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General Category => Off the Record => Computer Affairs => Topic started by: Tamas on October 26, 2015, 10:30:26 AM

Title: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on October 26, 2015, 10:30:26 AM
I have a laptop that is still ok for games but it is showing its age particularly in loading times and crumbling under CPU heavy stuff like Paradox games.

I have usually been going for "upper middle class" setups in terms of not buying the top of the line stuff, but one or two levels below them, and that has worked out very well.

Soo... CPU. I want quad-core, I think.

Do I HAVE to have an i7? Or i5 would still be good? No, I don't want AMD
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 26, 2015, 10:38:07 AM
Quote from: Tamas on October 26, 2015, 10:30:26 AM
I have a laptop that is still ok for games but it is showing its age particularly in loading times and crumbling under CPU heavy stuff like Paradox games.

I have usually been going for "upper middle class" setups in terms of not buying the top of the line stuff, but one or two levels below them, and that has worked out very well.

Soo... CPU. I want quad-core, I think.

Do I HAVE to have an i7? Or i5 would still be good? No, I don't want AMD

Well for starters take a look at my own "build a new PC" thread where I go through a lot of the same debates.

First - are you looking for a desktop or laptop?

No, there isn't much difference between an i& and an i5.  i7 allows hyperthreading - so your 4 physical cores can be treated by the computer to run 8 separate threads.  But most games hardly use more than a couple of threads anyways, so for that purpose an i5 is probably fine.

I'm sure you know this though, but it's a very misleading naming system since an i7 from now is different from an i7 from 4-5 years ago.  You have to start becoming familiar with generation names like Skylake, Sandy Bridge, and what not.

And of course for what you describe (load times) a SSD HD will make a world of difference.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: crazy canuck on October 26, 2015, 10:44:09 AM
I agree.  If you want an upper middle class step up BB's setup would be perfect for you.  It also gives you the benefit of the new motherboard chipset (which is about the same price as other older motherboards) for future hardware additions.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on October 27, 2015, 04:09:30 AM
:thumbsup:
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on October 27, 2015, 08:50:04 AM
I'm currently looking at this one: http://www.amazon.de/dp/B0156QUMG4/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=3HZW7J89FHH20&coliid=I1YF7LQLXVYKR5&psc=1

[CPU] - Intel i7-6700K Quadcore 4x 4.0 GHz, Skylake
[Cooler] - Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO, Supersilent
[Memory] - 16 GB DDR4-2666 MHz HyperX Kingston
[GPU] - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980, 4096MB GDDR5
[Mainboard] - ASUS Z170-P
[HD 1] - 250GB Samsung 850 EVO SSD
[HD 2] - 2000 GB SATA3 (6gb/s), 7200rpm, 64MB Cache
[DVD-RW] - 22x DVD-Burner (duallayer) (DVD±R, DVD±RW, DVD+R9, CD-R, CD-RW)

[Case] - Zalman Z11 Plus - Modding Case, Midi ATX, 3x 12cm Coolers (Top, Back, Front); 2x 8cm coolers for HD; 49.8 x 26 x 52.5cm
[Power] - 600 Watt EVGA

Microsoft Windows 10 Home 64-Bit
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Martim Silva on October 27, 2015, 09:09:11 AM
Quote from: Syt on October 27, 2015, 08:50:04 AM
I'm currently looking at this one: http://www.amazon.de/dp/B0156QUMG4/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=3HZW7J89FHH20&coliid=I1YF7LQLXVYKR5&psc=1

[CPU] - Intel i7-6700K Quadcore 4x 4.0 GHz, Skylake
[Cooler] - Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO, Supersilent
[Memory] - 16 GB DDR4-2666 MHz HyperX Kingston
[GPU] - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980, 4096MB GDDR5
[Mainboard] - ASUS Z170-P
[HD 1] - 250GB Samsung 850 EVO SSD
[HD 2] - 2000 GB SATA3 (6gb/s), 7200rpm, 64MB Cache
[DVD-RW] - 22x DVD-Burner (duallayer) (DVD±R, DVD±RW, DVD+R9, CD-R, CD-RW)

[Case] - Zalman Z11 Plus - Modding Case, Midi ATX, 3x 12cm Coolers (Top, Back, Front); 2x 8cm coolers for HD; 49.8 x 26 x 52.5cm
[Power] - 600 Watt EVGA

Microsoft Windows 10 Home 64-Bit

That's rather similar to the PC I just bought on Monday  :D

That said, the PSU is a bit weak there. The newer cpus and gpus take less power (600w should be fine and 750w would cover anything you may take), but the EVGAs could be better. At least it's 80+ certified.

That said, Corsairs and Seasonics still rule, and I would prefer those.

Still, take it. The build is very good, even though you'll end up adding more RAM.

Tamas, the new Skylake CPUs are a good option since the previous generation of Intels (Browadwells) got bogged down in development and came out just 2 months before these.

If you want a laptop things may get iffy for the time being.

Personally, what I do is have a laptop for work and a desktop at home for all other needs, including gaming.

Would you like to keep your current laptop for work and go for a desktop for your games?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 09:38:36 AM
Quote from: Syt on October 27, 2015, 08:50:04 AM
I'm currently looking at this one: http://www.amazon.de/dp/B0156QUMG4/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=3HZW7J89FHH20&coliid=I1YF7LQLXVYKR5&psc=1

[CPU] - Intel i7-6700K Quadcore 4x 4.0 GHz, Skylake
[Cooler] - Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO, Supersilent
[Memory] - 16 GB DDR4-2666 MHz HyperX Kingston
[GPU] - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980, 4096MB GDDR5
[Mainboard] - ASUS Z170-P
[HD 1] - 250GB Samsung 850 EVO SSD
[HD 2] - 2000 GB SATA3 (6gb/s), 7200rpm, 64MB Cache
[DVD-RW] - 22x DVD-Burner (duallayer) (DVD±R, DVD±RW, DVD+R9, CD-R, CD-RW)

[Case] - Zalman Z11 Plus - Modding Case, Midi ATX, 3x 12cm Coolers (Top, Back, Front); 2x 8cm coolers for HD; 49.8 x 26 x 52.5cm
[Power] - 600 Watt EVGA

Microsoft Windows 10 Home 64-Bit

Nice rig, but there's nothing "middle class" about it. :P
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: crazy canuck on October 27, 2015, 09:41:53 AM
Quote from: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 09:38:36 AM
Quote from: Syt on October 27, 2015, 08:50:04 AM
I'm currently looking at this one: http://www.amazon.de/dp/B0156QUMG4/ref=wl_it_dp_o_pC_nS_ttl?_encoding=UTF8&colid=3HZW7J89FHH20&coliid=I1YF7LQLXVYKR5&psc=1

[CPU] - Intel i7-6700K Quadcore 4x 4.0 GHz, Skylake
[Cooler] - Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO, Supersilent
[Memory] - 16 GB DDR4-2666 MHz HyperX Kingston
[GPU] - NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980, 4096MB GDDR5
[Mainboard] - ASUS Z170-P
[HD 1] - 250GB Samsung 850 EVO SSD
[HD 2] - 2000 GB SATA3 (6gb/s), 7200rpm, 64MB Cache
[DVD-RW] - 22x DVD-Burner (duallayer) (DVD±R, DVD±RW, DVD+R9, CD-R, CD-RW)

[Case] - Zalman Z11 Plus - Modding Case, Midi ATX, 3x 12cm Coolers (Top, Back, Front); 2x 8cm coolers for HD; 49.8 x 26 x 52.5cm
[Power] - 600 Watt EVGA

Microsoft Windows 10 Home 64-Bit

Nice rig, but there's nothing "middle class" about it. :P

He went with the home version of windows instead of the pro  :D
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Martim Silva on October 27, 2015, 11:08:32 AM
Quote from: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 09:38:36 AM
Nice rig, but there's nothing "middle class" about it. :P

Oh, come on.

It only has 16 gb of RAM. And a 980 gpu, not a 980 ti. The SSD is only 250 GB, and it stays with a 2 TB hdd, while keeping a 600w PSU.

Nothing extravagant for a modern rig.

Besides, that motherboard should be able to take upgrades for years to come, so it´s good value for money.

Clearly Middle-Class for a 1st World Standard.

If you want less, I'd call it a budget option. At which point I'd recommend waiting for Christmas promotions, then getting an older i5 Haswell (the 4XXX series) cpu, with 8-16 gb ddr3 ram, a 128 GB SSD and 1 tb hdd, plus something between a gtx 960 and a 980 nvidia gpu, with a 500-600w Cooler Master PSU.

With that you can run modern games, but in 3 years you'd need an upgrade.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 11:41:13 AM
Quote from: Martim Silva on October 27, 2015, 11:08:32 AM
Quote from: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 09:38:36 AM
Nice rig, but there's nothing "middle class" about it. :P

Oh, come on.

It only has 16 gb of RAM. And a 980 gpu, not a 980 ti. The SSD is only 250 GB, and it stays with a 2 TB hdd, while keeping a 600w PSU.

Nothing extravagant for a modern rig.

Besides, that motherboard should be able to take upgrades for years to come, so it´s good value for money.

Clearly Middle-Class for a 1st World Standard.

If you want less, I'd call it a budget option. At which point I'd recommend waiting for Christmas promotions, then getting an older i5 Haswell (the 4XXX series) cpu, with 8-16 gb ddr3 ram, a 128 GB SSD and 1 tb hdd, plus something between a gtx 960 and a 980 nvidia gpu, with a 500-600w Cooler Master PSU.

With that you can run modern games, but in 3 years you'd need an upgrade.

Gamers. :rolleyes:

A 980 NVidia GPU is going to run you about $500 US.  You can buy an entire system for $500.  It is not a budget card by any stretch.

Here's my rig, copied over from my thread:

QuoteCPU: Intel 6600K
Motherboard: Gigabyte GAZ170XP-SU (chosen because it was a bundle on Newegg with the CPU)
Cooler: Scythe Kotetsu (chosen because it's a bit hit on silentpcreview.com, and the 6600K doesn't have a stock cooler)
RAM: G.Skill 8GB 2400 (DDR4)
HD: Samsung 250GB (I dunno - Samsung was a familiar name)
HD: Seagate 2TB (was cheap, and I went with Viper's advice to get 2TB)
GPU: EVGA GTX 960 (cheapest 960 I saw, seemed decent)
Case: Fractal Design R5 Titanium (very good reviews, willing to spend a bit on the case)
PS: Fractal 550W (I had no idea - same manufacturer as the case)
DVD: Samsung (was only $20, otherwise might have skipped)
Keyboard: Logitech (realized if I sell the Mac Pro, I have to get rid of the Mac keyboard - so this was cheap)

I haven't really stressed it too much beyond running Elite: dangerous, but it runs it on 1080p on max settings flawlessly.  You really don't need to move beyond a 950 or 960 unless you're running multi-monitors or resolutions above 1080.

My system isn't too far off your so-called "budget" PC, and it still cost me $1600 CDN.

A true budget PC is something like this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883230032

A Haswell i5, no SSD, still has a discrete graphics card.  You could still play any modern game, just not on max settings.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: crazy canuck on October 27, 2015, 11:45:06 AM
I thought I was splurging getting the 970  :D
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Grey Fox on October 27, 2015, 11:53:40 AM
I have a 400$ laptop. Martim is insane.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Martim Silva on October 27, 2015, 12:43:28 PM
$1600 CDN is much? Tell me BB, how much is that in your hourly fees? 3 hours? 4?

Not much for the typical 1st World middle-aged income level, really.

Question for Tamas (and I guess Syt) is: you just want to play OK the games that exist now, or you want to have a PC that will last you 5-6 years?

Because if you start with a PC whose specs are already in the "recommended" list of the current games, then you can be sure it won't last beyond 3 years before an upgrade (if that). You have to aim for better than that.

And if you like strategy games, which are CPU intensive, always go for the best CPU avaliable, since that speeds up the AI turns (remember those 1700 'Pride of Nations' AI turns that took 5 minutes and made the game unplayable?)

As for Grey Fox... nice to recommend a $400 PC. I am sure it's lovely to spend that and find out that you can't play half the current games, let alone those that will be released it the future.

Or you just play browser games/Hearthstone/old 2007 games that are on sale on Steam.

IMO any rig under $800 is junk and made for people that will use it for work/old games - which is the case of the 'gamer Xtreme' PC that BB linked to. With 4gb RAM you're already out of the recomended specs for lots of current games, and the Radeon gpu forces you to go to 'Low' settings for most modern games - can't even run some of the most demanding, in fact. Not good if you're now getting a new PC.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Grey Fox on October 27, 2015, 12:49:50 PM
Your price ladder is not leaving any place for highend stuff.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 01:06:50 PM
Martim, you seem to want to build a system that will still be ideal in five years.  That's a ridiculous level of future-proofing, and probably impossible in any event.

Rather than spend $800 or more on a top of the line graphics card now, I spent $300, and then in 3-5 years I expect I'll replace it with a new one for around the same price.

New CPUs show as being only 5-10% faster than a previous years.  There's really no point in upgrading a CPU unless it is many years old.


As for my hourly fees... I'm a public servant.  I don't charge hourly rates.  And even when I did, my hourly rate was not the same as my take-home pay.  I got maybe a third of it.  Plus if I was a single guy I might not bat at eye on spending $2000 or more on a computer, but with three kids and bills it was tough to justify wat I did spend.


None of which is meant to tell Syt that the rig he was looking at isn't very nice and I'd be a bit jealous.   :blush:  Plus I now see I was confused about the "middle class" comment, which was said by CC, not Syt.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: crazy canuck on October 27, 2015, 01:33:26 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 01:06:50 PM
None of which is meant to tell Syt that the rig he was looking at isn't very nice and I'd be a bit jealous.   :blush:  Plus I now see I was confused about the "middle class" comment, which was said by CC, not Syt.


Actually to bring this back to what Tamas was asking about.  It is what Tamas was thinking.

QuoteI have usually been going for "upper middle class" setups in terms of not buying the top of the line stuff, but one or two levels below them, and that has worked out very well.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on October 27, 2015, 01:55:01 PM
TBH, my considering to buy a new PC is a bit decadent, actually, since I bought my last PC 3 years ago, and it runs fine (it was a rig from a German company that specializes in gaming PCs). It's without a doubt the most solid machine I've ever had - I didn't need to do a fresh install in all the time and it's still running great. Only thing I had to switch out is the gfx card which died a few months after warranty expired (I now have a 770GTX). The 128GB SSD for the OS seems small - I have few actual programs on there, but it only has about 10 GB free atm. Getting a bigger SSD and a new gfx card might be good enough.

