HSBC leaks

[Admiral Yi]

Han is everybody except Tibetans, Mongolians, Manchus, and Uighors.

[Duque de Bragança]

Hui Chinese (Chinese-speaking Muslims) are more of then than not distinguished from Han Chinese. Mono?

[The Minsky Moment]

Seperating the consequences from the trials is necessary, imho.  A prosecutor should not ask himself what are the consequences of doing justice, he should do justice by pressing charges about those he believes to be guilty.

If the target is an individual I agree without question.  Everyone is equal before the law, no fear, no favor.

But entity prosecutions to my mind are different.  My own 2c is that criminal liability for entities is a questionable idea in the first place (AA is a good example of how pursuing the entity can actually diffuse individual responsibility).  But even accepting the principle of entity prosecution, then it follows logically that the objective is a policy based one of shaping corporate conduct.  In that sense consequences matter and should be taken into consideration.

Notwithstanding the fact that this selling process was already started prior to this, my opinion was that there needed to be a punishment for company founders and shareholders to allow this to happen.  If they are forced to sell their company for a fraction of what it's really worth, than in the future, others will think twice about colluding, and employees who risk losing their jobs will think twice about going along with this without speaking.

Holder's memo addresses this very issue - it indicates that where shareholders have profited from wrongdoing and/or employees have colluded that concerns over collateral consequences are lessened.  It is a factor the *may* be considered - only one factor, and not necessarily determinative.

The AA case to my mind is pretty extreme because: (1) the merits of the case were questionable, (2) very few individuals were complicit even indirectly, (3) there was little pecuniary benefit, (4) the collateral consequences were so dire.

[MadImmortalMan]

[Monoriu]

Han is everybody except Tibetans, Mongolians, Manchus, and Uighors.

Yes, basically.  Cantonese, Shanghainese, Hunanese etc are all Han.  Han is like 90%+ of China. 

[Admiral Yi]

BTW, how Hanified are Manchus?  Can you tell a Manchu is a Manchu?

[Monoriu]

BTW, how Hanified are Manchus?  Can you tell a Manchu is a Manchu?

There is basically no difference any more.  My grandmother is a Manchu.  You can't tell.  The language is as good as dead. 

[Sheilbh]

A summary of where we are from a UK perspective:

The HSBC files: What we know so far
Repercussions of biggest leak of confidential banking data ever ripple around the world as governments pledge to pursue alleged tax evaders and former HSBC executives and tax officials face intense scrutiny
Mark Tran
@marktran
Wednesday 11 February 2015 17.01 GMT

• On Monday, the Guardian, the BBC, Le Monde and 50 other media outlets reveal that HSBC's Swiss banking arm helped wealthy customers dodge taxes and conceal millions of dollars of assets, doling out bundles of untraceable cash and advising clients on how to circumvent domestic tax authorities. The HSBC files consist of thousands of pages made available via the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists. Covering the period 2005-07, they amount to the biggest banking leak in history, shedding light on some 30,000 accounts holding almost $120bn (£78bn) of assets. Many of the accounts belonged to prominent figures in business, film, music and sport, and the heads of royal families.

Key article: HSBC files show how Swiss bank helped clients dodge taxes

• HSBC said its Swiss branch had not been fully integrated into HSBC after its purchase in 1999, allowing "significantly lower" standards of compliance and due diligence to persist.

Key article: 'Standards of due diligence were significantly lower than today'

• Hervé Falciani, who worked for 10 years at HSBC Private Bank Suisse as a computer analyst, stole the incriminating information from his employer. The tax authorities seized the data in 2008.

Key article: Hervé Falciani to keep up fight against tax dodgers

• On Tuesday, the political firestorm began as the UK Treasury minister David Gauke faced hostile questioning from MPs to defend the government's efforts to clamp down on tax evasions. Outside the UK, calls mounted for investigations into HSBC's Swiss subsidiary.

Key article: International outcry over activities at bank's Swiss arm

• HSBC was led during the period covered in the files by Stephen Green – now Lord Green – who served as the global bank's chief executive, then group chairman, until 2010, when he left to become a trade minister in the House of Lords for David Cameron's new government.

Key article: The ethical banker with questions to answer

• In five years HM Revenue & Customs (HMRC), Britain's tax authority, used the data to bring only one prosecution. France, Belgium, Spain, the US and Argentina have launched legal proceedings against HSBC and its high net worth clients. So far, £135m has been recovered from HSBC clients in the UK. France has recovered £188m in taxes and fines from a list of 3,000 clients and Spain has recovered £220m, also from 3,000 clients. Australia said it had recovered more than A$30m (£15m) over the past five years.

