bit of the police force volunteer strikes me as risky

Accidentally creating a paramilitary force in every town in a polarised country

The RCMP has a system of volunteer auxiliary Constables for a number of years.  It still exists, but due to increasing concern about their safety I haven't actually seen an auxiliary Cst. for years and years.

[Josquius]

There's volunteer police here and in other countries but given guns I can't see how it could work in the US and making the most armed and dangerous bit of the police force volunteer strikes me as risky

Accidentally creating a paramilitary force in every town in a polarised country

Don't they have regular volunteer sheriffs in the US? Wasn't Dwight in the office one?

[Sheilbh]

The RCMP has a system of volunteer auxiliary Constables for a number of years.  It still exists, but due to increasing concern about their safety I haven't actually seen an auxiliary Cst. for years and years.

Apparently about 10,000 volunteer police here (130,000 police total), which is a record low. But I don't think it's driven by safety fears just under-investment. There were surges in 2008 and in the run-up to the 2012 Olympics when there were big campaigns to encourage people to join and money around recruiting and training them.

It seems slightly weird given the last decade of austerity and big cuts to police numbers and Cameron's whole "Big Society" theme that increasing recruitment of volunteers wasn't a bigger focus

[viper37]

Don't be so pessimistic berkut.  Modern citizen militias have a fantastic track record, from Beirut to rural Colombia to 1990s Bosnia.

Ukraine and its Azov militia.

They brought them into the fold, made them a regular army branch and it has reduced the number of neo nazis in its ranks and made them somewhat accountable, as far as it can be in a lawless zone.

The efficacy of a citizen's militia depends on the leadership it is given.  If you give it free will to harrass people, they will.  If you look at Beirut, rural Columbia and Bosnia, the crimes committed weren't any different than those of the regular army.

Recruiting gun nuts into SWAT, keeping them busy with training and making them accountable for their actions is the key here.  Sadly, I think that last part seems lacking in the US.

[Razgovory]

There's volunteer police here and in other countries but given guns I can't see how it could work in the US and making the most armed and dangerous bit of the police force volunteer strikes me as risky

Accidentally creating a paramilitary force in every town in a polarised country

Don't they have regular volunteer sheriffs in the US? Wasn't Dwight in the office one?

Sheriff is an elected position.