OTOH, I do have some cash stowed away, and I have no other expensive hobbies and no one to take care off but me.

Still, I think I will hold off another year.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 01:59:51 PM
Quote from: Syt on October 27, 2015, 01:55:01 PM
TBH, my considering to buy a new PC is a bit decadent, actually, since I bought my last PC 3 years ago, and it runs fine (it was a rig from a German company that specializes in gaming PCs). It's without a doubt the most solid machine I've ever had - I didn't need to do a fresh install in all the time and it's still running great. Only thing I had to switch out is the gfx card which died a few months after warranty expired (I now have a 770GTX). The 128GB SSD for the OS seems small - I have few actual programs on there, but it only has about 10 GB free atm. Getting a bigger SSD and a new gfx card might be good enough

OTOH, I do have some cash stowed away, and I have no other expensive hobbies and no one to take care off but me.

Still, I think I will hold off another year.

Ding ding ding! We have a winner!

Spend your money on a horking big SSD and on a 980 GTX and you're probably golden.  And you've just spent $1000.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on October 27, 2015, 02:09:45 PM
I need to do the maths on my power supply, though. I have 600W now, and need to see if I could put a card that needs more power in there. And I have to be careful with the size - 26cm in length is the max the way the layout in my tower works (lots of fans in there).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 02:24:35 PM
Quote from: Syt on October 27, 2015, 02:09:45 PM
I need to do the maths on my power supply, though. I have 600W now, and need to see if I could put a card that needs more power in there. And I have to be careful with the size - 26cm in length is the max the way the layout in my tower works (lots of fans in there).

Well absolutely do the math, but with the way that mobile has been driving computing the last few years, your modern GPU is probably drawing less power than your 770 GTX.

Let's see...

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-770/specifications

Your 770 GTX requires 230 W and recommends a 600W PSU.

http://www.geforce.com/hardware/desktop-gpus/geforce-gtx-980/specifications

Whereas the 980 requires 165 W and recommends a 500W PSU.

Oh, the length is 10.5" - 26.67cm.  :hmm:
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on October 28, 2015, 03:21:48 AM
Thanks, Beeb. I've identified a candidate card @ ca. 500 bucks.

Though I'm not sure I will actually do the upgrade. I think at this point the idea of buying a new PC is more expression of what I jokingly call my midlife crisis. I have no idea where to go with my life at the moment and am unhappy with all options I see and getting a new PC (much like getting a new car) seemed like a quick fix. :P

Fact is that I have more than enough games at the moment (including many 50+ hour RPGs and strategy games) that I've barely played and that run fine on my PC, and my games backlog alone would keep me busy for the next few years. I don't need games like Fallout 4 or Stellaris or whatever the Next big Thing is (that Numenara game is also heading my way), though I'll surely pick them up at some point (probably not on release).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Martim Silva on October 28, 2015, 09:25:09 AM
Quote from: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 01:06:50 PM
Martim, you seem to want to build a system that will still be ideal in five years.  That's a ridiculous level of future-proofing, and probably impossible in any event.

Well, not really. Things changed in the early part of this century, and the last PCs I had did just that.

My Pentium 4 that I got in 2005 lost its PSU in 2010, and the i7 Lynnfield (i7 860, the first generation of i7s) that I got to replace it then was still going strong after 5 1/2 years until I decided to get a Skylake (6th generation of i7s) this week, mostly because my new 27 inch monitor is not compatible with the gpu.

So, with the right amount of extra oomph, you can get a PC that will serve you very well for 5-6 years, no hassles with upgrades needed.

And when you do change, you change to a massively better machine, which feels SO much better.

Quote from: Syt
TBH, my considering to buy a new PC is a bit decadent, actually, since I bought my last PC 3 years ago, and it runs fine

3 years should be too short a time to replace a PC. I don't get why people get annoyed when they see that the new generation of CPUs is not much stronger than the previous one. It's like they want to go back to the 1990s, where I had to fork $1000+ on a new PC every two years.

Seriously, anyone with a Sandy Bridge CPU (the 2xxx series of CPUs) or better has no reason to switch now, unless the workload is wrecking their pc/their current machine is hopelessly damaged for some reason.

In general, look to change CPUs every 5 generations or so. Less than that is just a waste, unless there was some huge technological advance (like was the case when the i3, i5 and i7 came out for the first time).

And don't worry, you're as decadent as you can get, so you're not aggravating your case by splurging.  ;)

Quote from: Syt
Fact is that I have more than enough games at the moment (including many 50+ hour RPGs and strategy games) that I've barely played and that run fine on my PC, and my games backlog alone would keep me busy for the next few years. I don't need games like Fallout 4 or Stellaris or whatever the Next big Thing is (that Numenara game is also heading my way), though I'll surely pick them up at some point (probably not on release).

Lack of time is also an issue for me, but I noticed that this helps to prolong a PCs life... we can wait for the GOTY editions with all the DLCs for a handful of euros, instead of spending a fortune in brand new games and then even more with the add-ons. And that we can play those 'new' games with older systems, since they were released some 1-2 years earlier...

The games we see set for release are usually the ones we will playing in some 18 months or so (and for a pittance), so we can get a an awful LOT of mileage from our machines, as long as we get the best when we do have to switch computers for some reason.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Martim Silva on October 28, 2015, 09:27:51 AM
That said, Tamas hasn't said anything.

Tamas, what are the specs on your laptop? Maybe you're still good. Or say if you just want a brand new laptop, or try a desktop for gaming.

Also, tell what is your budget and what you want it to play, that will make it easier to get a system that is cheap and good for you.  :)
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Caliga on October 28, 2015, 09:50:47 AM
Tamas, shouldn't you be able to expense a gaming PC? :hmm:
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: DontSayBanana on October 28, 2015, 09:57:01 AM
Quote from: Caliga on October 28, 2015, 09:50:47 AM
Tamas, shouldn't you be able to expense a gaming PC? :hmm:

Not if his bosses are rubbing two brain cells together- they'd have the testing computers under lock and key at the office and strict rules about unauthorized software usage.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on October 28, 2015, 05:10:46 PM
Quote from: Caliga on October 28, 2015, 09:50:47 AM
Tamas, shouldn't you be able to expense a gaming PC? :hmm:

:lol: I an employee, not self-employed or anything. No expenses. And of course company PCs are company PCs.

My laptop's CPU is an i7-4700MQ 2.5Ghz. I have 8 gigs of ram and a Geforce 750M

And I definitely want a desktop
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: The Brain on October 30, 2015, 07:11:50 AM
What's the best cooling option for an upper-upper middle class gaming PC? Is liquid cooling any good? What do the cool kids use these days?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on October 30, 2015, 07:37:10 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 30, 2015, 07:11:50 AM
What's the best cooling option for an upper-upper middle class gaming PC? Is liquid cooling any good? What do the cool kids use these days?

The weary sighs of the disenfranchised.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Monoriu on October 30, 2015, 08:27:59 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 30, 2015, 07:11:50 AM
What's the best cooling option for an upper-upper middle class gaming PC? Is liquid cooling any good? What do the cool kids use these days?

I use Corsair H100i GTX.  It is very quiet.  Not sure if it is working class or middle class though. 
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 30, 2015, 09:30:24 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 30, 2015, 07:11:50 AM
What's the best cooling option for an upper-upper middle class gaming PC? Is liquid cooling any good? What do the cool kids use these days?

You do not need to go with liquid cooling (unless you want to for coolness or esthetics or whatever - I'm not here to judge).

As I mentioned in talking with Syt, mobile has been driving computers for the last several years.  That means energy efficiency has been a big focus for Intel and the like, which means cooler components.

Unless you want to overclock your system to within an inch of it's life, you can get by just fine with air cooling.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on October 30, 2015, 01:52:02 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 30, 2015, 09:30:24 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 30, 2015, 07:11:50 AM
What's the best cooling option for an upper-upper middle class gaming PC? Is liquid cooling any good? What do the cool kids use these days?

You do not need to go with liquid cooling (unless you want to for coolness or esthetics or whatever - I'm not here to judge).

As I mentioned in talking with Syt, mobile has been driving computers for the last several years.  That means energy efficiency has been a big focus for Intel and the like, which means cooler components.

Unless you want to overclock your system to within an inch of it's life, you can get by just fine with air cooling.
the newest AMD cards use liquid cooling by default.  I'm guessing we'll see more&more of this in newer computers in the future, even if they are energy efficient.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: The Brain on October 30, 2015, 01:55:40 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 30, 2015, 09:30:24 AM
Quote from: The Brain on October 30, 2015, 07:11:50 AM
What's the best cooling option for an upper-upper middle class gaming PC? Is liquid cooling any good? What do the cool kids use these days?

You do not need to go with liquid cooling (unless you want to for coolness or esthetics or whatever - I'm not here to judge).

As I mentioned in talking with Syt, mobile has been driving computers for the last several years.  That means energy efficiency has been a big focus for Intel and the like, which means cooler components.

Unless you want to overclock your system to within an inch of it's life, you can get by just fine with air cooling.

My experience with air cooling is that it's pretty bad. I'm sure it CAN be good, but I'd rather have something that I know will be good.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: crazy canuck on November 02, 2015, 12:00:16 PM
The advice I got from the guy at NCIX is that unless I wanted to be aggressive at overclocking going with air cooling was the better choice.  He reasoning was that air cooled systems are less of a hassle - no chance of leaking etc.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 08, 2016, 11:44:01 AM
So, considering the games I play, I think the most crucial aspect is CPU power on a single core. I am planning on near-maxing out on that one while keeping everything else acceptalbe. Especially the graphics card.

What would you recommend? Dual core should be enough I assume but within those?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 08, 2016, 12:53:53 PM
Quote from: Tamas on April 08, 2016, 11:44:01 AM
So, considering the games I play, I think the most crucial aspect is CPU power on a single core. I am planning on near-maxing out on that one while keeping everything else acceptalbe. Especially the graphics card.

What would you recommend? Dual core should be enough I assume but within those?
DX 9 games = CPU power on a single core.
DX 11,12 and Vulkan games = CPU power on multiple cores + GPU(s) for the two last APIs.

Right now, Intel is the king, because they have less cores but they are faster than AMDs.
With DX 12, things could change for the better, since AMD have higher core count, but generally slower.

If you are on a budget, an i5 4670k would be sufficient.  If you have the means, push for one of the new i7 6700k.
If you can wait, wait one more year until AMD releases all of its new CPUs, the Zen line.  It could drive prices down.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 11, 2016, 07:24:12 AM
Thanks! My current laptop has a  i7-4700, looking at a comparison of statistics it looks like it is well worth buying the i7-6700 even if I have to wait for finances to accumulate.

I take that, SSD drives at least for the OS are pretty much a given choice in this day and age?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 11, 2016, 08:46:16 AM
Quote from: Tamas on April 11, 2016, 07:24:12 AM
I take that, SSD drives at least for the OS are pretty much a given choice in this day and age?
yes, 512gb is nice, 256 the minimum.  With 512, you have room for the OS, and you can shift games around as you play them.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 11, 2016, 09:26:56 AM
Damn this is going to be more expensive than I thought it would. But you are right.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on April 11, 2016, 12:18:22 PM
Quote from: Tamas on April 11, 2016, 07:24:12 AM
Thanks! My current laptop has a  i7-4700, looking at a comparison of statistics it looks like it is well worth buying the i7-6700 even if I have to wait for finances to accumulate.

I take that, SSD drives at least for the OS are pretty much a given choice in this day and age?

I don't think it is worthwhile to upgrade from Haswell to Skylake at all.  You'd only notice a 5-10% improvement from my reading.

Now if you're buying a new laptop for other reasons you should get the newest processor.

Yes, you'll definitely want a SSD for a laptop.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 11, 2016, 01:41:28 PM
I have a laptop now but I want to replace it with a desktop.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 12, 2016, 04:50:37 AM
I am also looking at an i5-4690K CPU.

I must say, for somebody like me who stayed away from hardware buying for several years, it is next to impossible to make sense of these CPU designations.

Especially as I am mostly interested in single core performance.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 12, 2016, 08:06:31 AM
Quote from: Tamas on April 12, 2016, 04:50:37 AM
I am also looking at an i5-4690K CPU.

I must say, for somebody like me who stayed away from hardware buying for several years, it is next to impossible to make sense of these CPU designations.

Especially as I am mostly interested in single core performance.
that's a good CPU choice.  I have the same, planning on upgrading toward the summer for an i7 as it's beginning to be on the lower end of gaming requirements.
It's still a very fast CPU, excellent for any DX 9,10,11 game.  A bit weak for the future though, but it really depends on what you'll play.  If you play games that require only a single core, it's perfect.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 12, 2016, 09:04:21 AM
Well I guess then a i7-6700K is still the better choice, considering I am building this system from absolute scratch. I wouldn't mind some future-proofing.

Thanks again!
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 12, 2016, 05:00:57 PM
I don't know the price differences, but an i5 6500t could be a good entry point.  You could later upgrade to an i7 of the same series.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Norgy on April 13, 2016, 12:59:35 AM
Quote from: Tamas on April 12, 2016, 04:50:37 AM
I am also looking at an i5-4690K CPU.

I must say, for somebody like me who stayed away from hardware buying for several years, it is next to impossible to make sense of these CPU designations.

Especially as I am mostly interested in single core performance.

It's a more than adequate processor for games.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 13, 2016, 05:35:39 AM
Quote from: viper37 on April 12, 2016, 05:00:57 PM
I don't know the price differences, but an i5 6500t could be a good entry point.  You could later upgrade to an i7 of the same series.

