Ukraine's European Revolution?

[MadImmortalMan]

Ukraine has a great army motivated by the recruiting powers of their mightiest strategic advantage, Ukrainian women. They don't get fat until at least 25!

[DontSayBanana]

The point of NATO was that the West could oppose Russian aggression with one voice.  Nobody has an interest in that anymore.  I genuinely wonder if NATO would do something if the Baltics were overrun.

It doesn't help that, paradoxically, thanks to the meant-to-be fig leaf that is Russia's seat on the UN Security Council, NATO is now beholden to the very country it was designed to help counter.

[alfred russel]

The point of NATO was that the West could oppose Russian aggression with one voice. 

I think it is a defensive alliance. Russia/the USSR have rolled their tanks lots of places without a NATO response.

[Razgovory]

Meh. We might be reluctant of getting killed for others in Western Europe, but we do manufacture an absurd amount of modern weapons. Just start sending some to those that will put them to good use. If Putin wants to play this by the Cold War book, why can't we?

If Putin comes to understand that's all you'll do then Russia could pick you guys off one by one.

[Iormlund]

Meh. We might be reluctant of getting killed for others in Western Europe, but we do manufacture an absurd amount of modern weapons. Just start sending some to those that will put them to good use. If Putin wants to play this by the Cold War book, why can't we?

If Putin comes to understand that's all you'll do then Russia could pick you guys off one by one.

What makes you think the Russian Army can even get past the Ukraine? It's not the Soviets we're talking about.

We'd also get see if the Russian Army can swallow countries faster than advanced economies can build nukes.

[alfred russel]

If Putin's master plan is to conquer Spain, he has certainly moved at a deliberate pace his first 15 years or so. 

[alfred russel]

HOWEVER, Ukraine is the first step in this theoretical progression of conquest: UKRAINE, Poland, Germany, France, SPAIN.

Iormlund, you might want to start studying Russian just in case.

[Razgovory]

Meh. We might be reluctant of getting killed for others in Western Europe, but we do manufacture an absurd amount of modern weapons. Just start sending some to those that will put them to good use. If Putin wants to play this by the Cold War book, why can't we?

If Putin comes to understand that's all you'll do then Russia could pick you guys off one by one.

What makes you think the Russian Army can even get past the Ukraine? It's not the Soviets we're talking about.

We'd also get see if the Russian Army can swallow countries faster than advanced economies can build nukes.

And Europe doesn't have the militaries it once did either.  The Ukraine is on the verge of civil war, we don't even know if the army can fight or even would.  Who would you guys fight for?  If not Ukraine, what about Estonia?  What about Poland?  What about Austria?

[Queequeg]

Poland's incredibly, fiercely anti-Russian and we'd be sending them a ton of the best supplies and training America and Europe had to offer even if for some insane reason we weren't dedicating our boys to the conflict. 

[Queequeg]

Russia would be facing a fierce anti-partisan campaign in Galicia and the Carpathians years before it would be in a place to attack Poland.  And we'd be shoving anti-tank and anti-air equipment in there.  It just wouldn't work.  This isn't the 30s. 

[alfred russel]

While this talk of Russia moving into central Europe is completely insane, Spellus is right. Russia intervening in the Ukraine has always been seen as somewhat possible, as is seen right now (Russians in the Ukraine without an apparent response even from Ukraine). That is why NATO for Ukraine was a terrible idea. Poland is completely different. Even if no one else did anything at all, Russia would have its hands full in Poland. There would be no point to an invasion--it would make Russia worse off even in a best case scenario.

[Grinning_Colossus]

Ekho Moskvy said the situation was tense in Crimea as "the region does not recognize the change in government in Ukraine."

Ah, I think I see where this is going. They're going to install Yanukovych in Simferopol as the 'legitimate government' of all Ukraine. He fled to Crimea before he went to Moscow, so I wonder if the original plan was for him to call for Russian assistance from there.

[Razgovory]

The partisan campaign in the 1950's was all that successful...  And you are right, it's not the 1930's.  Maybe there won't be any partisans at all this time.  Maybe Ed's right.  Maybe we should leave the Euros to their own devices.  If they won't stand up for each other, why should we stand up for them?

[Queequeg]

The Poles won in 1919 when their country was still a post-apocalyptic hellhole.  Again, they can hold their own if we give them the right equipment even if we're so fuckign retarded that we don't dedicate our troops to war with a Fascistic Russia. 

[Queequeg]

The Russians are the Pole's racial enemies and they have a competent government and Russia has problems fighting wars when it's own extermination is not on the line.   This is an absurd fantasy of a situation.