What does a TRUMP presidency look like?

Started by FunkMonk, November 08, 2016, 11:02:57 PM

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Tonitrus

#17805
April 21, 2018, 10:57:25 AM
Trump has a Riefenstahlian tinge.

grumbler

#17806
April 21, 2018, 06:11:44 PM
Quote from: DGuller on April 21, 2018, 09:26:03 AM
I'm sorry that you and your ilk failed to spot the danger in time, patting yourself on the back for not being hysterical like those who have.  I'm sorry for our country first and foremost.  Please don't make the next mistake fashionable among those who orgasm over their perceived rationality, and claim that fascism begins and ends with Trump.

Sorry, but who is my "ilk" and what danger did "we" fail to spot in time?  Your boasted of your hyper-partisanship here and dismissed moderation here long before Trump was a candidate.  Now that your brand of politics has produced the predictable toxic reaction, you squirm and blame the innocent to avoid confronting the fact that you are just the flip side of the fascist coin.  I don't really blame you, though.  The emotional appeal of partisanship seems very alluring to the anti-intellectuals on both sides. 
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

grumbler

#17807
April 21, 2018, 06:14:15 PM
Quote from: dps on April 21, 2018, 10:03:09 AM
The "F" word I'd most associate with Trump isn't "fascist", it's "fool".  Calling him a fascist gives him too much credit--it assumes that he actually has something remotely resembling a political philosophy.  I'd say that he shares the disdain for civil rights often found on both the far right and far left, but you probably have to have at least some understanding of what a concept is in order for it to be accurately stated that you have disdain for it.

Agreed. Trump is a grifter, and grifters are good at pretending to be what people want them to be, without having the character to actually be much of anything at all.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

DGuller

#17808
April 21, 2018, 06:41:13 PM Last Edit: April 21, 2018, 06:43:53 PM by DGuller
Quote from: grumbler on April 21, 2018, 06:11:44 PM
Sorry, but who is my "ilk" and what danger did "we" fail to spot in time?
The fact that conservatives were becoming authoritarian and anti-democratic over the last several decades, and that the "partisanship" was a reaction to that.  Just because two people are fighting doesn't mean that both of them were equally belligerent before the fists started flying.
QuoteYour boasted of your hyper-partisanship here and dismissed moderation here long before Trump was a candidate.
Yes, thank you.  As I said, authoritarianism was on the rise long before Trump, so it would've been stupid to be moderate in response to that, unless I was more concerned with appearances than with being on the right side of history.  Moderation in the face of extremism is a sin, not a virtue.
QuoteThe emotional appeal of partisanship seems very alluring to the anti-intellectuals on both sides.
:jaron:

Razgovory

#17809
April 21, 2018, 07:17:45 PM
Quote from: grumbler on April 21, 2018, 06:11:44 PM


Sorry, but who is my "ilk" and what danger did "we" fail to spot in time?  Your boasted of your hyper-partisanship here and dismissed moderation here long before Trump was a candidate.  Now that your brand of politics has produced the predictable toxic reaction, you squirm and blame the innocent to avoid confronting the fact that you are just the flip side of the fascist coin.  I don't really blame you, though.  The emotional appeal of partisanship seems very alluring to the anti-intellectuals on both sides.


Libertarians.  Of course, libertarians may have been very poor at spotting the threat because so many were complicit in it.  Much of the Alt-Right comes from the Libertarian/Ancap/Minarchist movements.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Ed Anger

#17810
April 21, 2018, 07:38:16 PM
Taxation is Theft
Stay Alive...Let the Man Drive

grumbler

#17811
April 21, 2018, 08:46:12 PM
Quote from: DGuller on April 21, 2018, 06:41:13 PM
The fact that conservatives were becoming authoritarian and anti-democratic over the last several decades, and that the "partisanship" was a reaction to that.  Just because two people are fighting doesn't mean that both of them were equally belligerent before the fists started flying.
Given that I was one of the most strident voices here against authoritarianism and partisanship (and you were just against the authoritarianism and partisanship of your opponents) this is rich.  You are blind to the fact that your 'side" is just the mirror-image of the other side, and that would be sad if you didn't wallow in it.  As it is, it is merely despicable.

QuoteYes, thank you.  As I said, authoritarianism was on the rise long before Trump, so it would've been stupid to be moderate in response to that, unless I was more concerned with appearances than with being on the right side of history.  Moderation in the face of extremism is a sin, not a virtue.
That's what is so funny; that you cannot see that authoritarianism isn't a matter of which side you are on, it is a matter of how much you will tolerate the suppression of ideas you don't like.  You are proud of your own authoritarianism, and thank me for mentioning it, but don't see that you are just the mirror-image of those you despise.  I am far enough back from the emotions to despise you both.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

PDH

#17812
April 21, 2018, 10:02:22 PM
The first rule of life - Don't be a douchebag.  Trump has failed this, and so he fails.
I have come to believe that the whole world is an enigma, a harmless enigma that is made terrible by our own mad attempt to interpret it as though it had an underlying truth.
-Umberto Eco

-------
"I'm pretty sure my level of depression has nothing to do with how much of a fucking asshole you are."

-CdM

Eddie Teach

#17813
April 22, 2018, 12:03:27 AM
I don't despise anyone.   :)
To sleep, perchance to dream. But in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

dps

#17814
April 22, 2018, 01:38:19 AM
Quote from: grumbler on April 21, 2018, 08:46:12 PM
authoritarianism isn't a matter of which side you are on, it is a matter of how much you will tolerate the suppression of ideas you don't like.

Ooh, that's well put.

Berkut

#17815
April 22, 2018, 01:32:46 PM
Quote from: grumbler on April 21, 2018, 08:46:12 PM
authoritarianism isn't a matter of which side you are on, it is a matter of how much you will tolerate the suppression of ideas you don't like.

Here, here.
"If you think this has a happy ending, then you haven't been paying attention."

select * from users where clue > 0
0 rows returned

Habbaku

#17816
April 22, 2018, 01:54:28 PM
Where, where?
The medievals were only too right in taking nolo episcopari as the best reason a man could give to others for making him a bishop. Give me a king whose chief interest in life is stamps, railways, or race-horses; and who has the power to sack his Vizier (or whatever you care to call him) if he does not like the cut of his trousers.

Government is an abstract noun meaning the art and process of governing and it should be an offence to write it with a capital G or so as to refer to people.
-J. R. R. Tolkien

grumbler

#17817
April 22, 2018, 02:19:52 PM
There, there.
The future is all around us, waiting, in moments of transition, to be born in moments of revelation. No one knows the shape of that future or where it will take us. We know only that it is always born in pain.   -G'Kar

Bayraktar!

Razgovory

#17818
April 22, 2018, 03:56:47 PM
Grumbler was blaming both sides since at least 1939.
I've given it serious thought. I must scorn the ways of my family, and seek a Japanese woman to yield me my progeny. He shall live in the lands of the east, and be well tutored in his sacred trust to weave the best traditions of Japan and the Sacred South together, until such time as he (or, indeed his house, which will periodically require infusion of both Southern and Japanese bloodlines of note) can deliver to the South it's independence, either in this world or in space.  -Lettow April of 2011

Raz is right. -MadImmortalMan March of 2017

Valmy

#17819
April 22, 2018, 04:00:31 PM
Hey from the Germans' perspective it was Poland that was evil.
Quote"This is a Russian warship. I propose you lay down arms and surrender to avoid bloodshed & unnecessary victims. Otherwise, you'll be bombed."

Zmiinyi defenders: "Russian warship, go fuck yourself."
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