The Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant Megathread

[Viking]

What jihadis are doing is they are approaching the book with a blank sheet and figuring out what they want to do not from their own desires and moral sentiments but rather subjugating them to the book itself. The IS fighters are to a large extent travelling jihadis who came because they wanted to do jihad. They want to do what the book tells them because they are not picking and choosing what they like and choose to ignore.

From what I know though the book mostly says that in the context of fighting. Apart from that one oblique reference to Muhammad's act, there isn't much about beheading already vanquished foes.

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/says_about/decapitation.html

8:12
I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger.
47:4
Now when ye meet in battle those who disbelieve, then it is smiting of the necks until, when ye have routed them, then making fast of bonds; and afterward either grace or ransom till the war lay down its burdens.

and it goes on and on... that is just specifically on decpatitation. More generally it tells the muslims to fight the disbelievers and only relent when they submit.


.... now as soon as you used the word "context" you have to go to the hadith, where they do explain how muhammed did behead captives, even those who surrendered in exchange for mercy. The hadith are the explanation for the koran. Within sunni islam it is especially significant since the tradition is absolute in their theology and the hadith is the tradition. It is how the earliest sources understood the koran and in sunni theology older sources are more right than newer sources.

I don't appreciate your word games on this issue. I find it distressing that your argue that they are not a 10.0 on the 10 point scale of evil as if that is some sort of excuse or justification.

Edit: and to understand what they are being told is good

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHt-eqrLEOY&list=PL6644A687FC212F81

just a video of a man talking, no beheading

[DontSayBanana]

SPOILERS

Jeez, even I've seen the whole first season by this point.  That shouldn't even count.

[mongers]

What jihadis are doing is they are approaching the book with a blank sheet and figuring out what they want to do not from their own desires and moral sentiments but rather subjugating them to the book itself. The IS fighters are to a large extent travelling jihadis who came because they wanted to do jihad. They want to do what the book tells them because they are not picking and choosing what they like and choose to ignore.

From what I know though the book mostly says that in the context of fighting. Apart from that one oblique reference to Muhammad's act, there isn't much about beheading already vanquished foes.

Shall we play a game and guess the names of countries that are big on beheadings ?

Public executions in Saudi Arabia

In Saudi Arabia, and many Islamic countries, crime and punishment is based on Sharia Law (derived from the teachings of the Qu'ran). Sharia Law dictates specific punishments for different crimes. Some crimes that are punishable by death include:
Murder
Apostacy
Blasphemy
Idolatry
Homosexuality
Sedition
Sorcery
Witchcraft
Adultery
Drug Use/Trafficking

There are many different ways in which an execution may be carried out. The sentence for Apostacy, or the repentance of one's faith, is a public beheading, while the sentence for Adultery is death by stoning. Executions may occur within prison boundaries or in a public square, depending on court ruling. Of the 6,221 executions known to have taken place from 2007-2012 (excluding China), 423 were carried out in Saudi Arabia. This means that 6.8% of the world's executions (except China) occurred in Saudi Arabia.[1]

Witchcraft and Sorcery[edit]

Muree bin Ali bin Issa al-Asiri, who was found in possession of talismans, was executed in the southern Najran province in June 2012. A Saudi woman, Amina bin Salem Nasser,[2] was executed for allegedly practising sorcery and witchcraft in December 2011 in the northern province of Jawf, and a Sudanese man (Abdul Hamid Bin Hussain Bin Moustafa al-Fakki) was executed in a car park in Medina for the same reason in September 20, 2011.[3][4][5] (Ali Hussain Sibat, a Lebanese host of a popular fortune-telling TV program was arrested while in Saudi in May 2008 on Umrah and sentenced to death but given a reprieve.)
Qisas[edit]

Qisas, or retribution, is a common principal in Sharia Law. It is a form of mirror punishment commonly known as "an eye for an eye." Eye gougings and limb amputations are not uncommon in the middle east. In the case of murder, the victim's relatives are given the option to execute the offender, demand monetary compensation for the death of their relative (also known as blood money) or they may pardon them.