Do you think it would be a noticable improvement over an i7 4700MQ? I guess having an SSD drive for the OS and a better video card thrown in the mix would surely dip the scale toward the i5 6500, but I am wondering if I would take any step forward strictly on the CPU part.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 13, 2016, 05:36:44 AM
actually, I could just go with the i5 6600, doesn't seem that much more expensive.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 13, 2016, 08:19:56 AM
This is the config I am thinking now, if I'd be brave enough to assemble myself I could get for 580ish:

Intel Core i5-6600 3.3GHz Quad-Core Processor
CRYORIG H7 49.0 CFM CPU Cooler
Asus H110M-A Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard
Kingston HyperX Fury Black 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-2133 Memory
Kingston SSDNow V300 Series 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive
Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive
MSI GeForce GTX 950 2GB Video Card
BitFenix Nova ATX Mid Tower Case
Corsair Builder 500W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply
Samsung SH-224DB/BEBE DVD/CD Writer

But I will need a decent monitor as well so unless I convince myself to put myself into some 10 month paying scheme over this, it won't happen for a few months at least.


Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 13, 2016, 08:43:37 AM
Quote from: Tamas on April 13, 2016, 05:35:39 AM
Quote from: viper37 on April 12, 2016, 05:00:57 PM
I don't know the price differences, but an i5 6500t could be a good entry point.  You could later upgrade to an i7 of the same series.

Do you think it would be a noticable improvement over an i7 4700MQ? I guess having an SSD drive for the OS and a better video card thrown in the mix would surely dip the scale toward the i5 6500, but I am wondering if I would take any step forward strictly on the CPU part.
If you play DirectX 9/10/11 games, you will not see the difference.  If you play brand new games, those developped with the new Vulkan API or DirectX 12 (yet to be released), than the i7 would likely be better since it has more cores.

The way most games works, to (over) simplify it is they do all the instructions they can on one core, than they go to the next and so on while the first finish the tasks it has.

With DX 12&Vulkan, the load is balanced through all cores, and the GPU(s) if needed.  That means even if you single-core speed is lower, if you have more cores, the load balancing will improve performances for the CPU.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 13, 2016, 10:09:13 AM
Quote from: Tamas on April 13, 2016, 08:19:56 AM
This is the config I am thinking now, if I'd be brave enough to assemble myself I could get for 580ish:

Intel Core i5-6600 3.3GHz Quad-Core Processor
CRYORIG H7 49.0 CFM CPU Cooler
Asus H110M-A Micro ATX LGA1151 Motherboard
Kingston HyperX Fury Black 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR4-2133 Memory
Kingston SSDNow V300 Series 120GB 2.5" Solid State Drive
Western Digital Caviar Blue 1TB 3.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive
MSI GeForce GTX 950 2GB Video Card
BitFenix Nova ATX Mid Tower Case
Corsair Builder 500W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply
Samsung SH-224DB/BEBE DVD/CD Writer

But I will need a decent monitor as well so unless I convince myself to put myself into some 10 month paying scheme over this, it won't happen for a few months at least.

Your SSD is too small.  You'll only be able to put Windows on it, never any game (you can use Steam Mover to shuffle games around), and with Windows 8/10 way of installing apps on the main drive, without any easy control over it, it will be filled to the brim very quickly.

Also, the hard drive you picked is really, really, really slow.  A combination of small SSD + slow hard drive will drive down your performances.

Either you keep the small SSD and upgrade to a Caviar Black, or you keep the Caviar blue and pick a large SSD.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 13, 2016, 10:21:29 AM
:thumbsup:
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Grey Fox on April 13, 2016, 10:24:07 AM
Viper is overstating the speed your SDD will fill up but it is damn annoying to keep on managing it. Listen to him, spend the money for a bigger one.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Norgy on April 15, 2016, 06:39:17 AM
Quote from: Grey Fox on April 13, 2016, 10:24:07 AM
Viper is overstating the speed your SDD will fill up but it is damn annoying to keep on managing it. Listen to him, spend the money for a bigger one.

Yes, I can only add my voice to this.
240 GB at the least for the system drive. Else system popups will drive you into deep depression and rage.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Grey Fox on April 15, 2016, 09:50:04 AM
We should all be buying this right now :

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ADATA-Premier-SP550-2-5-960GB-SATA-III-TLC-Internal-Solid-State-Drive-SSD-ASP/291677924054

for 190$us.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 15, 2016, 01:29:29 PM
300$ Can.  For 960gb.  Pretty impressive. Decently fast.  A little slow for heavy gaming, but perfect for office work.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on April 15, 2016, 01:31:23 PM
Quote from: Grey Fox on April 15, 2016, 09:50:04 AM
We should all be buying this right now :

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ADATA-Premier-SP550-2-5-960GB-SATA-III-TLC-Internal-Solid-State-Drive-SSD-ASP/291677924054

for 190$us.

Quote
Shipping: Does not ship to Canada
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Grey Fox on April 15, 2016, 01:31:54 PM
Well, shit.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Alcibiades on April 15, 2016, 11:18:54 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 01:06:50 PM
Martim, you seem to want to build a system that will still be ideal in five years.  That's a ridiculous level of future-proofing, and probably impossible in any event.

Rather than spend $800 or more on a top of the line graphics card now, I spent $300, and then in 3-5 years I expect I'll replace it with a new one for around the same price.

New CPUs show as being only 5-10% faster than a previous years.  There's really no point in upgrading a CPU unless it is many years old.

I mean I spent about $2200 on my computer 6 years ago and am just now looking at replacing it save for my extra drive failing this past fall.... and that's only because I'm now starting to have overheating issues with my CPU during CPU intensive games(which can maybe even be solved by applying more thermal paste?).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Alcibiades on April 15, 2016, 11:23:48 PM
Quote from: The Brain on October 30, 2015, 07:11:50 AM
What's the best cooling option for an upper-upper middle class gaming PC? Is liquid cooling any good? What do the cool kids use these days?

For air cooling the best option is Noctua:
http://www.amazon.com/Noctua-D-Type-Premium-Cooling-NH-D15S/dp/B00XUVGLEU?SubscriptionId=AKIAJ7T5BOVUVRD2EFYQ&tag=cameltracker-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B00XUVGLEU

You can usually get this for right around $70 and usually outperforms watercooling and is cheaper, the downside being that it is BIG.

For watercooling this is one of your best choices:

http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Series-Extreme-Performance-CW-9060027-WW/dp/B019955RNQ?psc=1&SubscriptionId=AKIAJ7T5BOVUVRD2EFYQ&tag=cameltracker-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B019955RNQ

Was on sale for 106$ last week but up to 124$ right now.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on April 16, 2016, 12:05:56 AM
Quote from: Alcibiades on April 15, 2016, 11:18:54 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 01:06:50 PM
Martim, you seem to want to build a system that will still be ideal in five years.  That's a ridiculous level of future-proofing, and probably impossible in any event.

Rather than spend $800 or more on a top of the line graphics card now, I spent $300, and then in 3-5 years I expect I'll replace it with a new one for around the same price.

New CPUs show as being only 5-10% faster than a previous years.  There's really no point in upgrading a CPU unless it is many years old.

I mean I spent about $2200 on my computer 6 years ago and am just now looking at replacing it save for my extra drive failing this past fall.... and that's only because I'm now starting to have overheating issues with my CPU during CPU intensive games(which can maybe even be solved by applying more thermal paste?).

I bought my Mac Pro in 2008 for $2000(CDN), and only replaced it in 2015.  You can definitely buy a computer that lasts a long time.  I expect my current rig to last 5-8 years at a minimum, with perhaps only a few small upgrades.

My comment to Martim Silva is you can't future-proof to the extent that you buy a system now that will still be ideal five years from now.  You can definitely buy something that will be good enough in 2021.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Norgy on April 16, 2016, 12:25:12 PM
Quote from: Barrister on April 16, 2016, 12:05:56 AM
You can definitely buy something that will be good enough in 2021.

Wouldn't bet on it, mate.

Not with the whole VR thing coming now.

DX 12 is also just beginning, but those libraries will supposedly tax your graphics card less than the current DX.

Granted, CPU ticks and tocks from Intel have become less and less "major improvements" since Sandy Bridge (which still offers great performance five years down the line), but if it's one thing I am unwilling to have a definite opinion about, it's how computers are in five years' time. We'll probably have another Windows version too by then. Forced upon the user with more "apps" and streamlined UI where you can't do much except adjust volume and screen resolution.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 18, 2016, 01:45:06 PM
Quote from: Barrister on April 15, 2016, 01:31:23 PM
Quote from: Grey Fox on April 15, 2016, 09:50:04 AM
We should all be buying this right now :

http://www.ebay.com/itm/ADATA-Premier-SP550-2-5-960GB-SATA-III-TLC-Internal-Solid-State-Drive-SSD-ASP/291677924054

for 190$us.

Quote
Shipping: Does not ship to Canada
you can find it elsewhere.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 18, 2016, 01:47:23 PM
Quote from: Alcibiades on April 15, 2016, 11:18:54 PM
I mean I spent about $2200 on my computer 6 years ago and am just now looking at replacing it save for my extra drive failing this past fall.... and that's only because I'm now starting to have overheating issues with my CPU during CPU intensive games(which can maybe even be solved by applying more thermal paste?).
Maybe thermal paste is failing after so many years of gaming.  You could also try a better ventilator.  But is it worth it for a 6 yo computer?  If you can do it yourself, ok, but if you need it taken to a computer shop, I would say no.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 18, 2016, 01:51:09 PM
Quote from: Norgy on April 16, 2016, 12:25:12 PM
Quote from: Barrister on April 16, 2016, 12:05:56 AM
You can definitely buy something that will be good enough in 2021.

Wouldn't bet on it, mate.
Not with the whole VR thing coming now.
DX 12 is also just beginning, but those libraries will supposedly tax your graphics card less than the current DX.
DX 12 is new, but we have had DX10 and 11 games for a while.  Yet, many games are still on DX9.  Or barely touching the possibilities of DX11.
5 years from now, will all games developped by in VR only?  Nah. 
So really, it all boils down to the type of games you play.  FPS multiplayer?  Yeah, VR will be a thing.  Galciv IV and Europa Universalis V? nah.  These will stick with DX12/Vulkan for basic 3D.  And I'm betting that even top of the line games that go for VR will have a non VR mode for the time being.


QuoteWe'll probably have another Windows version too by then. Forced upon the user with more "apps" and streamlined UI where you can't do much except adjust volume and screen resolution.

Windows 10 is the last Windows.  What you will see are incremental improvements every year, or twice a year.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: crazy canuck on April 18, 2016, 03:31:19 PM
I think it is going to take a while before VR is something of a must have requirement for a gaming rig.  I will be happy with strategy games for a long while yet.  If VR does become a thing wouldn't it more likely be more of a console game gimmick?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: HVC on April 18, 2016, 03:32:39 PM
Porn. Porn always leads the next entertainment leap.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: crazy canuck on April 19, 2016, 05:06:17 PM
Quote from: HVC on April 18, 2016, 03:32:39 PM
Porn. Porn always leads the next entertainment leap.

Perhaps that would save the NHL  :hmm:
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: HVC on April 19, 2016, 07:35:52 PM
Quote from: crazy canuck on April 19, 2016, 05:06:17 PM
Quote from: HVC on April 18, 2016, 03:32:39 PM
Porn. Porn always leads the next entertainment leap.

Perhaps that would save the NHL  :hmm:
would be signifantly better then watching the leafs, that's for sure.  And fans for once would have a satisfying ending to a game.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tonitrus on April 28, 2016, 11:34:09 PM
Quote from: Barrister on April 16, 2016, 12:05:56 AM
Quote from: Alcibiades on April 15, 2016, 11:18:54 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 27, 2015, 01:06:50 PM
Martim, you seem to want to build a system that will still be ideal in five years.  That's a ridiculous level of future-proofing, and probably impossible in any event.

Rather than spend $800 or more on a top of the line graphics card now, I spent $300, and then in 3-5 years I expect I'll replace it with a new one for around the same price.

New CPUs show as being only 5-10% faster than a previous years.  There's really no point in upgrading a CPU unless it is many years old.

I mean I spent about $2200 on my computer 6 years ago and am just now looking at replacing it save for my extra drive failing this past fall.... and that's only because I'm now starting to have overheating issues with my CPU during CPU intensive games(which can maybe even be solved by applying more thermal paste?).

I bought my Mac Pro in 2008 for $2000(CDN), and only replaced it in 2015.  You can definitely buy a computer that lasts a long time.  I expect my current rig to last 5-8 years at a minimum, with perhaps only a few small upgrades.

My comment to Martim Silva is you can't future-proof to the extent that you buy a system now that will still be ideal five years from now.  You can definitely buy something that will be good enough in 2021.

I've been looking at finally replacing/upgrading my current desktop PC (been going strong for 7-ish years now).

I almost looked at being lazy and getting a new Mac Pro...then realized I could do a build using this insanely expensive case ( http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811133265 ), and still come out cheaper*.

*I not likely to actually buy that case...more likely the $180 dollar downgraded version.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Arvoreen on April 29, 2016, 12:05:33 PM
Yes, Apple makes expensive products.  But sometimes it is the little things that you miss.  For example, my wife has a laptop from work.  She used it to charge her phone while on a trip.  However, unlike Macbooks, the laptop would keep going to sleep and TURN OFF the USB port, even while plugged in.  The Macbook on the other hand, will continue to power the USB ports, if plugged in, even when it does go to sleep.

It is little things like that that will probably get me to buy one the next time I want a new laptop.  Even given the premium in price.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on April 29, 2016, 12:14:09 PM
Quote from: Arvoreen on April 29, 2016, 12:05:33 PM
Yes, Apple makes expensive products.  But sometimes it is the little things that you miss.  For example, my wife has a laptop from work.  She used it to charge her phone while on a trip.  However, unlike Macbooks, the laptop would keep going to sleep and TURN OFF the USB port, even while plugged in.  The Macbook on the other hand, will continue to power the USB ports, if plugged in, even when it does go to sleep.

It is little things like that that will probably get me to buy one the next time I want a new laptop.  Even given the premium in price.

Apple laptops are fantastic, for sure.  They're well worth the money even if you're just going to install Windows on it.

But the Mac Pro is something else entirely.  It starts at $3500.  It has Xeon chips and workstation-class graphics cards.  When I bought my 2008 Mac Pro you could spec it out with more consumer-class components and the price came in at about half that.

The Mac Pro doesn't make any sense as a home/gaming computer at that price.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 29, 2016, 01:45:30 PM
Quote from: Arvoreen on April 29, 2016, 12:05:33 PM
Yes, Apple makes expensive products.  But sometimes it is the little things that you miss.  For example, my wife has a laptop from work.  She used it to charge her phone while on a trip.  However, unlike Macbooks, the laptop would keep going to sleep and TURN OFF the USB port, even while plugged in.  The Macbook on the other hand, will continue to power the USB ports, if plugged in, even when it does go to sleep.

