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#1

Off the Record / Re: Quo Vadis GOP?

Last post by Razgovory - Today at 01:10:52 PM

The Clintons were a bluff that failed.  Trump & Co hoped that the Clintons would defy it and that Democrats in the House would rally behind the Clintons and support obstruction of an obviously political subpoena, thus setting precedent for others to defy such subpoenasin the future.  Some old-line Dems fell right into the trap, but others broke ranks and joined the threat of contempt sanctions (the right thing to do to preserve the House's prerogative), and the Clintons conceded the point.  Now, the Republicans are stuck with a deposition that they never really wanted to take.

The precedent will do us no good if Trump never leaves office.

#2

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Razgovory - Today at 01:04:39 PM

I think Muslims (including people who are not Muslim but "appear" Muslim) experience discrimination, both on a structural and sort of "everyday" level that is somewhat analogous to racism. I think that's what Islamophobia usefully describes.

I think it's a huge problem in Europe, including the UK. I think part of the problem is that in the framing of it I think we are downstream of the US - part of this is simply that in the US there are people who have thought through aspects of racism more and have expressed that. But I think that does mean that some of the framing is from the American experience which I think understandably centres on anti-black racism and white supremacy in the context of a slave society. Whereas I think Islamophobia is as important to the development of European identities (I think the Islamic world is, to use the overly-academic phrase, Europe's constitutive other) - and interacts with race - but I don't think we have had the same level of thought (or activism actually) in this area. So the framing that can apply sometimes fits uneasily and in a way that can give European bigots a bit of an out.

Is it right to call Islamophobia racism? Probably not. Is that definitional argument much more than angels dancing on the head of a pin? Not really.

Edit: I'd add the leading anti-Islamophobia group in the UK (equivalent to the Community Safety Trust) condemned the Green ads as promoting sectarian division. As I mentioned and garbon flagged all the big parties have some record of this - I don't think it will lead anywhere good if the parties are playing with that stuff every 4-5 years because a vote's a vote.

I remember a quote from Linda Sarsour. 

"when I wasn't wearing a hijab I was just some ordinary white girl from New York City. Wearing hijab made you know that I was Muslim."

She now Identifies as a Person of Color.  I find that deeply weird.

#3

Off the Record / Re: The EU thread

Last post by Duque de Bragança - Today at 01:02:48 PM

No, we still hate Spanish fishermen. 

Leave the cod to the Portuguese I say. 

#4

Off the Record / Re: Facebook Follies of Friend...

Last post by Duque de Bragança - Today at 12:58:49 PM

So they're implementing a caste system?

Nope, that's infidel hindu, so haram. 

#5

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by garbon - Today at 12:52:01 PM

Yeah India doesnt allow it but I think you can get some sort of ID card that still allows you most rights bar things like standing for office and owning farmland.

#6

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Sheilbh - Today at 12:46:38 PM

By the by, just as a couple of examples of the overlap of political networks and how diasporas can stay involved in poliics with globalisation. Just yesterday Bangladesh issued an Interpol red notice for the arrest of the Labour MP Tulip Siddiq who has been convicted (in absentia) of corruption - rather unfortunately she was Keir Starmer's anti-corruption minister - related to her aunt, Sheikh Hasina who was the authoritarian/illiberal democrat Awami League PM of Bangladesh who was overthrown a year or two ago.

Another I think more interesting example is Mohammed Sarwar who is the father of the Scottish Labour Party leader, Anas Sarwar. Mohammed Sarwar was I think the leader of Glasgow council for a while - certainly a big player in Glasgow politics. He then became a Labour MP for a Glasgow seat until 2010 when he stepped down. Gordon Brown nominated him for a peerage but this was blocked following advice from HMRC. He then has an entire second career in Pakistani politics - he's twice Governor of Punjab (once under Nawaz Sharif's party, once for Imran Khan's) and a Senator in Pakistan.

And I think diasporas have always maybe retained an interest in the politics back home - just look at Irish-Americans. But with remittances and the internet and easier, cheaper air travel - there is just less distance. So Sarwar's career is exceptional but I wouldn't be surprised if it becomes more common.

There's less of this with Indian politics because I don't think India allows for dual citizenship. But there's growing BJP/Tory overlap. It's probably also relevant that for national elections (so MPs) the UK allows anyone who is a lawful resident and a citizen of a Commonwealth country to vote.

#7

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Valmy - Today at 12:43:03 PM

I agree on there's not much you can do on how people reach their decision. But the flipside is you should be pretty militant on the secrecy of the ballot box. So local council staff should absolutely be enforcing that.

Agreed. People should not even be allowed to voluntarily show their ballot to somebody else.

#8

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Norgy - Today at 12:31:59 PM

It probably has its own dirty clubs in Soho, doesn't it? 

#9

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by Sheilbh - Today at 12:31:24 PM

Beyond insuring that only one person at a time is in a voting booth and their vote remains secret I don't think there is anything more you can do about that. It is a person's right to let somebody else tell them how to vote and vote accordingly.

I agree on there's not much you can do on how people reach their decision. But the flipside is you should be pretty militant on the secrecy of the ballot box. So local council staff should absolutely be enforcing that. There is a bit of a row about this as the council say these monitors didn't inform them on the day, the monitors say they did. If the council were turning a blind eye to men escorting their wives into the ballot booth and going with them that's an issue.

But postal ballots are another issue. I think I said this at the time when votre ID was introduced - there's really basically no evidence of that type of voter fraud, but there have been concerns around postal voting since it was introduced. I can't find it but I absolutely remember a BBC report (I think about Bradford and about Galloway) with people basically giving their postal ballots to the local political "boss" to complete for them.

I also think there is an issue around influence and intimidation from the groups of young men escorting people to vote which is why the police were necessary to enforce a cordon around some polling stations.

[weird term]

#10

Off the Record / Re: Brexit and the waning days...

Last post by garbon - Today at 12:29:55 PM

Yes that is the whole complaint. It is illegal.

Well ok I guess I agree with Reform on this 

But "family voting" is a weird term for this.

I mean it is the UK so I would thing this would be a given.