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[Whether or not a statement is an outright lie, claims that play fast and loose with the truth degrade politics. Mr. Poilievre could have said that he would not support a pharmacare plan that could one day bring an end to private plans. Mr. Holland could have said those existing plans are safe for the foreseeable future. Those two statements would have laid the foundation for a proper political debate. Instead, each of them distorted and misled.]

#1

Off the Record / Re: [Canada] Canadian Politics...

Last post by crazy canuck - Today at 04:15:26 PM

A Globe editorial about how childish our Federal political leaders have become

To accuse your political opponent of being a liar is so serious a charge that the word is banned in legislatures. And so when federal Health Minister Mark Holland last week told a reporter that Conservative Leader Pierre Poilievre was lying about pharmacare, he levelled a grave accusation.

But was that accusation of lying itself true?

Mr. Poilievre had said he would not support the government's new pharmacare legislation because, he claimed, it would require people who had prescription plans through their workplace to move over to the government's plan.

Except the legislation as it currently exists does not do that. It offers contraceptive and diabetic medication through a government plan to those who have no plan of their own. But no one is required to abandon their existing arrangement. Mr. Holland said the Conservative Leader was "spreading what are out-and-out lies."

For some political observers, Mr. Poilievre's remarks were symptomatic of a dangerous new trend that is being spread by right-wing populists and personified by former U.S. president Donald Trump: peddling conspiratorial untruths to rally uninformed voters to their side. Like everything in politics, however, the reality is more complicated.

Mr. Holland left out a key fact, a bit of mendacity-by-omission. While the existing pharmacare legislation does not compel universal public access today, it aspires to that eventual end. Bill C-64 states that it seeks to improve "the accessibility and affordability of prescription drugs ... with the aim of continuing to work toward the implementation of national universal pharmacare."

So while covered workers will not lose their private plan tomorrow, they may lose it some day. Mr. Poilievre could and should have made that distinction. But his words were not the bald-faced lie that Mr. Holland said they were. They belonged, instead, to the everyday prevarication, obfuscation and distortion that is the stuff of political discourse.

Such as when Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, last October, announced that home heating oil would be exempt from the carbon price. The move disproportionately benefited Atlantic Canada, which is far more dependent than other parts of the country on heating oil.

Mr. Trudeau denied the carve-out was aimed at saving the Liberals' political bacon in the Atlantic provinces. Suspending the tax, he said, was intended to help everyone who heats their homes with oil make the switch to cleaner alternatives.

But the truth is that the tax was deeply unpopular in Atlantic Canada, and MPs from the region had been lobbying hard for the exemption. As he made the announcement, a gaggle of them stood behind Mr. Trudeau, nodding happily.

Lest there be any doubt about the politics of the decision, Rural Economic Development Minister Gudie Hutchings offered a solution for those in the West who complained that natural gas had not also been exempted: "Atlantic caucus was vocal with what they've heard from their constituents, and perhaps they need to elect more Liberals in the Prairies so that we can have that conversation as well," she told CTV.

Nothing that Mr. Trudeau said about the home heating oil exemption could be described as a lie. And yet the political calculations behind the announcement clearly contradict the Prime Minister's own words.

Whether or not a statement is an outright lie, claims that play fast and loose with the truth degrade politics. Mr. Poilievre could have said that he would not support a pharmacare plan that could one day bring an end to private plans. Mr. Holland could have said those existing plans are safe for the foreseeable future. Those two statements would have laid the foundation for a proper political debate. Instead, each of them distorted and misled.

Mr. Poilievre took political rhetoric far past the breaking point recently when he visited anti-carbon tax protesters camped out beside a highway near the New Brunswick-Nova Scotia boundary. "People believed his lies," he told them, referring to Mr. Trudeau. Mr. Poilievre disagrees with his opponent and thinks his policies are wrong-headed and damaging; he should simply say that. Childish insults are, or should be, beneath his office.

There's a reason Parliament bans words such as "lie" and "liar": They coarsen and corrode discourse, and turn political debate into trash talk. That's true inside a legislature, and beyond its confines.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/gift/519974dc5e28f762a87fb14c1570523f4fb873adfcfcb945043907ccc3c41650/76AEJW2KI5BW5OTCW3ESZEL4GY/

#2

Off the Record / Re: NHL Hockey thread

Last post by Grey Fox - Today at 04:14:29 PM

Yes, you would be a tool.

#3

Off the Record / Re: Israel-Hamas War 2023

Last post by DGuller - Today at 03:41:18 PM

Is "Palestinian" a curse word?

#4

Off the Record / Re: NHL Hockey thread

Last post by Barrister - Today at 03:26:52 PM

Lawyer beaten and left in an alley, News at 11

See that's the last thing I'd worry about.  I've worn a Jets jersey to Rogers Place lots of time - when the Jets are the visiting team.  It's actually fun - never really been hassled, I'm definitely not the only one (lots of us Toban expats out in Alberta).

Just more wondering about wearing it when the Jets aren't even playing - but then again it's only a watch party to begin with.

#5

Off the Record / Re: TV/Movies Megathread

Last post by Josquius - Today at 03:06:18 PM

Schmigadoon was a fun short series.

#6

Off the Record / Re: TV/Movies Megathread

Last post by Barrister - Today at 03:02:14 PM

So I would say Ted Lasso is worth the price of an Apple TV sub by itself.  I loved that show.

That being said, nothing else on the platform has every really grabbed me.

#7

Off the Record / Re: [Canada] Canadian Politics...

Last post by Barrister - Today at 03:00:45 PM

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-ford-announce-honda-ev-deal-1.7184495

So Honda announces a $15 billion dollar investment in electric vehicles and battery manufacturing.  This is being funded by a total of $5 billion in "incentives" from both Ontario and the Feds.  This will in turn create over 1,000 "well-paying manufacturing jobs".

Uh, guys - that's about $5 million per job.  They'd damn well better be well-paying.

#8

Off the Record / Re: TV/Movies Megathread

Last post by FunkMonk - Today at 02:59:43 PM

Also on Apple TV, Lessons in Chemistry and Palm Royale are enjoyable.

#9

Off the Record / Re: The Off Topic Topic

Last post by Barrister - Today at 02:55:17 PM

I just ran across this story - it's awesome.  In 1955 an onion farmer / commodity trader Vincent Kosuga managed to corner the US market on onions.  He bought almost every onion available for sale in the US, started selling them at ridiculous prices and made a small fortune.  He then proceeded to short onions (since his vast collection of onions was beginning to spoil), flooded the market with onions, and made a second fortune on his short positions.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vincent_Kosuga

https://www.npr.org/2015/10/22/450769853/the-great-onion-corner-and-the-futures-market

Congress responded by banning the sale of onion futures - a ban which remains to this day.

#10

Off the Record / Re: The China Thread

Last post by Josquius - Today at 02:39:51 PM

Apparently?

Just going off what you're saying here but it sounds like "officially we totally snub you but in reality we recognise we have some very serious shit to talk about" "