NATO Cold Weather Training - or not...

[Viking]

From the Razgovory of England

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2568384/British-soldiers-banned-training-snowy-conditions-Norwegian-base-health-safety-rules-deem-COLD.html

British soldiers banned from training for snowy conditions at Norwegian base because health and safety rules deem it too COLD
British soldiers cannot join NATO counterparts in Porsanger, Norway

Temperatures can drop to -25C, but rules prevent soldiers from facing them
A Norwegian officer says the rules have caused 'amusement' among locals
By SAM WEBB

British soldiers are being banned by health and safety rules from training at a military base in the Arctic circle - because it's too cold.
Locals at the Allied Training Centre in Porsanger in Norway said they were stunned that while Norwegian troops were out in -25C weather, the Brits were being kept in the warm because of the army rules.
The base commanding officer Lieutenant Colonel Trond Thomassen confirmed: 'British officers are not in a position to train with large divisions at Porsanger, where the temperature drops to 25 degrees below zero.

'Basically, it's a waste of time if they go there as it's too cold. The British have rules for health and safety.
'They would be sitting in the barracks, and receiving no training at all, whenever the mercury dropped below -20C.'

During winter warfare training soldiers face various tasks, including cross-country skiing, setting up base camp, cooking in the extreme cold, constructing snow shelters and learning how to survive after falling through ice.
Thomassen pointed out that within NATO, 'Cold Winter Training' means eight degrees centigrade and below.

Thomassen added: 'Not surprisingly it's caused amusement in the area.
'Eight degrees in Porsanger means a fine autumn day, but I tell them we have to remember that NATO includes nations like the Germans, Spaniards and Italians, who have a completely different climate.'
Local politician Ida Kathrine Balto from Porsanger where the military presence is a mainstay of the local economy said: 'I have to admit I was stunned by the news.
'I wonder what the British would do if there was a war in winter. To my mind, you would think that a little extreme weather would provide better training for soldiers.'
The Ministry of Defence did not comment.
k

While it is easy to mock this story, the real issues are that the cold weather training is for teaching them how to survive in certain temperatures, namely below 8 plus degrees. -20 is a completely different issue, snot freezes in your nose at that temperature and different kinds of equipment are needed, and even in the best case at those temperatures putting somebody not acclimatized into a stressful situation out in the cold and wet and wind hypothermia happens. TBH, every year there are a few stories from norwegian basic training about recruits who just die.

Note, the facility will still be used for extreme weather training the SBS and other elite formations do. Also, do note, that the training area is north of the line norway is willing to defend in case of war. 

[Zanza]

So? The Swiss airforce is only operating at office hours.

[lustindarkness]

Typical military decision making.

[Brazen]

And they let SAS trainees die of heat exhaustion on Welsh mountains instead.

[grumbler]

First, we are talking about the Daily Fail, so most of the facts and quotes in the article are probably made up.  Second, it is ridiculous to compare the abilities of soldiers equipped to survive in a different temperature range with those not so equipped.  It's like being amused that Norwegian Army troops don't train at 100 feet below the ocean's surface, like the US Navy SEALs, because it is "too deep."

[The Brain]

Northern races are significantly stronger than southern breeds.

[Razgovory]

It's nice that British News papers are being named after me.

[Viking]

First, we are talking about the Daily Fail, so most of the facts and quotes in the article are probably made up.  Second, it is ridiculous to compare the abilities of soldiers equipped to survive in a different temperature range with those not so equipped.  It's like being amused that Norwegian Army troops don't train at 100 feet below the ocean's surface, like the US Navy SEALs, because it is "too deep."

Teh story originates in the local paper in norway.

[crazy canuck]

First, we are talking about the Daily Fail, so most of the facts and quotes in the article are probably made up.  Second, it is ridiculous to compare the abilities of soldiers equipped to survive in a different temperature range with those not so equipped.  It's like being amused that Norwegian Army troops don't train at 100 feet below the ocean's surface, like the US Navy SEALs, because it is "too deep."

Teh story originates in the local paper in norway.

Great so now its Norwegians who make up quotes and facts.

[grumbler]

First, we are talking about the Daily Fail, so most of the facts and quotes in the article are probably made up.  Second, it is ridiculous to compare the abilities of soldiers equipped to survive in a different temperature range with those not so equipped.  It's like being amused that Norwegian Army troops don't train at 100 feet below the ocean's surface, like the US Navy SEALs, because it is "too deep."

Teh story originates in the local paper in norway.

And now it has been removed from the Mail's web site.  is it still on the Norwegian newspaper's site?

[LaCroix]

-25C is pretty cold. it's a little over -37C right now including the wind chill, and i wouldn't want to be outside for long periods training under military conditions. it's hard to do anything, and any bit of skin that's exposed just plain hurts

[The Brain]

If you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen.

[LaCroix]

If you can't take the heat get out of the kitchen.

pft, sweden knows nothing of cold