STELLARIS: New Paradox Game in SPAAAACE

[celedhring]

Their plan is to fix mid-game before releasing expansions though. At least that's what they say.

In general I don't think Paradox's DLC policy is aggravating or a rip-off. I actually own very few CK2 and EU4 DLCs (always waiting for that pack discount that never comes around), and I find the games extremely enjoyable as they are. They seem pretty optional purchases to me.

[garbon]

Yes, I think Jaron's whine is misplaced in this instance - or at least premature. We can see where we are in late June and if they own up to their promises.

[sbr]

A nice start to a game just went sideways on me 37 years in.

My Arthropoid Despotic Hegemony was doing relatively well and came across a weak neighbor.  He owned 3 planets in 2 systems, his capital was closer to me than the other 2 planets were.  I DoWed and went after the 2 outer rim planets, thinking that was safer than going after the home world right off.  His fleet was no match for mine and I easily made my way through his space destroying all of his Stations on the way in; including destroying his only fleet and the Spaceport at his homeworld before moving onto my main targets.  Once I got to the system with the 2 target planets I destroyed the Spaceport and he suddenly surrendered, leaving me no choice but to accept it.  This trapped 95% of my Fleet and 3 Armies (2 Assault armies and an Elite army) well behind enemy lines with no way to get home.  Oh well, I will wait out the 10 years, re-DoW him, take the home world and then get the boys home.

Nope.

Now the part that was my fault, was that I didn't pay enough attention to suppressing the resistance (though as they were in their own Sector I don't know what options I had) and suddenly a new enemy fleet spawns, with 7 Destroyers - of my own design - (I just build my first Destroyer and had a second on the way) in a system with no Spaceport and stomps my Army transports and my ~20 Corvette Fleet almost before I can hit the pause button. 

[Legbiter]

Just wondering, is there a limit on how many planets one could or should park in any one sector, does happiness go down with more planets or is there a natural ceiling anyway?

[celedhring]

Just wondering, is there a limit on how many planets one could or should park in any one sector, does happiness go down with more planets or is there a natural ceiling anyway?

I may be wrong but I don't think there is an upper limit. You're only limited by the fact the systems have to be contiguous.

[Legbiter]

I may be wrong but I don't think there is an upper limit. You're only limited by the fact the systems have to be contiguous.

Good to know, I've got one sector with 10 planets in it, could still add a couple more.

[MadBurgerMaker]

A nice start to a game just went sideways on me 37 years in.

My Arthropoid Despotic Hegemony was doing relatively well and came across a weak neighbor.  He owned 3 planets in 2 systems, his capital was closer to me than the other 2 planets were.  I DoWed and went after the 2 outer rim planets, thinking that was safer than going after the home world right off.  His fleet was no match for mine and I easily made my way through his space destroying all of his Stations on the way in; including destroying his only fleet and the Spaceport at his homeworld before moving onto my main targets.  Once I got to the system with the 2 target planets I destroyed the Spaceport and he suddenly surrendered, leaving me no choice but to accept it.  This trapped 95% of my Fleet and 3 Armies (2 Assault armies and an Elite army) well behind enemy lines with no way to get home.  Oh well, I will wait out the 10 years, re-DoW him, take the home world and then get the boys home.

Nope.

Now the part that was my fault, was that I didn't pay enough attention to suppressing the resistance (though as they were in their own Sector I don't know what options I had) and suddenly a new enemy fleet spawns, with 7 Destroyers - of my own design - (I just build my first Destroyer and had a second on the way) in a system with no Spaceport and stomps my Army transports and my ~20 Corvette Fleet almost before I can hit the pause button. 

That sucks.  Re: having your fleets trapped though:  You should get the MIA counter in the list on the right (a year?  I think?  Some relatively large number of days).  When it hits zero, they reappear in your space.  Kind of strange that after kicking some empire's ass, your fleets can't just fly home.  Who is stopping them?

[sbr]

I had a science ship that went mia because they were in enemy territory. My fleet and army transports ended up in my territory after they handed the system over, but they wouldn't give me access to move them. I remember stuff like this happening in at least one eu game, so I assume it will be fixed.

[jimmy olsen]

I may be wrong but I don't think there is an upper limit. You're only limited by the fact the systems have to be contiguous.