It is little things like that that will probably get me to buy one the next time I want a new laptop.  Even given the premium in price.
You know, for half the price of a Macbook Pro, you get a computer where you can adjust this setting in the BIOS (rather, UEFI now) ;).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Arvoreen on May 02, 2016, 12:33:11 PM
Yea, I know. I was using it more to illustrate a point.  And right now, Macbook Pro's are not a good value since they haven't been refreshed in over a year.  If you really want one, wait till this summer when Apple will most likely roll out new rev's.

Although I think it will be difficult to almost impossible to find a non-Apple laptop with the same resolution screen.  Some quick searching didn't turn up anything for me.... :D
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on May 02, 2016, 12:56:06 PM
Look toward Dell/Alienware for high end laptops.  Acer has some good laptops too, but their web site can be a little cumbersome to look at.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Alcibiades on May 15, 2016, 04:00:35 PM
 :wacko:

Alienware is crazily overpriced parts with a fancy sticker. Avoid at all costs.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tonitrus on May 20, 2016, 11:44:58 PM
Around the new year, I got a new big-screen LCD TV, and decided to move my "gaming area" from a desk and monitor, and consolidate it to the living room.  Naturally, this set-up makes a wireless mouse/keyboard a much more logical choice for input devices.

However, in my naiveté, I'd have thought that for gaming, wireless devices would have improved.  But in fact, they still seem to be pretty much  completely useless for games were lots of mouse-clicking/button pressing is involved with high precision.   :mad:
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Alcibiades on May 21, 2016, 06:33:20 PM
Been using the Logitech MX Master with my surface pro and it does pretty well, never used a wireless keyboard though.   :hmm:
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on May 22, 2016, 12:10:31 PM
Quote from: Tonitrus on May 20, 2016, 11:44:58 PM
Around the new year, I got a new big-screen LCD TV, and decided to move my "gaming area" from a desk and monitor, and consolidate it to the living room.  Naturally, this set-up makes a wireless mouse/keyboard a much more logical choice for input devices.

However, in my naiveté, I'd have thought that for gaming, wireless devices would have improved.  But in fact, they still seem to be pretty much  completely useless for games were lots of mouse-clicking/button pressing is involved with high precision.   :mad:
Keyboard, I don't know. I'm searching for a good replacement to my Microsoft Natural Wireless Ergonomic Keyboard 7000, but i haven't found any.

I had to replace my mouse with a wireless Logitech G602, with progammable buttons and this is a wonderful product.
I wish their keyboards were just as good.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on June 01, 2016, 06:25:02 AM
Any reason I would not want to go with a mini case like this one:

(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.aerocool.us%2Fds%2Fds%2F1.jpg&hash=5fa1fda946290dc49e457b9f6e0ee741886613e0)
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on June 01, 2016, 06:37:42 AM
More importantly: how much of a degraded lifetime am I looking at if I overclock?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on June 01, 2016, 08:12:59 AM
Re: case.
There's a lot of subjectives.  Technically speaking, you should look for good airflow (places to put fans in&out) and space to work in it with your hands if you need to change a video card or ram or something else.

The main reason to avoid a very small case for a gaming computer is the size of your video card, which often exceeds the size of the ATX motherboard.  So double check the interior measurements of your case to make sure that new GTX 1080, or the 3 of them for your triple-sli* system ;) will fit.

Re: overclock.
It depends on how much your overclock and how you do it.  Overclocking in itself does not degrade your material.  What will degrade it is the excess heat it generates.  If you have a stock ventilator on your CPU, I wouldn't even dream of overclocking.  On the other end, if you have a liquid cooling system you could overclock much, much higher without damaging your hardware.

With a good cpu air cooling, you could likely overclock by 10%, maybe more, but that becomes tricky, because everything needs to follow: RAM, GPU, motherboard.  Liquid cooling for everything will help you gain much more.  But you'll also need to adjust ram&CPU voltage.   There are some utilities that deal with it for you, to avoid going too far.



*SLI & Crossfire: personally, I do not recommend getting 2 cheaper video cards for SLI instead of an higher end cards.  Many games have issues and drivers are often buggy when it comes to SLI and Crossfire, in rare cases, it can even lead to degraded performances for a new game, until it is patched properly and there are driver updates.  But it's a personal choice.  Many people swear by it.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on June 01, 2016, 10:43:12 AM
Thanks!
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on June 01, 2016, 02:01:46 PM
Quote from: viper37 on June 01, 2016, 08:12:59 AM
Re: overclock.
It depends on how much your overclock and how you do it.  Overclocking in itself does not degrade your material.  What will degrade it is the excess heat it generates. 
I forgot.  With overclocking, you often need to adjust the voltage of CPU & RAM, and that can lead to problems if you don't know what you're doing.  Many motherboards tend to be "overclocker" friendly, have included utilities in their BIOS (UEFI) and software (in the case of Asus, at least) to help you do it safely; if you put too much voltage, the computer simply won't boot and revert back to safe settings instead of frying your parts.  If you intend to be very serious about overclocking, you should look for such boards, something like the Asus Sabertooth or Maximus lines (I just don't know the model names about the other brands, but Gigabyte has some too).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on June 02, 2016, 05:12:10 AM
Thanks, I have dropped the ideas of overclocking and the mini house.

I have also dropped the brief idea of assembling the thing myself. Never had any inclination for that kind of work so I am just going to pay the extra.

Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on June 03, 2016, 11:00:36 AM
Ok I really SHOULDN'T buy this now as the 750 it costs would be well above 800 due to the need for a monitor, but this is very much the config I am now set on buying, whether tomorrow, in a month, or October:

Thermaltake Suppressor F51 Mid-Tower Silent Case
CPU: INTEL® Core™ i5-6600K Quad Core 3.50 GHz 6MB Cache LGA1151
Cooling Fan: Be Quiet Dark Rock 3 CPU Fan with 6 x Direct Contact heat-pipes
Motherboard: ASUS Z170 Pro Gaming INTEL Z170 Chipset, ATX Mainboard w/ 4 RAM slots, USB 3.1, 3 PCIe x16,
3 PCIe x1, 1 SATA Express, 4 SATA3, 1 Ultra M.2 [+29]
Memory: 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4/2400mhz Dual Channel Memory [+20] (HyperX Fury w/Heat Spreader)
Video Card: MSI GeForce® GTX 950 2GB 16X PCIe 3.0 Video Card [+22] (Single Card)
Power Supply:600 Watts Power Supplies [+25] (Cooler Master 600 Watts B600 B2 Gaming Power Supply,
80+)
M.2 PCIe SSD Drive: 128GB (1x128GB) Samsung SM951 M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD - 2000MB/s Read & 650MB/s Write
[+63] (Single Drive)
Hard Drive: 2TB SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 64M Cache 7200rpm Hard Drive [+15] (Single Hard Drive)
Optical Drive: 24X Double Layer Dual Format DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW DRIVE. (BLACK Colour)
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on June 03, 2016, 11:07:19 AM
Quote from: Tamas on June 03, 2016, 11:00:36 AM
Ok I really SHOULDN'T buy this now as the 750 it costs would be well above 800 due to the need for a monitor, but this is very much the config I am now set on buying, whether tomorrow, in a month, or October:

Thermaltake Suppressor F51 Mid-Tower Silent Case
CPU: INTEL® Core™ i5-6600K Quad Core 3.50 GHz 6MB Cache LGA1151
Cooling Fan: Be Quiet Dark Rock 3 CPU Fan with 6 x Direct Contact heat-pipes
Motherboard: ASUS Z170 Pro Gaming INTEL Z170 Chipset, ATX Mainboard w/ 4 RAM slots, USB 3.1, 3 PCIe x16,
3 PCIe x1, 1 SATA Express, 4 SATA3, 1 Ultra M.2 [+29]
Memory: 16GB (2x8GB) DDR4/2400mhz Dual Channel Memory [+20] (HyperX Fury w/Heat Spreader)
Video Card: MSI GeForce® GTX 950 2GB 16X PCIe 3.0 Video Card [+22] (Single Card)
Power Supply:600 Watts Power Supplies [+25] (Cooler Master 600 Watts B600 B2 Gaming Power Supply,
80+)
M.2 PCIe SSD Drive: 128GB (1x128GB) Samsung SM951 M.2 PCIe NVMe SSD - 2000MB/s Read & 650MB/s Write
[+63] (Single Drive)
Hard Drive: 2TB SATA-III 6.0Gb/s 64M Cache 7200rpm Hard Drive [+15] (Single Hard Drive)
Optical Drive: 24X Double Layer Dual Format DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW DRIVE. (BLACK Colour)

That's very very similar to what I purchased last year.  For a gaming computer you might want to up the video card a bit if you can - although for strategy games I'm sure that'll be perfect (I went with a 960).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on June 03, 2016, 03:13:56 PM
just like BB, I think your video card is on the weak side.  The rest is pretty good though.
Consider an AMD card, they might be cheaper.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Alcibiades on June 30, 2016, 08:13:13 PM
The 970s should be getting pretty cheap soon, and if not the 1070 will be 300$ or less from what I read, and the new AMD RX 480  clocks in at $235, which is phenomenal from what I've read at  that price.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Brezel on September 16, 2016, 04:07:28 AM
Thinking of buying a new gaming pc. My goal is to play today's games with high settings and not having to upgrade parts every year. Not interested in VR. How does this build look?

Asus 27" LED FreeSync MG278Q
Corsair Carbide SPEC-03 Midi Tower
Cooler Master B500 VER.2 KPC
Intel Core i5-6500 Skylake
ASUS B150M Pro Gaming, Socket-1151
Kingston ValueRam DDR4 2133MHz 16GB
XFX Radeon RX 480 8GB RS
Corsair Force Series LE 240GB 2.5'' SSD
Samsung 850 EVO 500GB 2.5" SSD
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on September 16, 2016, 08:54:37 AM
Intel Core i5 will likely be a tad weak if you want to run games in 1440p.
XFX Radeon RX 480 will take anything you throw at it at 1080p, but combined with the i5, it might struggle on some games at 1440p, especially if they ain't DX12.

If you can, squeeze a few more dollars for an i7, if not, plan on upgrading within 2 years (something you don't want to do).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Brezel on September 16, 2016, 10:34:58 AM
Quote from: viper37 on September 16, 2016, 08:54:37 AM
Intel Core i5 will likely be a tad weak if you want to run games in 1440p.
XFX Radeon RX 480 will take anything you throw at it at 1080p, but combined with the i5, it might struggle on some games at 1440p, especially if they ain't DX12.

If you can, squeeze a few more dollars for an i7, if not, plan on upgrading within 2 years (something you don't want to do).

Thanks :) I'll go for an i7 then.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on September 16, 2016, 01:15:22 PM
My reading is that an i7 isn't going to help much for gaming.  The major difference is that i7s allow hyperthreading, but games rarely use multiple threads.

If you have a extra money to spend spend it on a stronger videocard.  And if you don't have a 1440 monitor don't worry about it.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Brezel on September 16, 2016, 03:40:03 PM
Quote from: Barrister on September 16, 2016, 01:15:22 PM
My reading is that an i7 isn't going to help much for gaming.  The major difference is that i7s allow hyperthreading, but games rarely use multiple threads.

If you have a extra money to spend spend it on a stronger videocard.  And if you don't have a 1440 monitor don't worry about it.

The thing is I will be buying a monitor as well. I understand upgrading GPU from rx 480 would mean getting Nvidia - and then it would also make most sense to get a Gsync monitor - but those are pretty expensive.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on September 17, 2016, 01:07:42 PM
Quote from: Barrister on September 16, 2016, 01:15:22 PM
My reading is that an i7 isn't going to help much for gaming.  The major difference is that i7s allow hyperthreading, but games rarely use multiple threads.

If you have a extra money to spend spend it on a stronger videocard.  And if you don't have a 1440 monitor don't worry about it.
Again, it's a matter of new games.  New games, like Deus Ex, uses DirectX 12, or Vulkan. These will take advantage of the higher number of cores.  A 3-4 year old AMD Cpu with 8 cores perform almost as good as an i5 now for these games.

i7 has 4 real cores, with 4 virtual ones.  i5 has 2 real cores, 2 virtual ones.  There lies the reason why you don't see differences for games that uses API like DX 9 to 11 as these APIs do no make any use of anything beyond 2 cores.

He expressely said he wanted to play newer games, and most of them, even Civ VI, comes for DX12 (or a few fo Vulkan).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on September 27, 2016, 08:12:48 AM
I have just realised, in theory I can replace my DVD drive in my Lenovo Y510P with a HDD caddy and put an SSD into it. I am going to try it with a fairly cheap small SSD, and I hope I don't break anything! It's supposed to be modular (some models have a second graphics card in the dvd drive slot, for example).

If I could get games from the previous year or so load quicker than goddamn minutes, I shall be happy enough to hold off on the new desktop for a while.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tonitrus on October 28, 2016, 12:03:10 AM
As the Mac Pro is way overpriced (and becoming more and more out-of-date with no upgrade in sight), I've been looking at alternatives for a desktop(-ish) PC to replace my current, 6-ish year-old rig (that I had built myself at the time).

And also being that I've moved my PC'ing/gaming to the living room/couch, I am also looking at perhaps not building this time, and going with something smallish, but "good enough" (my PC gaming demands aren't super huge/intensive).  Thus why the Mac Pro was in contention in the first place...yeah, overpricey, but being well-enough paid and eternally single, price isn't a huge concern (yeah, humblebrag...go me).

So right now, I am considering this: https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Electronics-DP700C6A-X01US-Premium-Desktop/dp/B01LZSFEJ3   :P

(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww7.pcmag.com%2Fmedia%2Fimages%2F519226-samsung-artpc-pulse.jpg%3Fthumb%3Dy%26amp%3Bwidth%3D740%26amp%3Bheight%3D426&hash=7d6baf99780c4e0de9ded9d409eff02db22f3a98)

My hesitation...Samsung PCs.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on October 28, 2016, 06:47:44 AM
I ordered a new gaming rig today. It's from the same company that built my current rig 4 years ago; the old system ran fine during all these years but it's really starting to show its age.. Should arrive next week.

