NJ teen loses first legal battle to make parents pay for education

[Valmy]

Stand all you want.  Parent who abandons their kids always = bad parent

Sometimes you have to do tough love, especially with adult children.

[derspiess]

I have two younger sisters; neither of them brought more drama to the table than my brother or I did when we were their age.

I'm sure it varies.  But my daughter brings way more drama than my son ever did.  It's cute-- for now.

Semi-related, my sister in law sent us a video of her walking in on her 4-year old daughter crying & wailing like something horrible just happened.  She asked her what was wrong and my niece instantly stopped crying & non-chalantly said "Nothing, mommy.  I'm just practicing my crying." 

[crazy canuck]

Stand all you want.  Parent who abandons their kids always = bad parent

Sometimes you have to do tough love, especially with adult children.

Perhaps, but do as I say or you are completely cut off is a total failure.

[MadImmortalMan]

There is a question of paying for her education though. Maybe the high school tuition if her parents put her in that school, but lots and lots of parents pay zero for their kids' school. For most of us it's shitty public school and then go get in debt for college. Is there a parental responsibility to educate their kids?

On one level I think there obviously is (both from a moral and an evolutionary perspective), but we've been in the process of dumping that burden on the state for a long time. And more recently, on the kids themselves.

[crazy canuck]

There is a question of paying for her education though. Maybe the high school tuition if her parents put her in that school, but lots and lots of parents pay zero for their kids' school. For most of us it's shitty public school and then go get in debt for college. Is there a parental responsibility to educate their kids?

On one level I think there obviously is (both from a moral and an evolutionary perspective), but we've been in the process of dumping that burden on the state for a long time. And more recently, on the kids themselves.

Yeah, that is the interesting question. At least in Canada the obligation does exist and normally arises in divorce cases where the custodial parent claims it as part of support payments.

There is also a little known corresponding duty of support of adult children to their parents in some circumstances.

[grumbler]

Perhaps, but do as I say or you are completely cut off is a total failure.

Perhaps, but "you are an adult now, so choose to obey the rules of the house, or find someplace else to live" isn't the same as "you are completely cut off."   That isn't to say that the parents are not failures - almost all parents are, to some extent - but that their position is not completely unreasonable.

[crazy canuck]

Perhaps, but do as I say or you are completely cut off is a total failure.

Perhaps, but "you are an adult now, so choose to obey the rules of the house, or find someplace else to live" isn't the same as "you are completely cut off."   That isn't to say that the parents are not failures - almost all parents are, to some extent - but that their position is not completely unreasonable.

I dont see much of a difference.  In my view if a parent has to resort to a my house my rules or get out form of communication it is pretty much at the point of complete failure.

[Malthus]

Perhaps, but do as I say or you are completely cut off is a total failure.

Perhaps, but "you are an adult now, so choose to obey the rules of the house, or find someplace else to live" isn't the same as "you are completely cut off."   That isn't to say that the parents are not failures - almost all parents are, to some extent - but that their position is not completely unreasonable.

Isn't the current case about funding education as well as living arrangements?

[grumbler]

Isn't the current case about funding education as well as living arrangements?

It is about whether the daughter can continue to go to a private school against the wishes of the parents.  I am not sure that them funding a private school for a time creates a legal obligation for them to do so as long as the daughters wants them to (or, maybe just until the end of the school year, which would be the same things since she is a senior).  I could see that obligation going both ways.  The parents say her college fund is available to her, but only for college.

[Valmy]

Stand all you want.  Parent who abandons their kids always = bad parent

Sometimes you have to do tough love, especially with adult children.

Perhaps, but do as I say or you are completely cut off is a total failure.

Well obviously if the relationship has broken down so much people are suing each other there is a lot of fail going on.  But I was just speaking generally.

[Malthus]

Isn't the current case about funding education as well as living arrangements?

It is about whether the daughter can continue to go to a private school against the wishes of the parents.  I am not sure that them funding a private school for a time creates a legal obligation for them to do so as long as the daughters wants them to (or, maybe just until the end of the school year, which would be the same things since she is a senior).  I could see that obligation going both ways.  The parents say her college fund is available to her, but only for college.

It just seems so spiteful.

I can see a situation in which parents determine that they simply cannot live anymore in the same space as their kids, for whatever reasons (I hope this never happens to me, but I can see it). I simply cannot see parents saying, in effect, that they wish to punish their kid by ceasing to fund the education that they were previously willing to fund - particularly high school, in which getting the best possible result affects the kid's whole future long after whatever youthful rebellion or spat is forgotten about. 

I have no idea of the legality of this, and I suspect it varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction - as a parent myself, I just can't see any way I'd ever do this. Surely I'd always want the best possible education for my kid, no matter what our differences? 

[grumbler]

It just seems so spiteful.

I can see a situation in which parents determine that they simply cannot live anymore in the same space as their kids, for whatever reasons (I hope this never happens to me, but I can see it). I simply cannot see parents saying, in effect, that they wish to punish their kid by ceasing to fund the education that they were previously willing to fund - particularly high school, in which getting the best possible result affects the kid's whole future long after whatever youthful rebellion or spat is forgotten about. 

I have no idea of the legality of this, and I suspect it varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction - as a parent myself, I just can't see any way I'd ever do this. Surely I'd always want the best possible education for my kid, no matter what our differences? 

Unlike you, I can imagine behaviors a child could engage in which indicated that they were not deserving of a private education.  I have seen kids from my school lose out as a result of behavior.  I think that, sometimes, a child learns more from a life lesson, like "you cannot behave in an antisocial manner and expect everyone to still kiss your ass," than from an entire semester in private versus public school.  If you cannot see any way in which that could be true, then we just have different abilities to see things.

Now, I don't know whether the bratty kid problem is the case here - we just don't have enough details.  I have seen bratty kids learn to stop being brats when there are negative consequences for brattiness, though.

[crazy canuck]

I think that, sometimes, a child learns more from a life lesson, like "you cannot behave in an antisocial manner and expect everyone to still kiss your ass," than from an entire semester in private versus public school.  If you cannot see any way in which that could be true, then we just have different abilities to see things.

At our school, if it reaches the that point, the student is asked to leave.  You are correct that we dont have all the facts but it appears that her behaviour did not reach the point of giving the school reason to remove her from the school.  Rather, that appears to have been the parents decision which is I think the point Malthus was making.

[Ideologue]

The real problem is that private schools exist in the first place, isn't it?

[Admiral Yi]

The real problem is that private schools exist in the first place, isn't it?

And private families.