Good to know, I've got one sector with 10 planets in it, could still add a couple more.

Currently there's no downside to that, hopefully in the future as politics and factions get more in depth, making sectors larger than the core territories will be risky.

[Josephus]

I love how Paradox basically just said "Yeah, we released an incomplete buggy game. But wait until you see what we have in store for you with additional paid DLC." and everyone cheers.

Those are free patches. 

Yes, yes but I mean stuff like:

First off, for those of you who are unfamiliar with our post-release policies, we will release a lot of expansions over the coming years. Each expansion will be accompanied by a major update (for Stellaris, these free updates will be named after famous science fiction authors) containing a whole bunch of completely free upgrades and improvements to the game in addition to regular bug fixes. As long as enough players keep buying paid content for the game, we promise to keep improving the game for everyone, almost like an MMO.

Its aggravating that they release the game with such major holes, such as knowing the mid game is dull and empty because they can fix it in future expansions.

It's not so much that they release with holes (those are normally patched for free); it's just that the game plan now includes. "For now we'll only release 60 per cent of the features, then we'll make 'em pay for more." Kinda like a crack dealer

[jimmy olsen]

I love how Paradox basically just said "Yeah, we released an incomplete buggy game. But wait until you see what we have in store for you with additional paid DLC." and everyone cheers.

Those are free patches. 

Yes, yes but I mean stuff like:

First off, for those of you who are unfamiliar with our post-release policies, we will release a lot of expansions over the coming years. Each expansion will be accompanied by a major update (for Stellaris, these free updates will be named after famous science fiction authors) containing a whole bunch of completely free upgrades and improvements to the game in addition to regular bug fixes. As long as enough players keep buying paid content for the game, we promise to keep improving the game for everyone, almost like an MMO.

Its aggravating that they release the game with such major holes, such as knowing the mid game is dull and empty because they can fix it in future expansions.

It's not so much that they release with holes (those are normally patched for free); it's just that the game plan now includes. "For now we'll only release 60 per cent of the features, then we'll make 'em pay for more." Kinda like a crack dealer

To be fair, they only charge 2/3rds the price of other companies.

[Jaron]

You are an idiot if you think that is being fair.

Paradox could pull this crap in 2002 because they were just getting their start. They've had enough successes now that the bar should be raised.

[Martinus]

They have to make money somehow. A lot of their competitors are now on some form of pay-to-play model, which they cannot duplicate. So they make do by releasing a lot of DLCs. Personally I don't mind it at all, if (like with CK2) it makes the game better and fresher every couple of months.

[Berkut]

I find it bizarre that people will actually say thing like "the game plan now includes. "For now we'll only release 60 per cent of the features, then we'll make 'em pay for more."

I mean, you pay a certain amount of money, and you get a certain amount of product for that money. Either you evaluate it and say "That was worth it compared to the options" or "That was not worth it compared to the options".

Their plans for additional content they may charge you for AFTER that should not enter into it - it is like bitching that you went to Cheesecake Factory, and thought the meal was great, but are pissed off that now they want you to pay more for desert, because that should have been included in the dinner price.

Well, it isn't, and you know that going in. If they had promised desert, and then tried to ask for more money when desert shows up, you have a gripe. When you look at the menu, and see that the apple cobbler is a obviously separate and optional charge, it is silly to complain that no dinner is complete without desert in your mind, and hence it is a rip off to charge separately, so you are going to downgrade your evaluation of your dinner accordingly.

We all paid some amount of money for Stellaris knowing full well that it would come out having some issues that would need to be addressed, and would be addressed via a large number of patches that would include considerable additional content on top of actual gameplay fixes.

In addition to that, there would be DLC of content that would be optional, and then additional large content expansions as well that would also be charged for - and there would even be some blurring that would be annoying, where what could arguably be called "fixes" ends up in paid for content additions (and those are legitimate things to gripe about, even if we know they are inevitable).

This model is not a mystery any more.

My metric is simple: Does the game provide a reasonable amount of play value for the money I spent on it based on what they've given me so far and what I know I can expect over the next year or so? Given my hours played, the answer is pretty obvious to me - it is already one of the top 20 games in value I've ever owned.

[garbon]

you went to Applebees, and thought the meal was great

Is that possible?

I'm down for some quick and dirty chains but I've generally always had a poor time there.