Beheading[edit]

A public beheading will typically take place around 9am. The convicted criminal walks into the square and kneels in front of the executioner. The executioner uses a sword known as a sulthan to remove the criminal's head from his or her body at the neck. Sometimes it may take several strikes before victim is decapitated.[6] After the criminal is pronounced dead, a loudspeaker announces the crimes committed by the beheaded criminal and the process is complete. This is the most common method of execution in Saudi Arabia because it is specifically called for by Sharia Law.[7] Professional executioners behead as many as ten people in a single day.[7] The severed head is usually sewn back on,[8] and sometimes put on crucifixes for public display. In 2011, an Indonesian maid's dead body was hung from a helicopter for display.[7]

Stoning[edit]

Stoning (Rajm) in Saudi Arabia is often reserved for men and women accused of specifically of adultery (sex with someone who is married). When convicted (and there must be credible witness statements from multiple people), the perpetrator will be buried up to their chest or knees in a ditch. Next, a group of people will repeatedly throw stones at the buried person until they are confirmed deceased. This method leaves no one person clearly to blame for the death.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_executions_in_Saudi_Arabia#cite_note-usnews-7

[CountDeMoney]

Do non Arabs do the beheading thing?  Maybe it is cultural.  Though I guess I recall the Taliban was big on it to.

It's always been big with the Islamic literalists, as it was The Profit's preferred method.

[garbon]

http://skepticsannotatedbible.com/quran/says_about/decapitation.html

8:12
I will throw fear into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Then smite the necks and smite of them each finger.
47:4
Now when ye meet in battle those who disbelieve, then it is smiting of the necks until, when ye have routed them, then making fast of bonds; and afterward either grace or ransom till the war lay down its burdens.

and it goes on and on... that is just specifically on decpatitation. More generally it tells the muslims to fight the disbelievers and only relent when they submit.

I don't see how that disagrees with what I said. Both are in the context of fighting and in fact that last one explicitly says to stop once you have bested them. It doesn't say that you should be beheading prisoners.

.... now as soon as you used the word "context" you have to go to the hadith, where they do explain how muhammed did behead captives, even those who surrendered in exchange for mercy. The hadith are the explanation for the koran. Within sunni islam it is especially significant since the tradition is absolute in their theology and the hadith is the tradition. It is how the earliest sources understood the koran and in sunni theology older sources are more right than newer sources.

I'm not really sure how (or rather why) what Muhammad had done to one tribe that had double crossed him should be generalized for all time, to all enemies of any stripe. Particularly given that Muhammad had times where he ransomed or just magnanimously released prisoners (both events also mentioned in the hadith).

I don't appreciate your word games on this issue. I find it distressing that your argue that they are not a 10.0 on the 10 point scale of evil as if that is some sort of excuse or justification.

Now I am very confused as I'm not arguing that at all. I'm noting that they are taking a particular view of the Koran and twisting it to fit what they feel like doing. If anything, I'm highlighting their evilness in that they are linking all muslims with this practice.

[garbon]

What jihadis are doing is they are approaching the book with a blank sheet and figuring out what they want to do not from their own desires and moral sentiments but rather subjugating them to the book itself. The IS fighters are to a large extent travelling jihadis who came because they wanted to do jihad. They want to do what the book tells them because they are not picking and choosing what they like and choose to ignore.

From what I know though the book mostly says that in the context of fighting. Apart from that one oblique reference to Muhammad's act, there isn't much about beheading already vanquished foes.

Shall we play a game and guess the names of countries that are big on beheadings ?

Public executions in Saudi Arabia

Okay?

