McDonalds: "What, my peon, you don't work two full time jobs?"

[dps]

I've managed restaurants that paid at that scale. And it simply does not work in the manner described, and I had, that I can recall, very, very few employees who were using their near minimum wage job as any kind of actual career.

Instead I employed

1. Students - most of the labor force by far, probably 75%.
2. People for whom this job was a second job, working part time evenings to help make ends meet.
3. Retirees looking to supplement their retirement or simply bored (awesome employees, btw)
4. People who just need any job, and I know they won't stay long, or they will move to category 2 once they find a better job, or will move into management.

This is what people are missing.  These jobs are not intended to be positions filled by people who live alone and have no other income, or who are heads of households.  They're jobs for people, for example full-time students, who want to work part time to pick up some extra spending money.

[Josquius]

What is interesting about this debate is the basic problem I have with the liberal mindset. It never, ever stops. No matter what service or tax break or assistance is given, the moment it is established, they just then move the bar for another group that needs "help" from the gentle hand of the state. McJobs have been around forever, and yet never before was their this argument that minimum wage ought to provide a living salary for your typical adult American. What has changed about our society such that now minimum wage should actually be equal to median wage?

Are you sure?
Maybe it was mainly a British thing and didn't really get a look in over in the US (I doubt it...) but during the 19th century the exploitation of the work force was a pretty big deal and it let to a lot of reforms we now take for granted.
Hell, the very idea of a minimum wage stems from this sort of thinking

[Grey Fox]

I've managed restaurants that paid at that scale. And it simply does not work in the manner described, and I had, that I can recall, very, very few employees who were using their near minimum wage job as any kind of actual career.

Instead I employed

1. Students - most of the labor force by far, probably 75%.
2. People for whom this job was a second job, working part time evenings to help make ends meet.
3. Retirees looking to supplement their retirement or simply bored (awesome employees, btw)
4. People who just need any job, and I know they won't stay long, or they will move to category 2 once they find a better job, or will move into management.

This is what people are missing.  These jobs are not intended to be positions filled by people who live alone and have no other income, or who are heads of households.  They're jobs for people, for example full-time students, who want to work part time to pick up some extra spending money.

And this fails to take in account the realignment that happen in the US job markets. You have no manufacturing jobs for those kind of workers anymore.

[Valmy]

This is what people are missing.  These jobs are not intended to be positions filled by people who live alone and have no other income, or who are heads of households.  They're jobs for people, for example full-time students, who want to work part time to pick up some extra spending money.

I don't think people are missing that.  However if that was, in fact, the vast majority of their workforce I do not think they would be recommending they go on foodstamps.

[Valmy]

And this fails to take in account the realignment that happen in the US job markets. You have no manufacturing jobs for those kind of workers anymore.

Well we have a few and they are coming back...of course they do not pay that much more than the McJobs.  That kind of worries me a bit actually.

[CountDeMoney]

This is what people are missing.  These jobs are not intended to be positions filled by people who live alone and have no other income, or who are heads of households.  They're jobs for people, for example full-time students, who want to work part time to pick up some extra spending money.

That may fly in the suburbs, but there aren't too many full-time students who want to work part time to pick up some extra spending money at the McD's on North and Maryland in the 'hood.

[merithyn]

And this fails to take in account the realignment that happen in the US job markets. You have no manufacturing jobs for those kind of workers anymore.

Well we have a few and they are coming back...of course they do not pay that much more than the McJobs.  That kind of worries me a bit actually.

This is not true, in my experience. Factory jobs are coming back, and they pay pretty damn well around here. Most start at $15/hour in this area.

[Josquius]

Yeah, factory jobs tend to pay pretty well. They have to because the shifts and tedious work involved is so unpleasant.

This is what people are missing.  These jobs are not intended to be positions filled by people who live alone and have no other income, or who are heads of households.  They're jobs for people, for example full-time students, who want to work part time to pick up some extra spending money.

In an ideal world that's how things would be.
In the world we do live in howevever many people have no choice but to take on these jobs full time. Its a tough world, you can't choose what job to do, you have to take whatever you can get.

[Valmy]

This is not true, in my experience. Factory jobs are coming back, and they pay pretty damn well around here. Most start at $15/hour in this area.

Well that is fantastic news.  From what I have read they tend to be around $10.00.  If we have manufacturing coming back in at sufficient rates at $15.00 an hour our problems would be over.

[merithyn]

This is not true, in my experience. Factory jobs are coming back, and they pay pretty damn well around here. Most start at $15/hour in this area.

Well that is fantastic news.  From what I have read they tend to be around $10.00.

Even that's far better than minimum wage. Two people earning that amount would be able to live together and raise a family. Not easily, but the bare necessities would be met.

[Ed Anger]

This is not true, in my experience. Factory jobs are coming back, and they pay pretty damn well around here. Most start at $15/hour in this area.

Well that is fantastic news.  From what I have read they tend to be around $10.00.  If we have manufacturing coming back in at sufficient rates at $15.00 an hour our problems would be over.

Hell, US Steel is expanding in Lorain. OHIO NEEDS PIPES.

[HVC]

From my experience in manufacturing (limited though it may be) you have a few guys making ok money and a bunch of temps making fuck all.

[lustindarkness]

US Steel needs to stop putting gates on their properties that have good off roading trails, they are making it a bit difficult to trespass.

[Malthus]

$10 per hour is what I earned in the pottery studeo as an apprentice ... more than two decades ago. 

[merithyn]

From my experience in manufacturing (limited though it may be) you have a few guys making ok money and a bunch of temps making fuck all.

Maybe that's it. Those that I know work for the companies outright. I don't know anyone who temps for them.