The Islamic State in Iraq and the Levant Megathread

[Sheilbh]

If the Kurds can't kick them out, the Iranians will help the Shia and they would be able to hold against them.

They don't need to hold it.

[Berkut]

Being a super power who is both

A) Interested in meddling and trying to make things better, while
B) Being unwilling to just use our power directly to force change

is a royal pain in the ass. Especially when your allies are largely categorically unwilling to actually do the things they promise to help.

It really does make me think the US should do as everyone seems to want us to do, and just ditch A, since we certainly are not and should not be willing to change B.

So fuck it. Everyone seems to hate the shitty job we are doing as world policemen, and NATO refuses to do the things they promise to help, so let someone else do it. I think Russia is interested in the position.

[Ed Anger]

A good bout of American isolationism will do both the US and the world some good.

[derspiess]

along with America's reputation and general goodwill which accumulated after 9/11.

Until the next reason to hate us happened.

Pretty much, yeah.

[Sheilbh]

along with America's reputation and general goodwill which accumulated after 9/11.

Until the next reason to hate us happened.

Also, what't the point of goodwill if you don't spend it? Iraq was a mistake but I think losing goodwill's a poor argument against it.

[mongers]

A good bout of American isolationism will do both the US and the world some good.

This.

[Valmy]

Inevitably there's lots of rumours around. Two of the most striking are that this was lead by ex-members of the Iraqi Army (1st Mosul) and that they're about to announce Izzat al-Duri (the king of clubs) as the 'governor' of Iraq. He was reported, by Petraeus, as having been based in Syria so it wouldn't be a massive surprise.

Also worrying is that apparently US-trained security forces fled more or less as soon as the battle began, so there now are calls for the Kurds to try and re-take the city. There are also reports that ISIS have managed to seize fighter jets and helicopters that were in Mosul airport.

Well that's shocking.  Very few of the guys who allied with us in Iraq had any determination or desire to fight for the cause.  While our enemies were willing to sacrifice everything.  The people are more willing to fight and die for murderous theologies than anything else.  With that calculus the victory of the extremists is inevitable.

[garbon]

Being a super power who is both

A) Interested in meddling and trying to make things better, while
B) Being unwilling to just use our power directly to force change

is a royal pain in the ass. Especially when your allies are largely categorically unwilling to actually do the things they promise to help.

It really does make me think the US should do as everyone seems to want us to do, and just ditch A, since we certainly are not and should not be willing to change B.

So fuck it. Everyone seems to hate the shitty job we are doing as world policemen, and NATO refuses to do the things they promise to help, so let someone else do it. I think Russia is interested in the position.

I draw the opposite conclusion. Haters going to hate, so fuck 'em. Let's keep doing what we think best*.


(*within reason as certainly we should still be open to other information and make decisions after due consideration.)

[garbon]

along with America's reputation and general goodwill which accumulated after 9/11.

Until the next reason to hate us happened.

Also, what't the point of goodwill if you don't spend it? Iraq was a mistake but I think losing goodwill's a poor argument against it.

Agreed on both counts.

[Valmy]

A good bout of American isolationism will do both the US and the world some good.

This.

We'll see.  Once the US goes isolationist it takes a massive disaster to break us out of it.

[Viking]

seriously zero coverage of this in Norway, it seems I am wondering if a war happens if the USA isn't there to get blamed for it?

[Sheilbh]

I draw the opposite conclusion. Haters going to hate, so fuck 'em. Let's keep doing what we think best*.


(*within reason as certainly we should still be open to other information and make decisions after due consideration.)

I agree. But I don't necessarily totally agree with A or B.

[Tamas]

A good bout of American isolationism will do both the US and the world some good.

This.

Yeah. Not in the way you would hope it, though. Massive increase in defense spending for the UK and other NATO members to keep Russia and possibly China honest, not to mention all the probing and poking that would start in the Balkan states.

[Sheilbh]

seriously zero coverage of this in Norway, it seems I am wondering if a war happens if the USA isn't there to get blamed for it?

Oh it's the second story on the BBC behind another round of interminable navel gazing about 'British values'

It should be the leading story everywhere. I think it's quite important.

[Ed Anger]

We need a giant air conditioned dome over the US.