CPU: Intel Core i7-6800K, 6x 3.40GHz
GPU: MSI GeForce GTX 1080 Gaming X 8G, 8GB GDDR5X
RAM: 32GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 PC-2400 Kit 4x8GB
Case: Corsair Graphite 760T V2 Black
Mainboard:MSI X99A SLI PLUS (Sound G-LAN SATA3 M.2 SATAe USB 3.0)
250 GB SSD, 2 TB HDD (I'll add my current 500 GB SDD to it where most of my games rest now)

Plenty of cooling fans. :P

:blush:
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on October 28, 2016, 08:06:55 AM
Quote from: Tonitrus on October 28, 2016, 12:03:10 AM
As the Mac Pro is way overpriced (and becoming more and more out-of-date with no upgrade in sight), I've been looking at alternatives for a desktop(-ish) PC to replace my current, 6-ish year-old rig (that I had built myself at the time).

And also being that I've moved my PC'ing/gaming to the living room/couch, I am also looking at perhaps not building this time, and going with something smallish, but "good enough" (my PC gaming demands aren't super huge/intensive).  Thus why the Mac Pro was in contention in the first place...yeah, overpricey, but being well-enough paid and eternally single, price isn't a huge concern (yeah, humblebrag...go me).

So right now, I am considering this: https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-Electronics-DP700C6A-X01US-Premium-Desktop/dp/B01LZSFEJ3   :P

(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww7.pcmag.com%2Fmedia%2Fimages%2F519226-samsung-artpc-pulse.jpg%3Fthumb%3Dy%26amp%3Bwidth%3D740%26amp%3Bheight%3D426&hash=7d6baf99780c4e0de9ded9d409eff02db22f3a98)

My hesitation...Samsung PCs.

where do I start?

2000$ for this is overpriced, unless you really, really want the circular designe.

It has only 8gb ram, that's too low for modern games.
It has a Radeon 460 with 2gb VRAM, it won't be able to perform at full graphics with modern games (you need the RX 480 for gaming, not anything lower, and preferably the 8gb version)
It has an i5 only.  It is a decent processor, but if you're buying today, I'd still recommend going for the i7, when you can afford it.
There is no hard drive, only a 256gb SSD.

I just built the same kit for 866$, albeit with a cheap case:
http://pcpartpicker.com/user/Viper371/saved/#view=R6J8dC

Imho, take your time to find yourself a very nice case and then buy the stuff you need and have it assembled at a local store.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on October 28, 2016, 08:53:39 AM
Thinking about buying some more RAM. My MB support DDR3-1600, and I have 6 banks, each supports up to 4GB.

Right now I have 3x2GB. Can I buy 4x3GB and add them to the second bank for a total of 18GB? I know back in the day you really wanted all your memory to be the same kind per stick, but I don't know if that is still true or not...
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on October 28, 2016, 09:22:46 AM
Quote from: Berkut on October 28, 2016, 08:53:39 AM
Thinking about buying some more RAM. My MB support DDR3-1600, and I have 6 banks, each supports up to 4GB.

Right now I have 3x2GB. Can I buy 4x3GB and add them to the second bank for a total of 18GB? I know back in the day you really wanted all your memory to be the same kind per stick, but I don't know if that is still true or not...
Short answer: maybe.

Long answer: it depends.  If you have dual channel ram, then you need to match the sticks with the exact same thing by pairs.  Same for quad channel, by kit of four.  Regular ram will not cause you problem.  But you're talking 3x4gb, right?

I'm guessing, given your setup or 3 sticks, that it isn't dual channel and it should work with anything.

But if you check your motherboard's manual online, you will likely see an update list of ram sticks that work with your board, if you want to be on the safe side.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 28, 2016, 09:40:23 AM
Quote from: viper37 on October 28, 2016, 08:06:55 AM
where do I start?

2000$ for this is overpriced, unless you really, really want the circular designe.

It has only 8gb ram, that's too low for modern games.
It has a Radeon 460 with 2gb VRAM, it won't be able to perform at full graphics with modern games (you need the RX 480 for gaming, not anything lower, and preferably the 8gb version)
It has an i5 only.  It is a decent processor, but if you're buying today, I'd still recommend going for the i7, when you can afford it.
There is no hard drive, only a 256gb SSD.

I just built the same kit for 866$, albeit with a cheap case:
http://pcpartpicker.com/user/Viper371/saved/#view=R6J8dC

Imho, take your time to find yourself a very nice case and then buy the stuff you need and have it assembled at a local store.

Take a look again - the price is $1199, or $1599 for an i7 and extra HDD.

Price doesn't seem out of line, and it's a cool looking case.  Get it if you want.

Sadly I agree with you about the Mac Pro.  It's why I went back to windows from my old Mac Pro. :(
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on October 28, 2016, 09:46:55 AM
Oh, I read 1999$  :blush:

But the video card is too weak for gaming, you need a hard drive and more ram.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tonitrus on October 29, 2016, 02:54:55 AM
Quote from: viper37 on October 28, 2016, 09:46:55 AM
Oh, I read 1999$  :blush:

But the video card is too weak for gaming, you need a hard drive and more ram.

I did say my gaming demands are pretty light.  My 6-year old rig runs Stellaris/Civ 5 pretty decently with lesser specs.  Something marginally better is good enough for me.  I don't need something for first-person shooters with hyperrealistic graphics.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on October 31, 2016, 12:22:26 AM
Quote from: Tonitrus on October 29, 2016, 02:54:55 AM
I did say my gaming demands are pretty light.  My 6-year old rig runs Stellaris/Civ 5 pretty decently with lesser specs.  Something marginally better is good enough for me.  I don't need something for first-person shooters with hyperrealistic graphics.
Stellaris is ok, Civ V, probably too.  But Civ VI might not run at full graphics with this video card.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Hamilcar on October 31, 2016, 02:07:35 PM
Thinking of finally getting a new gaming PC. Browsing the local retailer, I see a system like this:
Intel Core i7-6700 3.40 GHz
256 GB SSD, 3 TB HDD
nVidia GeForce GTX 1080
16 GB memory

Reasonable? Price $2,200

Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on October 31, 2016, 02:41:10 PM
Quote from: Hamilcar on October 31, 2016, 02:07:35 PM
Thinking of finally getting a new gaming PC. Browsing the local retailer, I see a system like this:
Intel Core i7-6700 3.40 GHz
256 GB SSD, 3 TB HDD
nVidia GeForce GTX 1080
16 GB memory

Reasonable? Price $2,200

Very roughly it sounds reasonable.  I'm sure Viper will tell you that you can build your own for cheaper.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Hamilcar on October 31, 2016, 02:42:49 PM
Quote from: Barrister on October 31, 2016, 02:41:10 PM
Quote from: Hamilcar on October 31, 2016, 02:07:35 PM
Thinking of finally getting a new gaming PC. Browsing the local retailer, I see a system like this:
Intel Core i7-6700 3.40 GHz
256 GB SSD, 3 TB HDD
nVidia GeForce GTX 1080
16 GB memory

Reasonable? Price $2,200

Very roughly it sounds reasonable.  I'm sure Viper will tell you that you can build your own for cheaper.

I'm sure I could, but I don't have the time or patience for that at the moment. Plus, that's a Swiss price. Everything is more expensive here.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on October 31, 2016, 03:10:15 PM
My new rig is:

CPU:Intel Core i7-6800K, 6x 3.40GHz (BX80671I76800K)
Mainboard:MSI X99A SLI PLUS (Sound G-LAN SATA3 M.2 SATAe USB 3.0)
MSI GeForce GTX 1080 Gaming X 8G, 8GB GDDR5X (V336-001R)
32GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 PC-2400 Kit 4x8GB Red
SSD:256GB Samsung 850 PRO (MZ-7KE256BW)
HDD: 2TB Seagate HDD Barracuda 7200.14 2TB, SATA 6Gb/s (ST2000DM001)
PUS: 750W Corsair RMx Series RM750x (CP-9020092-EU)
Case: Corsair Graphite 760T V2 Black (CC-9011073-WW)
Cooler: be quiet! Dark Rock PRO 3
Microsoft Windows 10 Home 64Bit Key & DVD

Comes at slightly over €2600. I'm ordering from the same company that built my last computer which has lasted me 4 years (only upgraded gfx card once, and had to replace a fan), so I'm willing to pay a little extra.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on November 01, 2016, 12:02:04 AM
Quote from: Hamilcar on October 31, 2016, 02:07:35 PM
Thinking of finally getting a new gaming PC. Browsing the local retailer, I see a system like this:
Intel Core i7-6700 3.40 GHz
256 GB SSD, 3 TB HDD
nVidia GeForce GTX 1080
16 GB memory

Reasonable? Price $2,200
With the case and monitor, it seems reasonable for a complete system.  Yes, of course, as BB said, you can get a better price by selecting your parts and either have it assembled at a local shop or do it yourself.

256gb SSD is the absolute minimum, you'll have to shuffle games from the HDD to the SSD and vice-versa all the time.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on November 01, 2016, 12:04:35 AM
Quote from: Syt on October 31, 2016, 03:10:15 PM
My new rig is:

CPU:Intel Core i7-6800K, 6x 3.40GHz (BX80671I76800K)
Mainboard:MSI X99A SLI PLUS (Sound G-LAN SATA3 M.2 SATAe USB 3.0)
MSI GeForce GTX 1080 Gaming X 8G, 8GB GDDR5X (V336-001R)
32GB Corsair Vengeance LPX DDR4 PC-2400 Kit 4x8GB Red
SSD:256GB Samsung 850 PRO (MZ-7KE256BW)
HDD: 2TB Seagate HDD Barracuda 7200.14 2TB, SATA 6Gb/s (ST2000DM001)
PUS: 750W Corsair RMx Series RM750x (CP-9020092-EU)
Case: Corsair Graphite 760T V2 Black (CC-9011073-WW)
Cooler: be quiet! Dark Rock PRO 3
Microsoft Windows 10 Home 64Bit Key & DVD

Comes at slightly over €2600. I'm ordering from the same company that built my last computer which has lasted me 4 years (only upgraded gfx card once, and had to replace a fan), so I'm willing to pay a little extra.
Looks good.  But I still don't trust Seagate, even though they've gotten better these last few years.  Burnt too many times.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on November 01, 2016, 04:16:24 AM
I've had several Seagate Barracudas, never had an issue. I'll also transfer some of the HDs of my current machine, definitely the SSDs (a 128 GB SSD, a 512 GB SSD) and maybe the 2TB HDD.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on November 02, 2016, 11:59:25 AM
SSDs are pretty damn cheap these days, no reason at all to pay actual money for something as small as 256GB.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on November 02, 2016, 12:23:24 PM
https://www.amazon.com/Samsung-2-5-Inch-Internal-MZ-75E500B-AM/dp/B00OBRE5UE/ref=sr_1_1?s=pc&ie=UTF8&qid=1478107357&sr=1-1&keywords=SSD

Stupid cheap.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on November 02, 2016, 02:40:33 PM
the market is moving beyond SATA SSDs.  PCI-E hybrids are still overpriced though.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on November 05, 2016, 02:05:48 PM
Quote from: viper37 on November 02, 2016, 02:40:33 PM
the market is moving beyond SATA SSDs.  PCI-E hybrids are still overpriced though.
Oh?

Tell me more...
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on November 07, 2016, 10:48:35 AM
Stuff like that:
Link (https://www.extremetech.com/computing/197051-samsung-announces-new-pcie-3-0-ssd-breaking-2gbps-performance-barrier)
The M.2 interface (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M.2)


Manufacturers have mostly stopped investing in R&D for SATA based SSDs, they're not really releasing new products as tweaking older ones.
PCI-E SSDs and hybrids (say, a 256gb SSD combined with a 1TB hard drive) are becoming increasingly popular, but prices are a still a tad too high for my tastes.

I'm just waiting to see what the market will look like in a couple of years before changing mine.  Right now, despite it's close to 4 years old, replacing my SSD for a newer one would not get me much more speed.  The fastest drive would give me, at most a 10% increase, under very ideal circumstances.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on November 07, 2016, 12:24:55 PM
Hmm. I did a little research, it sounds like for a current build it is probably not quite there yet price wise, at least from a "bang for your buck" standpoint.

Rather than spend an extra couple hundred to go from a SATA SSD to a PCIe SSD, you would be better off spending that money on a faster CPU or GPU...?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on November 08, 2016, 01:59:07 AM
My computer has arrived. Jesus, that case is huge. Whenever I get a new one, I can refurbish it into a decent sized nightstand/book shelf.

I clumped in the SSDs from my previous computer. The old 128GB system drive now houses My Documents etc, the 500GB one moved over with my currently installed games.

There's some technobabble reasons why the on board graphics for the mainboard is disabled, so I plugged in my old GTX 770 to run my second screen. Which might be just as well - on my old system second screen ran off the Intel on board gfx, and my system didn't like me playing a CPU intensive game while watching YouTube or other videos.

However, the GTX 1080 is a beauty. It's nice to run games at maxed out settings again, and it's the first card that gives me constant 60 FPS in RTW2's benchmark (I use vsync in strategy games).

For some games it defaults to supersampling (i.e. rendering frames at a higher resolution, but outputting them at my current 1920x1080, which results in a higher graphical fidelity). American Truck Sim runs at 400%, Battlefield 1 at 150%. Only GTA5 is dropping a few frames if I switch supersampling on. I look forward to playing Witcher 3 on this.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Liep on November 15, 2016, 02:53:23 PM
My 2011 Dell laptop has died on me (disk failure). What's good? It should be able to handle football manager, paradox games, world of warcraft, civ games, etc.

Intrigued by the small macbook, could that run those games though?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on November 15, 2016, 03:07:19 PM
Quote from: Liep on November 15, 2016, 02:53:23 PM
My 2011 Dell laptop has died on me (disk failure). What's good? It should be able to handle football manager, paradox games, world of warcraft, civ games, etc.

Intrigued by the small macbook, could that run those games though?

The games you mentioned it should be okay, but you won't be running on maxed out graphics.

Really though if you're first concern is running games, you're probably better off getting w windows machine than having to worry about dual-booting.  If you look around you can find some machines that, while not as thin-and-light as the Macbook, are very thin and light, plus have discrete graphics to boot.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on November 15, 2016, 11:20:02 PM
Quote from: Liep on November 15, 2016, 02:53:23 PM
My 2011 Dell laptop has died on me (disk failure). What's good? It should be able to handle football manager, paradox games, world of warcraft, civ games, etc.