Key article: HMRC had data on misconduct before bank boss made trade minister

• HMRC failed to warn that there was serious evidence of misconduct at HSBC's Swiss arm despite being asked to vet Green over his suitability to become minister. HMRC had received a disc in 2010 with 6,000 names "all ripe for investigation" David Hartnett, told MPs on the Treasury select committee in 2011. Then head of tax at HMRC, Hartnett went on to work for HSBC as a consultant after his retirement two years after the data was handed over.

Key article: HMRC cleared bank boss for peerage despite misconduct data

• The leaked files reveal the identities of donors to the Bill, Hillary & Chelsea Clinton Foundation with HSBC accounts in the tax haven, including Jeffrey Epstein, the hedge fund manager and convicted sex offender. The revelations have raised questions over the former secretary of state's campaigning focus on wealth inequality in light of the close relationships she and her husband have nurtured with some of the world's richest individuals.

Key article: Clinton foundation received up to $81m from clients of controversial HSBC bank

• On Wednesday, the Guardian reported that HSBC in Switzerland aggressively marketed tax-avoidance strategies to its wealthy clients. It proactively contacted clients in 2005 to suggest ways to avoid a new tax levied on the Swiss savings accounts of EU citizens, a measure brought in through a treaty between Switzerland and the EU to tackle secret offshore accounts.

Key article: Swiss bank aggressively pushed way for clients to avoid new tax

• Conservative donors, peers and a high-profile MP are listed among the wealthy who legally held accounts in Switzerland with HSBC's private bank, for a wide variety of reasons. Their ranks include Zac Goldsmith, MP for Richmond Park, plus his brother the financier Ben Goldsmith, and a Swiss resident, the German-born car company heir Georg von Opel, who has donated six-figure sums in the past two years.

Key article: Tories raised over £5m from HSBC Swiss account holders

• International reaction: The Spanish government is considering legal action against HSBC. The finance minister, Cristóbal Montoro, has asked for a "study of the legal actions that can be taken against HSBC" over the 2,694 Spaniards holding accounts in the Swiss subsidiary, with savings of $2.3bn (£1.5bn). Barack Obama's attorney general nominee, Loretta Lynch, said the bank could face tax-evasion charges if there were sufficient evidence, despite a settlement she reached with HSBC two years ago over money-laundering with Mexican drug cartels and breaches of US sanctions. In Belgium, a judge was already considering issuing international arrest warrants for directors of HSBC over tax fraud allegations. In Denmark, the government said it would seek the names of its citizens who may have used Swiss bank accounts to avoid domestic taxes.

Key articles: Spanish government considers legal action against HSBC

• In a rowdy session of prime minister's questions on Thursday, the Labour leader, Ed Miliband, accused David Cameron of acting as a "dodgy prime minister" after he repeatedly failed in the House of Commons to say whether he had discussed tax avoidance at HSBC with Stephen Green before appointing him as trade minister in 2011.

Key article: Ed Miliband attacks 'dodgy' PM for failure to answer HSBC tax questions

[Monoriu]

A bit surprised that there are so few clients from HK and China, given HSBC's popularity over here.  I guess the main motivation for having a Swiss banking account is for tax purpose, and there isn't much tax on capital to speak of in Hong Kong anyway.  So far the only prominent case reported in the news is the daughter of Li Peng, the Chinese premier during Tian An Men, and the amount involved is tiny.  The news doesn't have much impact on this side of the world.  Some journalists are outraged, I'm sure, but the general reaction is meh.  HSBC's share price declined by like 1-2%, but this is consistent with a minor overall market correction. 

[Martinus]

Wouldn't that assume the leak applied equally to customers from all countries?

[Monoriu]

Wouldn't that assume the leak applied equally to customers from all countries?

Yes.  Though I don't see any evidence to suggest otherwise.  I think the HK/Chinese billionaires tend to put their wealth in real estate or shares in their family businesses.  There is less of a tradition to entrust one's wealth to money managers here. 

[Sheilbh]

Oh good:
http://www.theguardian.com/news/2015/feb/12/hsbc-files-swiss-bank-hid-money-for-suspected-criminals

[Monoriu]

Oh good:
http://www.theguardian.com/news/2015/feb/12/hsbc-files-swiss-bank-hid-money-for-suspected-criminals

Innocent until proven guilty 

[Jacob]

Oh good:
http://www.theguardian.com/news/2015/feb/12/hsbc-files-swiss-bank-hid-money-for-suspected-criminals

Innocent until proven guilty 

For sure. Let's get all the information out in the open and determine whether they're guilty or not.

The bank, however, may already be guilty of breaking laws and acting unethically independent of the guilt of particular individual clients.

[Monoriu]

Somehow I think HSBC's Swiss arm is done after this.  Nobody wants to be known as an HSBC Swiss client, because they are afraid that others will assume that they are criminals.  Just sell it off and be done with it.