[jimmy olsen]

Calling it beheading is making it seem nicer than it is, they sawed his head off with a small knife.

http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/19/world/meast/isis-james-foley/

[Martim Silva]

Do non Arabs do the beheading thing?  Maybe it is cultural.  Though I guess I recall the Taliban was big on it to.

Yes, the Mexicans right south of you.

Beheading has been a BIG thing in Mexico during the Drug Wars that have been taken place since the start of the century, and they're very vicious and burtal. Seems that the group called itself 'Zetas' (the 'Zs') was the one that started the trend, which everyone followed.

Hacking the bodies to pieces or removing the skin of the face are also used (and often filmed in detail).

These drug dealers are actually proud of it. There is a place, El Blog del Narco, which recieves the videos they make of their 'executions' and publishes them, with their apprasial on how the killing went. There is also a 'comments' section where drug dealers from all over South America (and even the ones involved in the killing) express their views on the beheading/general butchery.

As the blog is made by and for them, it is in Spanish. 'Decapitación'/'Degollan' are words for 'beheading'. 'Fuerte' means it's especially gruesome (and trust me, that's saying something, given the nature of 95% of the videos there). 'Muy Fuerte', even worse.

You can access it here:

http://www.elblogdelnarco.net/2014/08/lista-de-v%C3%ADdeos-de-ejecuciones-interrogatorios-y-balaceras.html

NOTE: these videos were almost all made by the dealers themselves, and are EXTREMELY graphic, with no censorship whatsoever. Not only should they not be seen at work, but they are not recommended at all to people with weak stomachs.

(Actually, some are so brutal and directed against such helpess people - like women and children, sometimes whole families that get turned from people to lumps of bloody meat in the living room - that they are not easily digested even by those who do have strong stomachs. I can see without problems the beheading/hacking to bits of guys with knives or chainsaws and am not phased in the minimum by the sight of blood, but some of these videos were too hard even for me. Watch at your own discretion).

A good number of these killings takes place right next to the Texan border, btw.

[DGuller]

I can't be arsed to watch all of these.  Can you links us up to your favorites?  You know, the ones you find yourself going back to over and over again?

[Martim Silva]

I can't be arsed to watch all of these.  Can you links us up to your favorites?  You know, the ones you find yourself going back to over and over again?

Consider yourself blessed. These are not things you want to watch *ever*.

Hearing the screams of a young girl while they hack and try to yank her head off is horrible, and enough to make one shut the video off immediately. 

(Not to mention tearing the head and the spinal cord off a 15-year-old kid while he's still screaming in terror. Bunch of fucking cowards.)

This is possibly the 'cleanest' beheading they have (surprisingly so, since most have crap skills at taking people's heads off, this executioner is actually incredibly good at it - what he does is not easy at all; it gets him praise from the blog) 

http://www.elblogdelnarco.net/2014/07/v%C3%ADdeo-de-los-zetas-decapitando-al-rojo-vivo-a-una-joven-mujer-sicaria-del-cartel-del-golfo.html

The point here, these things happen very often far closer to you than most of the posters here would like to think.

[Eddie Teach]

I wish I hadn't clicked that.

[DGuller]

I'd like to see Martim express his horror in a rape thread.  "The scumbag forced her into his house, stripped her naked, raped her viciously and repeatedly, and taped the whole thing.  Then, as a final humiliation, he posted the video of the rape on the Internet, at www.rapevideos.com/bigandnasty/under18/watch?=hlkj79sdg7".

[garbon]

So why is Martim watching these videos?

[alfred russel]

I'd like to see Martim express his horror in a rape thread.  "The scumbag forced her into his house, stripped her naked, raped her viciously and repeatedly, and taped the whole thing.  Then, as a final humiliation, he posted the video of the rape on the Internet, at www.rapevideos.com/bigandnasty/under18/watch?=hlkj79sdg7".

I'm absolutely not clicking that link; I assume it isn't real, but if it is, that is bad news.

[DGuller]

So why is Martim watching these videos?

Why do people watch porn?