The Shooting Gallery: Police Violence MEGATHREAD

[merithyn]

In fact, I wasn't uncommon for me to be on the phone with Seedy in the evening while walking my dog and a situation would come up where he would get mad at me for not calling the police. Nope. Not going to happen. He still gives me shit about it.

[Sheilbh]

WTF do you people do that you frequently get into situations where you would've called the cops on someone if not for your reluctance to proceed with the execution?

Yeah - I've called the police once when I was burgled. Short of seeing violence I can't think of when I would call them.

[Admiral Yi]

I've called the cops once, when a couple of black teenagers were picking up their friends at the apartment block next door.  The driver thought he was in reverse but was in forward, and he smashed into my neighbor's deck fencing.  They switched drivers, picked up their friends (three teenage white girls) and drove away.

[grumbler]

Police, and military wear uniforms, ranks, and a hierarchical command structure.  I can't imagine why anyone would consider them to be civilians in the course of their duties.  That would also be extended to other uniformed forces like border guards, coast guard, corrections officers and the like.

Just because they're not civilians doesn't mean they're military of course.  To answer Raz's question police are not military targets because they're not military - they're police.

Dog Catchers, maintenance people, and parking attendants wear uniforms and have a hierarchical command structure. So do the Boy Scouts.  Are they al in this nebulous non-civilian-non-military status as well?

I don't understand the distinction being drawn by creating these categories of people that are neither civilians nor military.  US and international law recognize no such distinction, for good reason.  For what purpose are these categories being created.

[Sheilbh]

Also isn't it the entire ideal (however much we might miss it) - the public are the police and the police are the public. They're not a paramilitary force.

[grumbler]

Also isn't it the entire ideal (however much we might miss it) - the public are the police and the police are the public. They're not a paramilitary force.

That was once more or less true, but no longer (as evidenced by the new wave of thinking that police are not civilians any more, but separate.. whatever).

[Berkut]

One other point:  I know it's anecdotal evidence, but we do have an anecdote right here on this forum.  Berkut's nephew responded to a non-violent call.  If he managed to shoot the shoplifter who seriously wounded him, that incident would go into the 58% column.   

I've hestiated to bring it up, simply because I think it is a bad mistake to draw any conclusions from anecdotes.

I look at what happened to my nephew, and I think the institutional response that is warranted (beyond prosecuting the specific person of course) is very possibly "no response at all".

[crazy canuck]

Also isn't it the entire ideal (however much we might miss it) - the public are the police and the police are the public. They're not a paramilitary force.

The public are not given the powers of the police.  The reason the police are given those special powers is so they are not exercised by the public - ie vigilante justice

[Richard Hakluyt]

The public has the power to arrest (at least in the UK) when someone is committing a crime in front of them. I don't suppose it happens that much, easier and safer to call the police; but it is still there on the statute book and reaffirmed as recently as 1984.

[jimmy olsen]

WTF do you people do that you frequently get into situations where you would've called the cops on someone if not for your reluctance to proceed with the execution?

Yeah - I've called the police once when I was burgled. Short of seeing violence I can't think of when I would call them.

Same

[Solmyr]

I've called the cops once, when a couple of black teenagers were picking up their friends at the apartment block next door.  The driver thought he was in reverse but was in forward, and he smashed into my neighbor's deck fencing.  They switched drivers, picked up their friends (three teenage white girls) and drove away.

Did the black teenagers survive?

[Admiral Yi]

No, they drove away dead.  It was quite impressive.  Their friends just got in the car like it was an everyday thing.

[DGuller]

When you're a black teenager in the US, you have to figure out how to do things while dead, or else you'll get nothing done.

[PDH]

Also isn't it the entire ideal (however much we might miss it) - the public are the police and the police are the public. They're not a paramilitary force.

The public are not given the powers of the police.  The reason the police are given those special powers is so they are not exercised by the public - ie vigilante justice

Only Karens have the right to enforce the law (real or not) at any time.

[grumbler]

Doctors have powers not given to the public.   So do teachers, mall rent-a-cops, the ushers at baseball games, etc, etc.  Yet we don't talk about baseball ushers as distinct from civilians or not a part of the public.

Police have more discretion in the use of force than the average civilian, but having some different powers does not make any group something other than civilians and members of the public at large. I think that the shift in mindset to the police as being fundamentally different from, and apart from, the policed is dangerous to both the police and the rest of the civilians.