Intrigued by the small macbook, could that run those games though?
I had good luck with Acer laptops in the past.
I tend to avoid Lenovo, for their crap spyware they've been caught twice with, and HP because I don't find them that good for the price.

I'd say look for an Asus, Acer or Dell, depending on the prices and configuration.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Liep on November 16, 2016, 01:03:30 PM
ASUS ZenBook UX303UB looks interesting

Currently at €1275
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on November 16, 2016, 01:18:40 PM
Quote from: Liep on November 16, 2016, 01:03:30 PM
ASUS ZenBook UX303UB looks interesting

Currently at €1275

Yeah, the ZenBook is what I was thinking of earlier.

Like I said - if gaming is a top concern, I'd take that over a MacBook because of the discrete graphics / not having to dual boot.

If you primarily wanted a notebook for work / websurfing / video watching, with gaming as a side concern, I'd go with the Mac.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on November 16, 2016, 03:58:06 PM
Quote from: Berkut on November 07, 2016, 12:24:55 PM
Hmm. I did a little research, it sounds like for a current build it is probably not quite there yet price wise, at least from a "bang for your buck" standpoint.

Rather than spend an extra couple hundred to go from a SATA SSD to a PCIe SSD, you would be better off spending that money on a faster CPU or GPU...?
It's moving fast:
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/samsung-960-evo-review/1100-6445420/
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on November 17, 2016, 03:43:41 PM
Quote from: viper37 on November 16, 2016, 03:58:06 PM
Quote from: Berkut on November 07, 2016, 12:24:55 PM
Hmm. I did a little research, it sounds like for a current build it is probably not quite there yet price wise, at least from a "bang for your buck" standpoint.

Rather than spend an extra couple hundred to go from a SATA SSD to a PCIe SSD, you would be better off spending that money on a faster CPU or GPU...?
It's moving fast:
http://www.gamespot.com/articles/samsung-960-evo-review/1100-6445420/

Nice! I didn't realize the performance difference was that extreme!

Man, going from traditional HDD to SSD was a incredible boost, this is another 3x faster bump again.

At what point does this SATA type memory become fast enough that you have to start wondering if you really need system RAM at all?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Maladict on November 18, 2016, 08:10:58 AM
My 6 year old PC died on me, decided to go new instead of replacing parts.
I think this is the best I could do for my budget (999 euros), but feel free to critique it.
Not that it matters, I've already ordered :sleep:

Cooler Master Silencio 452 Midi Tower
Intel® Core™ i5-6500
Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO
MSI B150 PC
Kingston® ValueRAM® - 16 GB
Samsung 750 EVO - 250 GB - SSD
Seagate BarraCuda - 3 TB - HDD
MSI Geforce GTX 750 Ti - 2G
Cooler Master B600 ver.2 - 600 W
ASUS BW-16D1HT - DVD/Blu-Ray
Microsoft Windows 10 Home - 64 Bit
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on November 18, 2016, 09:11:45 AM
Quote from: Berkut on November 17, 2016, 03:43:41 PM
At what point does this SATA type memory become fast enough that you have to start wondering if you really need system RAM at all?
I really have no idea.  I naively think that for each increase of static memory speed (SSDs), there will be a corresponding increase in RAM speed, so there'll always be a gap.  After all, we have cache memory on CPUs and video ram that are much faster than conventional ram right now.  I suppose that once GDDR5 becomes affordable, we'll see something like that to replace DDR3/4.

And there's the whole connection thing.  SATA has a limited bus width (the speed at which the information can pass through the motherboard to reach the CPU and vice-versa), PCI-E is less limited, RAM has even less limitations, but at some point, if when we reach these limits, some kind of new interface is needed, and that's beyond my knowledge.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on November 18, 2016, 03:02:17 PM
Quote from: Maladict on November 18, 2016, 08:10:58 AM
My 6 year old PC died on me, decided to go new instead of replacing parts.
I think this is the best I could do for my budget (999 euros), but feel free to critique it.
Not that it matters, I've already ordered :sleep:

Cooler Master Silencio 452 Midi Tower
Intel® Core™ i5-6500
Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO
MSI B150 PC
Kingston® ValueRAM® - 16 GB
Samsung 750 EVO - 250 GB - SSD
Seagate BarraCuda - 3 TB - HDD
MSI Geforce GTX 750 Ti - 2G
Cooler Master B600 ver.2 - 600 W
ASUS BW-16D1HT - DVD/Blu-Ray
Microsoft Windows 10 Home - 64 Bit

I know the 750 Ti was the latest and greatest a few years ago, but you'd bet more bang for your buck getting something like a 960 or 1060.

Otherwise looks fine.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Maladict on November 18, 2016, 04:31:36 PM
Quote from: Barrister on November 18, 2016, 03:02:17 PM
Quote from: Maladict on November 18, 2016, 08:10:58 AM
My 6 year old PC died on me, decided to go new instead of replacing parts.
I think this is the best I could do for my budget (999 euros), but feel free to critique it.
Not that it matters, I've already ordered :sleep:

Cooler Master Silencio 452 Midi Tower
Intel® Core™ i5-6500
Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO
MSI B150 PC
Kingston® ValueRAM® - 16 GB
Samsung 750 EVO - 250 GB - SSD
Seagate BarraCuda - 3 TB - HDD
MSI Geforce GTX 750 Ti - 2G
Cooler Master B600 ver.2 - 600 W
ASUS BW-16D1HT - DVD/Blu-Ray
Microsoft Windows 10 Home - 64 Bit

I know the 750 Ti was the latest and greatest a few years ago, but you'd bet more bang for your buck getting something like a 960 or 1060.

Otherwise looks fine.

True, the GPU is average at best. Just realised I put this in the gaming rig thread, that's not really what I'm going for. Not going to run anything more demanding than EU4 and the like.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on November 18, 2016, 04:43:52 PM
Quote from: Maladict on November 18, 2016, 04:31:36 PM
Quote from: Barrister on November 18, 2016, 03:02:17 PM
Quote from: Maladict on November 18, 2016, 08:10:58 AM
My 6 year old PC died on me, decided to go new instead of replacing parts.
I think this is the best I could do for my budget (999 euros), but feel free to critique it.
Not that it matters, I've already ordered :sleep:

Cooler Master Silencio 452 Midi Tower
Intel® Core™ i5-6500
Cooler Master Hyper TX3 EVO
MSI B150 PC
Kingston® ValueRAM® - 16 GB
Samsung 750 EVO - 250 GB - SSD
Seagate BarraCuda - 3 TB - HDD
MSI Geforce GTX 750 Ti - 2G
Cooler Master B600 ver.2 - 600 W
ASUS BW-16D1HT - DVD/Blu-Ray
Microsoft Windows 10 Home - 64 Bit

I know the 750 Ti was the latest and greatest a few years ago, but you'd bet more bang for your buck getting something like a 960 or 1060.

Otherwise looks fine.

True, the GPU is average at best. Just realised I put this in the gaming rig thread, that's not really what I'm going for. Not going to run anything more demanding than EU4 and the like.

EU4 or Stellarix aren't exactly slouches when it comes to graphics.  I think I would still recommend spending just a tiny bit more and getting even a GTX 950 or so - it's a more modern architecture, will run cooler than the 750 Ti, and give better graphics.

Oh wait - you already ordered.  Nevermind then - it looks very nice. :)
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Maladict on November 19, 2016, 04:55:15 AM
 :D
I'll definitely consider a GPU upgrade if I feel it's underperforming.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on December 08, 2016, 02:21:45 AM
Do we know hence January the new Intel generation is coming, and how quickly I can expect the price of current CPUs to fall as a result?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on December 08, 2016, 09:56:57 AM
Quote from: Tamas on December 08, 2016, 02:21:45 AM
Do we know hence January the new Intel generation is coming, and how quickly I can expect the price of current CPUs to fall as a result?
In a year and half, barring the occasional 30$ special, the i5 6600k has been sold at roughly the same average price, 300$.  Same goes for the earlier generation, like i7 4790k.  The price hasn't moved a lot.

I wouldn't expect Intel's price to go down just because they introduce a new generation.  The older generation took many years to drop in price.

The only thing that will push it down is the price and performance of the future AMD Zen processors.  If it lives up to its hype and they can deliver the product, it might push Intel prices down a little.  Right now, they're talking Q1 2017, so don't expect any price drop until spring summer.

Right now, if you want to buy a CPU, your best bet would be to look at boxing day specials.  If you find a CPU you look there, take it, don't wait for anything hypothetical.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on December 08, 2016, 10:14:07 AM
Thanks :)

The girlfriend has handed back her laptop to her uni, and I stopped her from buying a new one - makes much more sense for me to buy the desktop in January and give her my current laptop, as I'd be buying a PC next year anyways. But this way it is much sooner then expected.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on December 08, 2016, 11:00:00 AM
I think I am going to reduce my ambitions to a i5 6600k, with 16GB of fairly decent RAM, the neutered 3GB Geforce 1060, a Samsung 250GB SSD (not the M2 kind, yet), and a fairly basic 1T HDD. But I am going to get a motherboard with an M2 slot as that shall be my first eventual upgrade, and then a better videocard eventually.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on December 08, 2016, 12:54:32 PM
If your GF needs a new laptop I wouldn't really wait on Kaby Lake processors - they're just an "optimization" of the current Skylake processors.

And yes, as Viper points out, older Intel processors don't go down in price for some time.

Your proposed rig looks good, almost identical to what I have (being a year old I have a 960 as the only difference).
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on December 27, 2016, 03:29:52 AM
Right, I have ordered it!

I know its a mix of partial overkills and compromises, but I wanted future-proofing where it matters, put a few pounds into being quieter, and save some money where my future gaming needs allow it:

Quote1   Intel Core i5 6600K - 4 Cores @ 3.5Ghz (Turbo 3.9Ghz) + 6MB CACHE - Unlocked
1   THERMALTAKE Contac 21 High Performance Ultra Silent Cooler
1   ASUS Z170 Pro Gaming - USB3.1/3.0/2.0, SATA6 + SLI/XFIRE
1   CORSAIR Vengeance LPX 8GB DDR4 3200Mhz
1   250GB SAMSUNG 750 Evo SATA3 - 6Gb/s
1   1TB SEAGATE SATA3 - 6Gb/s, 7200 RPM & 64MB Cache
1   SAMSUNG 24X DVD+/-RW Dual Layer & Dual Format
1   nVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060 3GB
1   650W PSU - 12CM Quiet Fan

Seemed like the dumbed down 3GB 1060 Geforce is quite good if you don't want to go above 1920*1080 and 60Hz refresh rate, which is fine for me.
Also found a test showing how 8GB of RAM vs 16 is a quite small performance improvement with games, so I am going to start with this one and buy a second 8GB RAM card later on to pair up this one.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on December 27, 2016, 09:28:54 PM
Looks very nice Tamas. I am really wishing for a new gaming PC...The Division is definitely pushing my current setup beyond its limits...
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on December 28, 2016, 03:17:41 PM
That i7-6700 though...drooollll....
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on December 28, 2016, 04:04:56 PM
So, I am thinking about an upgrade. Its been long enough...

I think my PS is fine, it is like 700W. My case is fine, in fact I love it, and I just got a new 500GB SSD.

So I need:

CPU
Cooler
Motherboard
Memory
GPU

Current setup:

Intel i7-920 2.66GHZ
ASUS P6T DELUXE
12 GB RAM
GTX 660


I AM THINKING:

INTEL I5-6600K
ASUS Z170
16GB DDR-2400
MSI GeForce 1060 6GB

That should come in about $750 or so...
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Ed Anger on December 28, 2016, 10:03:22 PM
I went disposable with my last computer. All in one, i5, 12gigs ram and a geforce960 with 2 gigs. Lasts 2-3 years, I'll be happy. Plus one cord instead of the rats nest with a desktop? Less work for me.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Phillip V on December 29, 2016, 02:30:58 PM
Buy one of these refurbished 18.4-inch screen gaming laptops for ~$1500.

https://us.msi.com/Laptop/GT80S-TITAN-SLI-6th-Gen-GTX-980M-SLI.html#hero-overview
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on January 10, 2017, 05:42:42 AM
Computer is pretty nice. For Total War Warhammer I had to tick the option of using unlimited video memory to allow Ultra graphics (on 1920*1080), courtesy of the dumbed down 3gig memory in my nvidia for sure. But it ran perfectly smooth in Ultra.

