Author Topic: U.S. Constitutional Convention - nonsense or real option?  (Read 1275 times)

dps

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Re: U.S. Constitutional Convention - nonsense or real option?
« Reply #60 on: August 14, 2018, 02:12:19 am »
At any rate, I'm opposed to a new Constitutional Convention unless I get to write the new Constitution personally.

Though to be honest, there's not much I'd change.  The Founding Fathers actually did a pretty good job, IMO.

Scipio

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Re: U.S. Constitutional Convention - nonsense or real option?
« Reply #61 on: August 14, 2018, 08:08:28 am »
It's ridiculous fearmongering.  Our Constitution is impossible to change without overwhelming agreement.

As Tim pointed out, it doesn't require overwhelming agreement. It simply requires enough institutional control: a convention can be called by 2/3 of the states - and since that would be entering uncharted territory, even the means of ratification proposed by that Convention could diverge from the current rule (3/4 of the states). And in case of conflict over *that*, it is unclear where the adjudication would be coming from - and I would neither be too sure of the Supreme Court, nor of a meeting of reasonable minds at this point.

These right-wing groups calling for the convention have been preparing with material, lobbyists, talking points, and super pacs for years, and they are patient. Considering how so many things that were unthinkable only a few years back are now very much thinkable, and a reality at that, I think brushing that aside as ridiculous is perhaps premature, and unwise.

Ratification of anything coming out of a such a convention would require approval by 3/4 of both the House and the Senate. Not the states. This proposed convention is about proposing an amendment to the Constitution, after all.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2018, 08:10:45 am by Scipio »
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Razgovory

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Re: U.S. Constitutional Convention - nonsense or real option?
« Reply #62 on: August 14, 2018, 11:41:40 am »
Also, I seem to have missed the Marxist takeover of Western Europe.

Most people regard Marxism as a failed ideology. But I guess these Conservatives see it as a foundation to one of the most prosperous regions of the world. Maybe I should reconsider Marxism, it must work after all.


Man, I thought we won the Cold War
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

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crazy canuck

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Re: U.S. Constitutional Convention - nonsense or real option?
« Reply #63 on: August 14, 2018, 11:47:48 am »
Also, I seem to have missed the Marxist takeover of Western Europe.

Most people regard Marxism as a failed ideology. But I guess these Conservatives see it as a foundation to one of the most prosperous regions of the world. Maybe I should reconsider Marxism, it must work after all.


Man, I thought we won the Cold War

Trumpism, like all far right ideologies, requires an enemy.  Since Trump insists on treating Russia as a friend, the need to fabricate enemies is apparent.

Valmy

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Re: U.S. Constitutional Convention - nonsense or real option?
« Reply #64 on: August 14, 2018, 12:27:27 pm »
Ratification of anything coming out of a such a convention would require approval by 3/4 of both the House and the Senate. Not the states. This proposed convention is about proposing an amendment to the Constitution, after all.

I thought the whole point of this convention by the States was to bypass Congress :hmm:
If we can hit that bull's-eye, the rest of the dominoes will fall like a house of cards. Checkmate!

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grumbler

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Re: U.S. Constitutional Convention - nonsense or real option?
« Reply #65 on: August 14, 2018, 12:33:33 pm »
Ratification of anything coming out of a such a convention would require approval by 3/4 of both the House and the Senate. Not the states. This proposed convention is about proposing an amendment to the Constitution, after all.

I thought the whole point of this convention by the States was to bypass Congress :hmm:

That is correct.  Article V says that amendments "shall be valid to all intents and purposes, as part of this Constitution, when ratified by the legislatures of three fourths of the several states, or by conventions in three fourths thereof."  Congress is only involved in the proposal of amendments or the convening of a convention.

But, of course, article V itself could be changed.  The last time the US did a CC, the method of ratifying the changes it made was the method contained in the changes.
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Razgovory

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Re: U.S. Constitutional Convention - nonsense or real option?
« Reply #66 on: August 14, 2018, 01:20:37 pm »
Also, I seem to have missed the Marxist takeover of Western Europe.

Most people regard Marxism as a failed ideology. But I guess these Conservatives see it as a foundation to one of the most prosperous regions of the world. Maybe I should reconsider Marxism, it must work after all.


Man, I thought we won the Cold War

Trumpism, like all far right ideologies, requires an enemy.  Since Trump insists on treating Russia as a friend, the need to fabricate enemies is apparent.

Man, I got thinking what it would be like if Trump was President in the 1980's.


Quote
We welcome change and openness; for we believe that freedom and security go together, that the advance of human liberty can only strengthen the cause of world peace. There is one sign the Europeans can make that would be unmistakable, that would advance dramatically the cause of freedom and peace. Chancellor Kohl, if you seek peace, if you seek prosperity for the Germany and Western Europe, if you seek liberalization, come here to this gate. Mr. Kohl, open this gate. Mr. Kohl, tear down this wall!
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

"I love how Raz just becomes the caricature for exactly what he is claiming doesn't actually exist...and he doesn't even know it! He is 100% oblivious to the irony of his own statements." - Berkut telling a lie.

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017