How long should Dzhokhar Tsarnaev get behind bars?

Started by merithyn, July 10, 2013, 02:40:01 PM

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Assuming he's found guilty *coughs*, how long should Dzhokhar Tsarnaev get?

American - Death penalty
American - Life w/o parole
American - Life with possibility of parole
American - > 30 years, but not life
American - < 30 years
ROTW - Death penalty
ROTW - Life w/o parole
ROTW - Life with possibility of parole
ROTW - > 30 years, but not life
ROTW - < 30 years
Other - Share with the class, please

Barrister

Perhaps you should just follow the Canadian answer - guilt is up to the jury, sentence is up to the judge.  :cool:
Posts here are my own private opinions.  I do not speak for my employer.

DGuller

Quote from: The Minsky Moment on May 18, 2015, 05:18:49 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 18, 2015, 03:36:04 PM
Would you be in favor of including jurors who believer no crime merits punishment?

That doesn't present anywhere near the same problem.  There is a very substantial percentage of people who are anti-DP on same kind of principle, and thus systematically excluding those people from capital juries is likely to create a material bias.
What's the alternative?  Once the share of population coming into the jury room with preconceived notions is above a certain threshold, you essentially grant that share of population the veto power over the law?

The Minsky Moment

Quote from: DGuller on May 18, 2015, 10:45:18 PM
What's the alternative?  Once the share of population coming into the jury room with preconceived notions is above a certain threshold, you essentially grant that share of population the veto power over the law?

The logic of the jury system is the result reflects the mores and values of the general community.  If you think that is a problem, be honest and advocate scrapping juries in particular cases.  But what is not acceptable is to say a huge swath of people with certain values is excluded categorically from some of the most important cases, and while still claiming to be true to the notion of a jury pool that is unbiased and reflects generally prevailing community values.
The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

Admiral Yi

Is the job of a juror in the sentencing portion to do whatever he or she feels like?  I would have thought there was supposed to be reference to laws or guidelines or whatever.

The Minsky Moment

Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 19, 2015, 05:36:06 PM
Is the job of a juror in the sentencing portion to do whatever he or she feels like?  I would have thought there was supposed to be reference to laws or guidelines or whatever.

Yes.
And the reason for screening people for anti-DP views is that you exclude people who admit that they may not be able to follow the law with respect to imposition of the DP.
There is a logic to that - but if one assumes that in a state like MA there are quite a lot of people who if they answered honestly would be in the category it gives rise to a different problem - you end up fatally biasing the jury pool and making it highly unrepresentative.  You've fixed one form of bias by introducing another.


The purpose of studying economics is not to acquire a set of ready-made answers to economic questions, but to learn how to avoid being deceived by economists.
--Joan Robinson

grumbler

Quote from: The Minsky Moment on May 19, 2015, 05:43:22 PM
Quote from: Admiral Yi on May 19, 2015, 05:36:06 PM
Is the job of a juror in the sentencing portion to do whatever he or she feels like?  I would have thought there was supposed to be reference to laws or guidelines or whatever.

Yes.
And the reason for screening people for anti-DP views is that you exclude people who admit that they may not be able to follow the law with respect to imposition of the DP.
There is a logic to that - but if one assumes that in a state like MA there are quite a lot of people who if they answered honestly would be in the category it gives rise to a different problem - you end up fatally biasing the jury pool and making it highly unrepresentative.  You've fixed one form of bias by introducing another.
The bias is introduced by requiring unanimity in the verdict and sentence.  I don't think any group that was actually representative could achieve unanimity.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!