And also in other games I am very happy with it, feels like a proper big upgrade. And very silent. I was worried about having a desktop PC in our tiny living room, remembering my old desktops making all that noise, but this is even better than my laptop was with it's external USB fan that I had to use for gaming.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 15, 2017, 09:04:59 AM
What do you guys think of this? $1,399.00

http://store.asus.com/us/item/201603AM300000146/A17602-ASUS+ROG+G751JY-VS71%28WX%29+Intel+i7+2.6GHz+16GB+1TB+HDD+GTX+980M+4GB+17.3-inch+IPS+FHD+Windows+10+Gaming+Laptop

Processor: Intel® Core™ i7 4720HQ 2.6GHz Processor

Operating System: Windows 10 Home

Chipset: Intel® HM87 Express Chipset

Memory: 16GB DDR3L MHz SDRAM, up to 32 G

Display: 17.3" 16:9 IPS FHD (1920x1080) matte, Hardware supported G-Sync

Graphic: NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX980M with 4GB GDDR5

Storage: 1TB HDD 7200 RPM

Optical Drive: DL DVD±RW/CD-RW

Card Reader: 2 -in-1 card reader ( SD/ MMC)

Camera: 1.2MP HD Web Camera

Networking: Integrated 802.11AC
Built-in Bluetooth™ V4.0
10/100/1000/Gigabits Base T

Interface
1 x Microphone-in jack
2 x Headphone-out jack (SPDIF)
1 x VGA port/Mini D-sub 15-pin for external monitor
4 x USB 3.0 port(s)
1 x RJ45 LAN Jack for LAN insert
1 x HDMI
1 x Thunderbolt port
1 x SD card reader
1 x AC adapter plug

Audio
Built-in Speakers And Digital Array Microphone
Built-in subwoofer
MaxxAudio support

Battery
8Cells 6000 mAh

Power Adapter
Output: 19.5 V DC, 9.23 A, 230 W
Input: 100 -240 V AC, 50/60 Hz universal
3/ 2 pin compact power supply system

Dimensions: 16.4" x 12.5" x 0.9" ~ 1.7" (WxDxH) (w/ 8cell battery)

Weight: 8.4 lbs (with 8 cell battery)
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: DontSayBanana on January 15, 2017, 09:15:03 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 15, 2017, 09:04:59 AM
What do you guys think of this? $1,399.00

http://store.asus.com/us/item/201603AM300000146/A17602-ASUS+ROG+G751JY-VS71%28WX%29+Intel+i7+2.6GHz+16GB+1TB+HDD+GTX+980M+4GB+17.3-inch+IPS+FHD+Windows+10+Gaming+Laptop

Processor: Intel® Core™ i7 4720HQ 2.6GHz Processor

Operating System: Windows 10 Home

Chipset: Intel® HM87 Express Chipset

Memory: 16GB DDR3L MHz SDRAM, up to 32 G

Display: 17.3" 16:9 IPS FHD (1920x1080) matte, Hardware supported G-Sync

Graphic: NVIDIA® GeForce® GTX980M with 4GB GDDR5

Storage: 1TB HDD 7200 RPM

Optical Drive: DL DVD±RW/CD-RW

Card Reader: 2 -in-1 card reader ( SD/ MMC)

Camera: 1.2MP HD Web Camera

Networking: Integrated 802.11AC
Built-in Bluetooth™ V4.0
10/100/1000/Gigabits Base T

Interface
1 x Microphone-in jack
2 x Headphone-out jack (SPDIF)
1 x VGA port/Mini D-sub 15-pin for external monitor
4 x USB 3.0 port(s)
1 x RJ45 LAN Jack for LAN insert
1 x HDMI
1 x Thunderbolt port
1 x SD card reader
1 x AC adapter plug

Audio
Built-in Speakers And Digital Array Microphone
Built-in subwoofer
MaxxAudio support

Battery
8Cells 6000 mAh

Power Adapter
Output: 19.5 V DC, 9.23 A, 230 W
Input: 100 -240 V AC, 50/60 Hz universal
3/ 2 pin compact power supply system

Dimensions: 16.4" x 12.5" x 0.9" ~ 1.7" (WxDxH) (w/ 8cell battery)

Weight: 8.4 lbs (with 8 cell battery)

What I don't like about it is for $1400 you don't even get Win 10 Pro, which is kind of a deal-breaker if you're aware of looking to mitigate the fact that Win 10 Home forces you to all Windows Updates (you can endlessly stall the installation by hours at a time, but you can't cancel them).  Considering the Windows 10 installer itself was pushed as an update to Windows 8 and 8.1, that's no bueno to me.

Other than that, specs look decent.  And it comes with 16 GB of RAM out of the box, which is nice, since that seems to be the spec most manufacturers have continued to be stingy on.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 15, 2017, 09:37:28 AM
What's wrong with their updates?

My current rig runs Windows 7, and so does my computer at work. I don't think I've used a computer with Windows 10.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on January 15, 2017, 10:20:33 AM
$1400 and no SSD?

That is a total deal breaker.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on January 15, 2017, 10:37:20 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 15, 2017, 09:37:28 AM
What's wrong with their updates?

My current rig runs Windows 7, and so does my computer at work. I don't think I've used a computer with Windows 10.

I was surprised how smooth the transition to a W10 machine was from my previous W7 rig.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: DontSayBanana on January 15, 2017, 11:36:49 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 15, 2017, 09:37:28 AM
What's wrong with their updates?

My current rig runs Windows 7, and so does my computer at work. I don't think I've used a computer with Windows 10.

Microsoft is well-known for putting out shoddy "patches" that break more than they fix.  The three first results when searching for "botched windows update":

Dec 12, 2016 -Botched Microsoft update knocks Windows 8, 10 PCs offline – regardless of ISP (http://www.theregister.co.uk/2016/12/12/ongoing_windows_8_10_dhcp_problems_affecting_all_isps/)
Feb 17, 2016 - One of the updates shipped by the software giant as part of February 2016 Patch Tuesday seems to be pushing Windows 7 computers into a longer reboot loop (http://news.softpedia.com/news/botched-microsoft-update-kb3126446-now-causing-issues-on-windows-7-500511.shtml)
Dec 9, 2015 - Microsoft pulls botched patch KB 3114409 that triggered problems with Outlook 2010 - For the second month in a row, a Patch Tuesday Outlook update raises havoc (http://www.infoworld.com/article/3013219/microsoft-windows/microsoft-pulls-botched-patch-kb-3114409-that-triggered-problems-with-outlook-2010.html)
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 15, 2017, 03:07:14 PM
Quote from: Berkut on January 15, 2017, 10:20:33 AM
$1400 and no SSD?

That is a total deal breaker.

This better?

$1299
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834234454
    GeForce GTX 1050 Ti 4 GB GDDR5
    Intel Core i7 7th Gen 7700HQ (2.80 GHz)
    16 GB Memory 1 TB HDD 256 GB SSD
    17.3" Full HD 1920 x 1080
    16.30" x 10.70" x 1.20"-1.30" 6.60 lbs.
    DVD±R/RW
    Windows 10 Home 64-Bit

Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on January 16, 2017, 04:34:35 AM
If you want to game you will have to look for a gaming laptop. I mean, sure the CPU is awesome, SSD is big enough RAM is great, but the 1050 is the weakest of the Geforce series and you'd have trouble running any of the latest gaming offerings I assume, even though your CPU and RAM would be more than able to deal with whatever is thrown at them.

It's almost a malicious setup: you don't really need that CPU with that kind of a video card.

Take a look at Lenovo gaming laptops maybe? I was perfectly happy with mine, it was very, very nice for its price.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 08:09:08 AM
Quote from: Tamas on January 16, 2017, 04:34:35 AM
If you want to game you will have to look for a gaming laptop. I mean, sure the CPU is awesome, SSD is big enough RAM is great, but the 1050 is the weakest of the Geforce series and you'd have trouble running any of the latest gaming offerings I assume, even though your CPU and RAM would be more than able to deal with whatever is thrown at them.

It's almost a malicious setup: you don't really need that CPU with that kind of a video card.

Take a look at Lenovo gaming laptops maybe? I was perfectly happy with mine, it was very, very nice for its price.

Reviews said it was about as good as the 960, but more energy efficient and cheaper.

http://www.pcgamer.com/gtx-1050-ti-review/
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on January 16, 2017, 09:41:32 AM
https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/12/22/nvidias-geforce-gtx-1050ti-affordable-graphics-thats-actually-gaming-worthy/

QuoteSo, can the Ti win where the 460 failed and deliver good-enough gaming at an affordable price?

Immediately, let's be frank, the answer is no.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on January 16, 2017, 09:51:59 AM
Quote from: Tamas on January 16, 2017, 09:41:32 AM
https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2016/12/22/nvidias-geforce-gtx-1050ti-affordable-graphics-thats-actually-gaming-worthy/

QuoteSo, can the Ti win where the 460 failed and deliver good-enough gaming at an affordable price?

Immediately, let's be frank, the answer is no.

That is a rather bullshit summary of the review Tamas.

That "no" is SPECIFICALLY around whether the card they reviewed met the goal of reasonable gaming at a affordable price, and the card they reviewed was simply too expensive for what you got. The review overall was pretty positive about the actual gaming performance at its market spot.

Since we don't really know what the price is here, since it is bundled into the laptop, you can't really evaluate it in that manner.

The ACTUAL summary of the review you posted would seem to make a better, you know, summary of the review:

"Nvidia's GeForce GTX 1050Ti is pricey but worth a look if you favour new over second hand."

I am not advocating for or against it, just pointing out that your post does not at all reflect the review at all.

Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on January 16, 2017, 09:54:16 AM
I got one of these last year:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA8S13MM7865

I have been very, very happy with it. However, I paid a lot less than what it is listed for now. I paid $1299, and it lists for $1700.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on January 16, 2017, 09:58:17 AM
Assuming you want a 17" screen, Eluktronics has something like this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=9SIA8S14TC6003
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on January 16, 2017, 12:15:44 PM
Still, it seems like an utter waste of money to get the very best of the newest generation of CPUs, just out for, what, a week, and then put a 1050Ti next to it. Anything, apart from maybe things like Paradox games, that would even remotely start to tax the CPU would not be able to do so because the GPU would stop it long before that.

Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 12:26:33 PM
Compromises have to be made unless I want to spend 1,799.

Berkut mentioned that no SSD was a deal breaker for him. What exactly does it do, and why is it necessary?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 12:55:30 PM
The first one listed was like 8lb.  FOr that price and weight why not just get a gaming desktop?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:03:15 PM
Quote from: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 12:55:30 PM
The first one listed was like 8lb.  FOr that price and weight why not just get a gaming desktop?

I need to be able to travel with it, and a laptop, no matter how heavy is much easier to do so than a desktop.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 01:05:03 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:03:15 PM
I need to be able to travel with it,

Why?

Get the desktop, and for times when you travel get (or maybe you already have) a ultrathin notebook or a tablet.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Grey Fox on January 16, 2017, 01:17:13 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 12:26:33 PM
Compromises have to be made unless I want to spend 1,799.

Berkut mentioned that no SSD was a deal breaker for him. What exactly does it do, and why is it necessary?

Speed! SPEED!
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:19:45 PM
Quote from: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 01:05:03 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:03:15 PM
I need to be able to travel with it,

Why?

Get the desktop, and for times when you travel get (or maybe you already have) a ultrathin notebook or a tablet.

What do you mean why? If I move back to the US, or to another country, no way am I packing a desktop in a bag that's going through airport luggage. I'd have to mail it and even that would be iffy. A laptop you can bring on the plane, keep an eye on it and make sure it's not banged around.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 01:24:59 PM
Are you moving back to the US any time soon?  I kind of assumed you're a lifer at this point.  A friend of mine from university went to Korea to teach after university - he's been there 12-15 years now.  I guess there's some kind of appeal.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on January 16, 2017, 01:30:34 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:19:45 PM
Quote from: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 01:05:03 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:03:15 PM
I need to be able to travel with it,

Why?

Get the desktop, and for times when you travel get (or maybe you already have) a ultrathin notebook or a tablet.

What do you mean why? If I move back to the US, or to another country, no way am I packing a desktop in a bag that's going through airport luggage. I'd have to mail it and even that would be iffy. A laptop you can bring on the plane, keep an eye on it and make sure it's not banged around.
sell the desktop then, and buy a new one once in the US.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:38:10 PM
Quote from: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 01:24:59 PM
Are you moving back to the US any time soon?  I kind of assumed you're a lifer at this point.  A friend of mine from university went to Korea to teach after university - he's been there 12-15 years now.  I guess there's some kind of appeal.

I want to have kids, and I ain't sending them to Korean ones. Elementary would be fine if they spoke Korean, but since neither of us do, I don't expect they'll be able to speak it well. Middle and High School is absolutely out of the question, just look at Mono to see why.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:56:27 PM
Playing around with the customizer here, looks pretty good for $1,499

http://www.ibuypower.com/Store/MSI-GT72VR-Dominator-Gaming-Laptop

Display :: MSI GT72VR Dominator, 17.3" G-SYNC FHD, Anti-Glare 1920x1080 [SKL]
Processor :: Intel® Core™ i7-6700HQ Mobile Processor (4x 2.6GHz/6MB L3 Cache) [GT72]
Memory :: 16GB [8GB x 2] 2400MHz DDR4 SO-DIMM Laptop Memory - Corsair or Major Brand
Video Card :: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060 6GB GDDR5 - VR Ready [GT72]
M.2 Solid State Drive :: 256GB Intel 600P Series M.2 PCIe NVME SSD --Read: 1570MB/s; Write: 540MB/sSingle Drive
Primary Hard Drive :: 1 TB 7200rpm Super Slim Laptop Hard DriveSingle Drive
Optical Drive :: DVD Super Multi [GT72]
Media Card Reader / Writer :: Built-in SD Memory Card Reader/Writer [Laptop]
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 02:00:45 PM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:38:10 PM
Quote from: Barrister on January 16, 2017, 01:24:59 PM
Are you moving back to the US any time soon?  I kind of assumed you're a lifer at this point.  A friend of mine from university went to Korea to teach after university - he's been there 12-15 years now.  I guess there's some kind of appeal.

I want to have kids, and I ain't sending them to Korean ones. Elementary would be fine if they spoke Korean, but since neither of us do, I don't expect they'll be able to speak it well. Middle and High School is absolutely out of the question, just look at Mono to see why.

Okay - even if you knock your GF up the moment you get back, you don't have to worry about schooling them for 6-7 years.  I'll repeat - you're not coming back any time real soon.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 02:25:48 PM
I'm in America right now. If I want to bring my new pc back with me, it has to be a laptop.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on January 16, 2017, 02:48:23 PM
OK, I don't think trying to argue him out of buying a laptop based on your assumptions about his life choices is really very useful.

You want an SSD because the money spent on a SSD is, IMO, one of the best results for dollars spent you can get in a gaming PC. Any PC really. I would MUCH rather spend less on a CPU in order to afford a SSD, for example.

As far as the GPU, I agree with Tamas that spending a ton on a top end CPU while getting a low end GPU is similarly foolish. Your gaming experience will be driven by the lowest end component, so your goal should be to get all the components balanced for a given price point.

A super expensive CPU and memory will run as fast as your low end GPU.

A mid level CPU and memory will run as fast as a mid level GPU.

So why spend money on a high end CPU if you cannot afford a high end GPU?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 03:07:53 PM
So, that last build I posted was okay?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 17, 2017, 02:09:07 AM
Looks pretty good for 1,349 I think. Anyone have any experience with Eluktronics?
The Amazon and Newegg reviews look great.

https://www.amazon.com/Eluktronics-P670RP6-Premium-Gaming-Laptop/dp/B01KZ6BNUY/ref=cm_cr_arp_d_product_top?ie=UTF8

They have a version of this with a ridiculous 5 TB hardrive on their website for just $50 more.

Eluktronics P670RP6 Premium VR Ready Gaming Laptop -
Intel Core i7-6700HQ Quad Core
Windows 10 Home
6GB GDDR5 NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060
17.3" Full HD IPS
256GB Performance SSD + 1TB HDD 16GB DDR4 RAM
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on January 17, 2017, 07:32:46 AM
Just ordered the above from Amazon, upgraded for 1,549.95

Eluktronics P670RP6 Premium VR Ready Gaming Laptop -
Intel Core i7-6700HQ Quad Core
Windows 10 Home
6GB GDDR5 NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060
17.3" Full HD IPS
512GB Performance SSD + 1TB HDD 32GB DDR4 RAM
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on January 17, 2017, 07:45:43 AM
Looking good. :)

I have an 1060 neutered down to 3GB and I am very happy with it, so you should be even better off, plus with a very sweet CPU.

And Berkut is totally right about the SSD. You have no idea what a quality of life improvement it is until you try it.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Syt on January 17, 2017, 08:32:56 AM
Having games like CK2 or EU4 on SSD greatly improves loading times. Not to mention boot up if your OS is on SSD.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on January 17, 2017, 10:15:02 AM
Quote from: Tamas on January 17, 2017, 07:45:43 AM

And Berkut is totally right


Saved for posterity.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on January 17, 2017, 10:16:14 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 17, 2017, 02:09:07 AM
Looks pretty good for 1,349 I think. Anyone have any experience with Eluktronics?


The gaming laptop I bought about a year ago is Eluktronics, and I am very, very happy with it.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on January 17, 2017, 11:29:48 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:38:10 PM
Middle and High School is absolutely out of the question, just look at Mono to see why.
While he's a tad extreme, I see nothing wrong in his love of animes.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on January 17, 2017, 11:36:51 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 16, 2017, 01:56:27 PM
Playing around with the customizer here, looks pretty good for $1,499

http://www.ibuypower.com/Store/MSI-GT72VR-Dominator-Gaming-Laptop

Display :: MSI GT72VR Dominator, 17.3" G-SYNC FHD, Anti-Glare 1920x1080 [SKL]
Processor :: Intel® Core™ i7-6700HQ Mobile Processor (4x 2.6GHz/6MB L3 Cache) [GT72]
Memory :: 16GB [8GB x 2] 2400MHz DDR4 SO-DIMM Laptop Memory - Corsair or Major Brand
Video Card :: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060 6GB GDDR5 - VR Ready [GT72]
M.2 Solid State Drive :: 256GB Intel 600P Series M.2 PCIe NVME SSD --Read: 1570MB/s; Write: 540MB/sSingle Drive
Primary Hard Drive :: 1 TB 7200rpm Super Slim Laptop Hard DriveSingle Drive
Optical Drive :: DVD Super Multi [GT72]
Media Card Reader / Writer :: Built-in SD Memory Card Reader/Writer [Laptop]
if you make sure your laptop has a Thunderbolt 3 port, you could later upgrade it with an external GPU, kinda like these:
http://www.notebookreview.com/howto/how-to-upgrade-your-notebook-with-an-external-graphics-card/
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on April 19, 2017, 08:28:30 AM
So whats the latest scoop on AMD Ryzen processors?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Barrister on April 19, 2017, 09:43:48 AM
Quote from: Berkut on April 19, 2017, 08:28:30 AM
So whats the latest scoop on AMD Ryzen processors?

Better than other AMD processors have been in the last decade, but still only really competing on low price, not performance.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on April 19, 2017, 01:59:13 PM
That doesn't make any sense Beebs.

There is no "price versus performance" trade off when it comes to CPUs - for any given price, both CPU manufacturers provide a CPU that scales in performance.

So that kind of comment just doesn't make sense.

The question is whether or not at some particular price, the AMD offering performs better than the Intel offering, all externalities considered, and under what particular use case it is being used for...

Obviously the answer might change based on the price point, or based on the use case.

AMD for the last several years has NOT been able to successfully compete with intel for gaming at the typical gaming price points. Supposedly Ryzen is supposed to change that.

Poking around the internet, there doesn't seem to be much consensus yet on the answer...
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 19, 2017, 07:45:41 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 19, 2017, 01:59:13 PM
The question is whether or not at some particular price, the AMD offering performs better than the Intel offering, all externalities considered, and under what particular use case it is being used for...
There are some small problems with the current batch of AMD Ryzen 7 processors, I don't know if they are fixed in the Ryzen 5, but it's affecting gaming performance under certain circumstances.  There is a workaround by disabling some setting in your BIOS, and Microsoft has acknowledge there is a problem under Windows 10 (and not 7) and they are working on it with AMD.

So I would expect that withing 3 months, there will be some Windows update and BIOS update that will make things better as well as improvements in the next rounds of game patches.

Right now, what you need to know is that for the exact same price the AMD cpu is better.  However, if you take AMD's top CPU valued around 500$ agains Intel's top CPU valued 1000$, Intel is better by about 20%.  To some gamers, that is extremely important.

If you ask my opinion... 20% seems impressive, but you would likely not notice the difference.  At some point, even if your computer could render 300 frames a second on a 1080p game, it needs to be slowed down so your eyes can see the fluid movement, not as fast forward blur.  Where you will notice the difference is on 4k gaming on a very big screen, or a combination of screens.  When you have dual-triple GPU setups.  And even then, it's the GPU handling most of the load, not the CPU.  That means, even if you have a 1000$ CPU but pair it with a 250$ video card, your GPU will be a bottle neck in high-end gaming and you will waste your money.
However, if you buy 2 or 2 1000$ Nvidia GPU and a 1000$ intel CPU with a 800$ tri-sli motherboard, then you're on to something.  ;)


Quote
AMD for the last several years has NOT been able to successfully compete with intel for gaming at the typical gaming price points. Supposedly Ryzen is supposed to change that.
And it has.  Intel has drop the price (a little) on its mid-range CPUs and push forward the schedule for introducing its next generation of CPUs.


Quote
Poking around the internet, there doesn't seem to be much consensus yet on the answer...
Bottom line:
Everything not gaming related, AMD is the champ.
Gaming on DX11, Intel has a lead.  At a similar price-point, not much, but enough to say it's the king.
Gaming on DX12, AMD has a lead, by a bit, at a similar price-point.

I expect performances in games, especially DX12, will increase in the near future, as AMD works with game developpers to tweak the performance in Vulkan and DX12 APIs.

Ryzen 7 1800x is sold for 470$US while the Core i7-6900k is sold at 1000$.

Some benchmarks here for DX11 games:
http://www.trustedreviews.com/amd-ryzen-7-1700-review-performance-and-verdict-page-2 (http://www.trustedreviews.com/amd-ryzen-7-1700-review-performance-and-verdict-page-2)

There's one app using multi-threading (near-simultaneous use of cores) and it shows a clear advantage to AMD.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on April 19, 2017, 10:14:40 PM
I think the $250 price point is a bit more interesting. The $500 CPU price point is a pretty small slice of the gaming world.

I think the Ryzen5 1600 ($190) and Ryzen 5 1600X ($250) against the i5-7500/7600 is the much more interesting battle. And it seems that Ryzen is about even in gaming, and much better in most everything else, with reason to believe that the gaming performance will improve considerably as the systems are better optimized.

I am very intrigued.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 20, 2017, 06:13:05 AM
What about single core performance on the AMD?
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on April 20, 2017, 07:54:59 AM
Quote from: Tamas on April 20, 2017, 06:13:05 AM
What about single core performance on the AMD?

From what I've seen, it is lagging Intel, which explains part of the reason the gaming results are a little underwhelming if your gaming system is CPU constrained.

I am a fan of Toms Hardware, and I started there. They are not terribly kind to the AMDs, so I mostly stopped considering them.

But when I asked around, and looked elsewhere, there are some very differing views, and once you get into some details, I think Ryzen looks a bit more interesting. From the guru3d review, for example:

http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-ryzen-5-1500x-and-1600x-review,1.html

QuoteBefore we start-up the review, there has been a lot of chatter on the web on 1080p game performance, CCX interlink latency and bandwidth and/or clock frequencies being responsible and so on. The fact is that week after week Ryzen processor performance has been increasing thanks to BIOS updates and software optimizations. Pair it with good and reasonably fast memory (say 2933 MHz) and you will have a kick-ass value processor. Many of you have been following the news on memory latency. A new BIOS (AGESA 1004 based firmware) update ensures better performance and takes a notch of memory latency. We have been testing with this update and can confirm a drop in that memory latency and thus the overall performance. We'll show you that later on in the article.

This is a pretty in depth review of the 5 series if anyone is interested.

The Toms review seems, to me, to be overly dismissive of Ryzen.

The guru review however, seems almost like an ad for them.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on April 20, 2017, 08:04:32 AM
Tamas, here are the results of the Guru 3d single core perf test:

http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-ryzen-5-1500x-and-1600x-review,10.html (http://www.guru3d.com/articles-pages/amd-ryzen-5-1500x-and-1600x-review,10.html)
(https://languish.org/forums/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.guru3d.com%2Findex.php%3Fct%3Darticles%26amp%3Baction-file%26amp%3Bid%3D30418&hash=771038f277b596e697472eb590c29dd4fe6db6f3)

The Ryzen 1600X does quite nicely against its price point competitor, the i5-7600.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 20, 2017, 11:53:29 AM
Unless you limit yourself to AAA action titles I think you should treat single core performance as critical. Paradox games for example are very CPU-heavy and they only use a single core.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on April 20, 2017, 12:02:03 PM
I don't think Paradox games will tax any modern PC, regardless of which CPU you pick.

And take a look at the benchmarks - even in single CPU tests, the Ryzen is doing just fine.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 20, 2017, 03:11:28 PM
Quote from: Tamas on April 20, 2017, 11:53:29 AM
Unless you limit yourself to AAA action titles I think you should treat single core performance as critical. Paradox games for example are very CPU-heavy and they only use a single core.
If you are currently owning an older generation Intel and want to upgrade, you will have to change:
- the motherboard
- the memory
- the CPU (obviously!)

Considering this the minium investment, you're in for 1000$, at least.  Since you would likely also buy/change a SSD, upgrade the hard drive, likely buy a newer video card, we're talking something in the range of 2000$.

Paradox new engine, for their future games, is a 64 bit engine that supports DX12 and Vulkan (it's fully multi-threaded).

Then, if you think about it, does it makes sense to spend 2000$ to play today's game that you play very well on your current hardware, or do you upgrade for the future?

If what you want is just a bit more speed for today's game and don't care about what happens next year, ok, Intel is of much better value to you.
If you think of the future in game developments, as more&more titles come supporting multi-threading and more memory use (64 bit, DX12 and Vulkan), then I think it's wise to consider AMD as a possible solution instead of rejecting it out of hands.

Galactic Civilizations 3 is a game that could compare to EU4 in terms of scope. It's a turn-based strategy game, not a AAA action title.  It's a 64 bit engine that supports multi-threading.  The more cores you have, the faster it gets.  In such a game, you would likely see AMD coming ahead of Intel.

If you want a taste of what is coming in terms of improvement, take a look at Ashes of the Singularity:
http://www.tweaktown.com/news/56937/amd-tweaks-ryzen-30-improvement-ashes-benchmark/index.html (http://www.tweaktown.com/news/56937/amd-tweaks-ryzen-30-improvement-ashes-benchmark/index.html)
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on April 20, 2017, 03:40:05 PM
Well, I am looking at a complete system overhaul. I think the only thing I can save is my case and power supply.

If I go AMD, I am thinking:

Processor:
Ryzen 1600X  250
MB
Some flavor of B350: 125
Memory
16GB/3000: 120
GPU
480X of some kind: 200


I am looking at a budge definitely under $1000.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on April 21, 2017, 05:00:32 AM
Well, I admit that I would be very reluctant to buy an AMD rig, on purely subjective matters as well. In my long history of using and owning PCs, I have only had one AMD CPU and it was the machine I had most problems with. Then their Radeon video cards are also usually the one with driver problems with games, so the whole company just rubs me the wrong way.

Good luck with it Berkut, though, sounds like it should be a good investment, if it works.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Berkut on April 21, 2017, 07:21:59 AM
I had an AMD machine many years ago, and it was perfectly fine.

Not any better than an Intel once bought or anything (but it was cheaper for the power then).

I haven't had one in forever, because they've largely failed to compete for many years now.

I would like to buy one for one tangible reason, and one less tangible -

1. Because I think for a given price, I can get more performance, and
2. Because the market really needs a viable and competitive alternative to Intel.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 21, 2017, 10:45:10 PM
Quote from: Tamas on April 21, 2017, 05:00:32 AM
Then their Radeon video cards are also usually the one with driver problems with games, so the whole company just rubs me the wrong way.
That's not really true.  Depending on the games, Nvidia can be very buggy.  Especially for SLI configurations.  And DX12 performance just isn't there yet with Nvidia.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: viper37 on April 21, 2017, 10:50:37 PM
Quote from: Berkut on April 20, 2017, 03:40:05 PM
Some flavor of B350: 125
I'd say go for the X370. You have more customization options and better overclocking capabalities, as well as dual PCI-E slots.

Something like this, would fit your budget (https://pcpartpicker.com/product/kZKhP6/asrock-fatal1ty-x370-gaming-k4-atx-am4-motherboard-fatal1ty-x370-gaming-k4)

I just bought a MSI B350 Gaming pro for the office (it was the cheapest one available for a Ryzen, all Asrock seemed b.o. in Canada) and I regret my purchase.  I really don't like this board.  I don't know if it's MIS, Amibios or the chipset, but there's something wrong with this.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: jimmy olsen on December 05, 2018, 08:15:34 AM
Quote from: jimmy olsen on January 17, 2017, 07:32:46 AM
Just ordered the above from Amazon, upgraded for 1,549.95

Eluktronics P670RP6 Premium VR Ready Gaming Laptop -
Intel Core i7-6700HQ Quad Core
Windows 10 Home
6GB GDDR5 NVIDIA GeForce GTX 1060
17.3" Full HD IPS
512GB Performance SSD + 1TB HDD 32GB DDR4 RAM

Lol, fuck these guys a thousand times over with barbed wire.

Had some errors that made me suspect the hard drive was failing. Took it to get it checked it out and turns out the fucking main board is dying. Says he suspects it was refurbished, not new when I bought it.
Title: Re: I want a new gaming rig
Post by: Tamas on December 11, 2018, 07:19:49 AM
Ouch. And it doesn't seem that cheap either.